What's you definition of a rebuild?

[kschreck]

As we all know, AS famously said, "this isn't a rebuild."  AS's job is to do the best he can to develop the players he has and to win as much as possible, with the hand he's been dealt. I understand what he said and why he said it.  That said, some of the facts are:

• The GM, many in the FO and the coaching staff have been turned over
• Most of the veterans have been released or traded
• Large contracts have been dumped to free up cap space
• Draft picks have and are being accumulated
• While the younger core is being put together, short term, team-friendly contracts have been made to fill out the roster

 

These are all fundamentals of a rebuild.  I'd go as far as to say there isn't an aspect of a rebuild that we haven't checked off.  While this seems obvious to me, there are still some that keep pointing back to AS's comments about rebuilding.  Which, I'd argue were due to the fact that he's being tasked with fielding a competitive team and that's what he needed to say.  

With all of this said, knowing it's a rebuild, knowing the team of the future is not in place yet, knowing that in most cases it takes time to build culture, identity, chemistry, a roster, etc...the sentiment that next year will be a make or break year for AS is bizarre to me.  Yes the NFL expects results but we've seen what it looks like when teams get impatient and short change the process.  Short of any major red flags that may come out about AS and TF, I believe they deserve the next two seasons to follow through with their plans and prove they've made the right decisions.

This is a full rebuild including an overhaul of the culture.  Not being willing to give them the proper time to put it all together would potentially set the franchise back even further.  

Just my two cents, fire away.

[Killing Floor]

Until there’s a gut wrenching confessional every time we lose in spectacular fashion a game we should win, heck, until there is a game we should win, we haven’t had a rebuild. 
Losing sucks. There are no shortcuts. 
 

A rebuild is like the boring part of a road trip. It is a lot longer than you remember. 
 

I’ve believed for a long time we will never be ready to accept a championship until all the toxin of complacency is purged from our roster. There are still a couple left. When you get your butt kicked and you don’t show up the next week with a chip on your shoulder, that’s when you know the culture is still broken. 
 

We’re still the Falcons. We’re still complacent. The players, the coaches, the management. Nobody gave 2 spits about the giveaway to Saints or spotting Rams, Bucs, and Bengals 21 points before putting on the work boots. 
 

I’m not convinced there are more than 4-5 players on our roster who will be here when we really finish rebuilding. 
Right now it’s a hive of complacent losers. 
 

I’m sick to my stomach watching smug Coach Smith bash the media for asking the right questions. Get above .500 or get gone.  He’s the captain of our toxic losing culture. 
 

So the answer of your question, a rebuild looks like 46 different players and 8 new coaches. Light it on fire. 

[thanat0s]

The moment you get rid of your HOF QB, you're almost definitely in a rebuild. 

[Tribal Chief]

Just now, thanat0s said:

The moment you get rid of your HOF QB, you're almost definitely in a rebuild. 

Given the way the franchise was headed, this rebuild started while the "HOF" QB was around. Trading him only solidified it

[thanat0s]

8 minutes ago, Killing Floor said:

Get above .500 or get gone.

At some point, and it'll be the start of 2023 for sure, he's going to have to make this happen, or he'll be on the street. Teams have itchy trigger fingers anymore. 

Silly speculation: It'd make me nauseous at the idea, but it'd make me chuckle between bouts of vomit if they hired Payton. The city of New Orleans might just slide off into the gulf and float away, never to be seen again. 🤣

[SwampyMux12]

4 minutes ago, thanat0s said:

At some point, and it'll be the start of 2023 for sure, he's going to have to make this happen, or he'll be on the street. Teams have itchy trigger fingers anymore. 

