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Dean Pees cleaning out DQ's Historic Trash Slow starter Defense could be the most important part of 2021 season.


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2 hours ago, dirtybirds233 said:

Like when Campbell said 'we didn't take them seriously' in reference to the 2018 loss to the Browns. That falls on the HC right there. 

As I said in another thread, Quinn just wanted to be buddies with the players which led to a complete lack of discipline. Players would f-up and Quinn would be waiting on the sideline to fist bump them. 

I'm going to chalk this up to optimism in a new regime because this board was saying that Mike Smith was too hard on his players and that they were scared to make a mistake and were praising Quinn for having a more loose coaching style.  Now, the board is saying the team needs more discipline.

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18 minutes ago, ltstorm2 said:

I'm going to chalk this up to optimism in a new regime because this board was saying that Mike Smith was too hard on his players and that they were scared to make a mistake and were praising Quinn for having a more loose coaching style.  Now, the board is saying the team needs more discipline.

There’s no one size fits all model in the league.

Some guys need discipline some need cuddling it comes down to man management.

This is where DQ got it wrong his management needs judgement round the team were average at best.This all cost.

The biggest takeaway of the last decade is ability to finish.

Both MS and DQ had the team in position.TD gave them enough but they couldn’t finish the job.They had at least 2-3 real possibilities to win a chip and basically tripped over at the key stage and dropped the ball.

Last decade for me is failed to finish since we are so into slogans.

Rise up and alike.

Failed to Finish.

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24 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

There’s no one size fits all model in the league.

Some guys need discipline some need cuddling it comes down to man management.

This is where DQ got it wrong his management needs judgement round the team were average at best.This all cost.

The biggest takeaway of the last decade is ability to finish.

Both MS and DQ had the team in position.TD gave them enough but they couldn’t finish the job.They had at least 2-3 real possibilities to win a chip and basically tripped over at the key stage and dropped the ball.

Last decade for me is failed to finish since we are so into slogans.

Rise up and alike.

Failed to Finish.

TD was a big problem too. Dude gave crap to MS. MS overachieved with the talent he had to play. TD basically rode the 2008, 2016 draft and Julio Jones. 

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4 hours ago, HASHBROWN3 said:

My gosh we've had some crap for coaches.  If you can't get the players to perform their assignments then Get outta here!

No accountability whatsoever from a bunch of pathetic people pleaser coaches.  If you can't or won't learn your assignment, you are GONE.  If you're physically incapable of doing it then that's in a different category. 

We just might have had the worst staff in the NFL.  There has to be accountability in everything.  Sports, Business, Relationships... The coaches were out smarted & out schemed too.  They've been over their heads & I am thankful that TF & AS are now in charge.  I truly feel the right people are now in place to gradually work towards being a winner again.

Agree completely. Dan Quinn and his entire staff were mostly hot garbage with the exception of Kyle Shanahan.

I've been watching pro football since I was a kid and I've never seen anything comparable to the pathetic, complete disarray of the Falcons defense in the Quinn era. It was literally a comedic farce.

That's all over with the hiring of AS and TF. They're a perfect match for what we needed. AS can resurrect the Shannie offense which is the best scheme for us.

Fontie is the brilliant disciple of one of the craftiest GM's in the NFC. He knows the strengths and weaknesses of every team in our division and has a gift for coming up with high-value, low-priced FA's.

I've said it a bunch of times already, the bad times are over. It's going to be fun watching the Falcons play football again. And I'm hoping that starts right now, this year, not two or three years down the road.

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4 hours ago, DonOfThemBirds said:

 

I think DQ's success in Seattle was more tied to Carroll.

 

Quinn struggled in Atlanta because he tried to replicate what was done in Seattle instead of evolving into his own. He'll have to evolve his defense to have any chance of getting back on a successful track.

Oh no doubt.  Only thing you can really give him credit for is it saw how good KS was. His entire coaching success was from Carroll and Shanny.  Sad thing is it went to his head and he really thought he was some kind of genius.

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15 hours ago, falcons007 said:

TD was a big problem too. Dude gave crap to MS. MS overachieved with the talent he had to play. TD basically rode the 2008, 2016 draft and Julio Jones. 

The 2013 and 2014, 2015 class played a big role in the Superbowl run. 

Trufant,Alford,Toilolo, Ish Matthews,Hageman,Rico, Grady, Collins (who actually was playing very well by the end of 2016)

All big contributors either as starters or role players.

As I have written on here many many times... the single biggest  problem with TD's drafts was health.

Had guys like Spoon, Jerry,Willy Mo, and the like had been able to stay healthy then I think that the perception of the talent... particularly on Defense would be much much different.... especially in the early days.