Silly speculation: It'd make me nauseous at the idea, but it'd make me chuckle between bouts of vomit if they hired Payton. The city of New Orleans might just slide off into the gulf and float away, never to be seen again. 🤣

Now that would be interesting, lol... Worth the price of admission 🤣

[thanat0s]

40 minutes ago, kschreck said:

As we all know, AS famously said, "this isn't a rebuild."  AS's job is to do the best he can to develop the players he has and to win as much as possible, with the hand he's been dealt. I understand what he said and why he said it.  That said, some of the facts are:

• The GM, many in the FO and the coaching staff have been turned over
• Most of the veterans have been released or traded
• Large contracts have been dumped to free up cap space
• Draft picks have and are being accumulated
• While the younger core is being put together, short term, team-friendly contracts have been made to fill out the roster

 

These are all fundamentals of a rebuild.  I'd go as far as to say there isn't an aspect of a rebuild that we haven't checked off.  While this seems obvious to me, there are still some that keep pointing back to AS's comments about rebuilding.  Which, I'd argue were due to the fact that he's being tasked with fielding a competitive team and that's what he needed to say.  

With all of this said, knowing it's a rebuild, knowing the team of the future is not in place yet, knowing that in most cases it takes time to build culture, identity, chemistry, a roster, etc...the sentiment that next year will be a make or break year for AS is bizarre to me.  Yes the NFL expects results but we've seen what it looks like when teams get impatient and short change the process.  Short of any major red flags that may come out about AS and TF, I believe they deserve the next two seasons to follow through with their plans and prove they've made the right decisions.

This is a full rebuild including an overhaul of the culture.  Not being willing to give them the proper time to put it all together would potentially set the franchise back even further.  

Just my two cents, fire away.

I think his contract length tells you they hedged their bets. But yes, it takes time to rebuild a team from near expansion territory. He got a pass in these 2 years, but this offseason, he and TF will be able to build the team they want. At that point, there are no excuses for not fielding a winning team for some years. 

I believe the fans and AB very certainly expect this team to be fighting for SBs in 23 and beyond, or CAS will be yet another promising head coach who didn't pan out. 

[Herr Doktor]

I prefer retooling or reconfiguring.  No team will use the term rebuild, at least not pro teams, to describe their transition because they have to get folks to come to the games, buy hotdogs, buy jerseys etc.  If Arthur Blank had come on national television with Font and AS and said "We're blowing this ish up, we are gonna suck for three years, but buy season tickets" the world would have laughed at him.  

However, retooling and being competitive, or reconfiguring our scheme sets and needed personnel changes sounds like movement within a framework that still may get azzes in the stands.

[since68andcounting]

They’re spinning it man. Of course they’re rebuilding. That’s what you do with teams way over the cap and 70% of it in aging “skill position” players.
 

The talk that we weren’t rebuilding is mostly on Blank. He seemed to believe the myth (like so many here) that we were still 1-2 players away with Ryan on the roster.

[Lornoth]

14 minutes ago, Tribal Chief said:

Given the way the franchise was headed, this rebuild started while the "HOF" QB was around. Trading him only solidified it

Except we couldn't rebuild anything because of his (and others') massive cap hits. In spirit it started years ago but this coming offseason is the first time we'll actually be able to build much of anything.

[marvinthemartian]

56 minutes ago, kschreck said:

As we all know, AS famously said, "this isn't a rebuild."  AS's job is to do the best he can to develop the players he has and to win as much as possible, with the hand he's been dealt. I understand what he said and why he said it.  That said, some of the facts are:

• The GM, many in the FO and the coaching staff have been turned over
• Most of the veterans have been released or traded
• Large contracts have been dumped to free up cap space
• Draft picks have and are being accumulated
• While the younger core is being put together, short term, team-friendly contracts have been made to fill out the roster

 

These are all fundamentals of a rebuild.  I'd go as far as to say there isn't an aspect of a rebuild that we haven't checked off.  While this seems obvious to me, there are still some that keep pointing back to AS's comments about rebuilding.  Which, I'd argue were due to the fact that he's being tasked with fielding a competitive team and that's what he needed to say.  

With all of this said, knowing it's a rebuild, knowing the team of the future is not in place yet, knowing that in most cases it takes time to build culture, identity, chemistry, a roster, etc...the sentiment that next year will be a make or break year for AS is bizarre to me.  Yes the NFL expects results but we've seen what it looks like when teams get impatient and short change the process.  Short of any major red flags that may come out about AS and TF, I believe they deserve the next two seasons to follow through with their plans and prove they've made the right decisions.

This is a full rebuild including an overhaul of the culture.  Not being willing to give them the proper time to put it all together would potentially set the franchise back even further.  

Just my two cents, fire away.

If this is indeed a total rebuild/overhaul then I commend the coaches and front office for putting a competitive and entertaining to watch team on the field while rebuilding it. Well done so far. Carry on. 

[Sun Tzu 7]

The Colts have taken what I thought was a rebuild and completely blown it out of the water.

Bench the QB for the rookie 5th round back-up then fire everyone and replace them with a guy on TV that used to play for the team years ago.... who has High School coaching experience because that's close to the NFL.

Can you imagine if after they fired Quinn they replaced him with Brian Finneran? That meltdown would have been EPIC.

[Tribal Chief]

9 minutes ago, Lornoth said:

Except we couldn't rebuild anything because of his (and others') massive cap hits. In spirit it started years ago but this coming offseason is the first time we'll actually be able to build much of anything.

Which is why I said trading him solidified it

[Sun Tzu 7]

27 minutes ago, thanat0s said:

The moment you get rid of your HOF QB, you're almost definitely in a rebuild. 

Yeah that's the classic definition.

You get rid of your franchise QB then you're in a rebuild until you start winning.

[Killing Floor]

28 minutes ago, thanat0s said:

At some point, and it'll be the start of 2023 for sure, he's going to have to make this happen, or he'll be on the street. Teams have itchy trigger fingers anymore. 

Silly speculation: It'd make me nauseous at the idea, but it'd make me chuckle between bouts of vomit if they hired Payton. The city of New Orleans might just slide off into the gulf and float away, never to be seen again. 🤣

First thing I thought during the Manning cast interview last night. 
He’s got baggage but he knows how to win. Saints may have sucked but they won a lot with him at the helm. 
But Ewww

[Summerhill]

The Falcons are in a rebuild. They were in a rebuild the moment they hired Font and AS. 

All rebuilds are different and progress at different rates. There is no set expectation where AS has to win X games this season or Y games in 2023. 

That said, there is nothing more important than showing you know what you're doing with the QB position. Lots of good coaches get fired when they don't play it right with the QB position. 

As it stands right now, AS is on his second QB, though only the first one he picked. That QB is not the solution. Best case scenario AS's second QB will be the solution. If that QB is not the solution, you generally only get one more chance. Then you have to show you have your guy. Even if you're a good coach you don't get to keep going 8-8 every season with a new QB. 

[Summerhill]

1 hour ago, kschreck said:

• Draft picks have and are being accumulated

Forfeited two compensatory picks for Marcus Mariota and Lorenzo Carter. 

[Killing Floor]

9 minutes ago, Sun Tzu 7 said:

guy on TV that used to play for the team years ago.... who has High School coaching experience because that's close to the NFL.

Gotta admit he’s got a cool sports name. 
 

[Freddies 3rd Cuz]

36 minutes ago, Killing Floor said:

Until there’s a gut wrenching confessional every time we lose in spectacular fashion a game we should win, heck, until there is a game we should win, we haven’t had a rebuild. 
Losing sucks. There are no shortcuts. 
 

A rebuild is like the boring part of a road trip. It is a lot longer than you remember. 
 

I’ve believed for a long time we will never be ready to accept a championship until all the toxin of complacency is purged from our roster. There are still a couple left. When you get your butt kicked and you don’t show up the next week with a chip on your shoulder, that’s when you know the culture is still broken. 
 

We’re still the Falcons. We’re still complacent. The players, the coaches, the management. Nobody gave 2 spits about the giveaway to Saints or spotting Rams, Bucs, and Bengals 21 points before putting on the work boots. 
 

I’m not convinced there are more than 4-5 players on our roster who will be here when we really finish rebuilding. 
Right now it’s a hive of complacent losers. 
 

I’m sick to my stomach watching smug Coach Smith bash the media for asking the right questions. Get above .500 or get gone.  He’s the captain of our toxic losing culture. 
 

So the answer of your question, a rebuild looks like 46 different players and 8 new coaches. Light it on fire. 

I don’t understand your hate for coach Smith. Talking about him bashing the media. You do a good job of bashing Smith deserved or not. 
One would have to be blind not to see all the good things AS and TF are doing. It’s a process and the TD and DQ mess will take time to clean up.

I hope you can find something positive to say about Smith and Mariota in the future. It seems to really be eating at you. 

IDT anybody that really understands football would expect much more out of a team with a depleted roster and in cap hail. 
My thoughts are we have good one that hopefully ends up a great one. 
We all want to win NOW, but it’s not happening until better players are acquired starting with a pass rush and franchise QB. 
 

BTW - obviously AS has a tough task trying to win now and find out if Ridder’s the guy. The locker room loves Mariota and AS must feel he’s gives us the best chance to win a PO spot. Like I said, tough task and can’t please everybody. Just saying! 
 

I can’t wait to hear your positives vibes bro….

[JDaveG]

I get why they don't like that word, and the truth is I think for most fans "rebuild" implies "we aren't trying to win while we restock the cupboard." 

So we're in a rebuild in the sense that we shed cap and got rid of a lot of our highest paid players who were not leading us to winning seasons.  And we're not "winning" in the sense that we're 4-5, but we're winning more than we ought to with such a bare roster.  I think the point Smith and Fontenot were making is just this -- we aren't tanking, we don't expect to lose, and we are going to do our best to field a winning team with all the attendant issues involving the cap and lack of talent throughout the roster, but we also aren't going to keep all our highest paid assets because we aren't winning with them so it's time to move on and begin to rebuild the roster so we can win without them.

[Freddies 3rd Cuz]

7 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

I get why they don't like that word, and the truth is I think for most fans "rebuild" implies "we aren't trying to win while we restock the cupboard." 

So we're in a rebuild in the sense that we shed cap and got rid of a lot of our highest paid players who were not leading us to winning seasons.  And we're not "winning" in the sense that we're 4-5, but we're winning more than we ought to with such a bare roster.  I think the point Smith and Fontenot were making is just this -- we aren't tanking, we don't expect to lose, and we are going to do our best to field a winning team with all the attendant issues involving the cap and lack of talent throughout the roster, but we also aren't going to keep all our highest paid assets because we aren't winning with them so it's time to move on and begin to rebuild the roster so we can win without them.

Well said JDave and OP

[OrthoPTSD]

Very concerned about the rebuild of the interior DL. Non existent.

[Herr Doktor]

2 minutes ago, OrthoPTSD said:

Very concerned about the rebuild of the interior DL. Non existent.

Wait till FA and the draft.  Got to think we go defense heavy in both.  

[JDaveG]

2 minutes ago, OrthoPTSD said:

Very concerned about the rebuild of the interior DL. Non existent.

In the sense that we could use a better NT, I'd agree.  I know Graham has been PNGd by most of the board after Sunday, but he's been solid, and of course Grady is too.  I consider both of them to be "interior" in our scheme.  When we run 3-4 that's the line and the linebackers play the edges, and when we run 4-3 they are usually inside.  I don't think that's a bad upgrade given what they had to work with in terms of cap space.  

You could argue they should spend more draft capital there, but Graham is a 5th rounder (as is Grady), and so really they just need to have a NT slide to them at one of those spots.  I do think the draft philosophy sort of hampers a "rebuild" via the draft, so we have to wait for some FA dollars to really boost that spot.  They also tried this offseason with Goldman but he decided to retire.

I don't think they're ignoring it.  I just think they're going to really hit it in 2023 when they have money to spend.

[Summerhill]

2 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

In the sense that we could use a better NT, I'd agree.  I know Graham has been PNGd by most of the board after Sunday, but he's been solid, and of course Grady is too.  I consider both of them to be "interior" in our scheme.  When we run 3-4 that's the line and the linebackers play the edges, and when we run 4-3 they are usually inside.  I don't think that's a bad upgrade given what they had to work with in terms of cap space.  

You could argue they should spend more draft capital there, but Graham is a 5th rounder (as is Grady), and so really they just need to have a NT slide to them at one of those spots.  I do think the draft philosophy sort of hampers a "rebuild" via the draft, so we have to wait for some FA dollars to really boost that spot.  They also tried this offseason with Goldman but he decided to retire.

I don't think they're ignoring it.  I just think they're going to really hit it in 2023 when they have money to spend.

Agreed. I don't see interior DL being any kind of weakness.