It got a little bit better but then the last few drafts have also had their share of snake bit players.Takk, Lindstrom, Davidson etc.

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9 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

The 2013 and 2014, 2015 class played a big role in the Superbowl run. 

Trufant,Alford,Toilolo, Ish Matthews,Hageman,Rico, Grady, Collins (who actually was playing very well by the end of 2016)

All big contributors either as starters or role players.

As I have written on here many many times... the single biggest  problem with TD's drafts was health.

Had guys like Spoon, Jerry,Willy Mo, and the like had been able to stay healthy then I think that the perception of the talent... particularly on Defense would be much much different.... especially in the early days.

It got a little bit better but then the last few drafts have also had their share of snake bit players.Takk, Lindstrom, Davidson etc.

Handful of players years later from multiple drafts when he really had to hit the drafts in 2013 and 2014. Problem with TD was depth, one injury the whole team fell apart. He was reaching players on athletic scores. That’s exactly was my point, 2008 and 2016 drafts were immediate contributors. 
 

Heck any GM or a blind squirrel will hit few players every few years. Collins and Hageman for second round picks were underwhelming.

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When we discuss defenders not knowing their assignments, I always think back to Kroy Bierman.  I think most fans assume he had limited talent.  I do not know how talented he was.  It is hard to judge that given the way he missed assignments.  Kroy loved to crash straight down the line.  Offenses knew that.  They wore him out giving him that lane and then throwing the ball to the outside where he was supposed to have contain.  Kroy never learned.  The coaching staff did not correct this.  I would watch and ask myself, "These are NFL professionals". 

Following that thinking, I do not know what the talent level is on our current defense. 

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9 minutes ago, falcons007 said:

Handful of players years later from multiple drafts when he really had to hit the drafts in 2013 and 2014. Problem with TD was depth, one injury the whole team fell apart. He was reaching players on athletic scores. That’s exactly was my point, 2008 and 2016 drafts were immediate contributors. 
 

Heck any GM or a blind squirrel will hit few players every few years. Collins and Hageman for second round picks were underwhelming.

But it has never been one injury.

When the injury bug bites us....it is usually an all you can eat buffet.

Like last year it was not just Julio.

We played the Packers game without the top 3 safeties.

We played the last 2 games of the year without 2/5ths of the oline.

Infact of the 5 starters on the oline, only Matthews and Lindstrom played every game.

The other 3 starters missed atleast one game.

Gurley missed games 

In 2019 I think the only offensive starters that did not miss atleast 1 game were the fullback, Matthews, and Mack.

I think everyone else missed atleast 1 game...even Ryan.

Now that is not to say injuries are why we have struggled the last couple of years but they have played a role in it.

Depth is an issue with every team.

Some have navigated injuries better than others but alot of that has to do with who gets hurt, when they get hurt, and who they play when the players are hurt.

 

 

 

 

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30 minutes ago, NorthGaBoy said:

When we discuss defenders not knowing their assignments, I always think back to Kroy Bierman.  I think most fans assume he had limited talent.  I do not know how talented he was.  It is hard to judge that given the way he missed assignments.  Kroy loved to crash straight down the line.  Offenses knew that.  They wore him out giving him that lane and then throwing the ball to the outside where he was supposed to have contain.  Kroy never learned.  The coaching staff did not correct this.  I would watch and ask myself, "These are NFL professionals". 

Following that thinking, I do not know what the talent level is on our current defense. 

I disagree. KB did what coaches asked him to do. KB is an example of a guy who did his job, nothing special but made plays. He stuck to his assignments and didn’t play hero ball. People underestimate how smart he played as joker in 2012 defense.

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20 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

But it has never been one injury.

When the injury bug bites us....it is usually an all you can eat buffet.

Like last year it was not just Julio.

We played the Packers game without the top 3 safeties.

We played the last 2 games of the year without 2/5ths of the oline.

Infact of the 5 starters on the oline, only Matthews and Lindstrom played every game.

The other 3 starters missed atleast one game.

Gurley missed games 

In 2019 I think the only offensive starters that did not miss atleast 1 game were the fullback, Matthews, and Mack.

I think everyone else missed atleast 1 game...even Ryan.

Now that is not to say injuries are why we have struggled the last couple of years but they have played a role in it.

Depth is an issue with every team.

Some have navigated injuries better than others but alot of that has to do with who gets hurt, when they get hurt, and who they play when the players are hurt.

 

 

 

 

The point is not just injuries. Even before injuries the Falcons had no starting LB, OL worth anything in 2013 or 2014. TD biggest failure over the years have been 2 and 3 rounds. He either sucked in drafting or traded the 3rd round pick too often. I will judge TF and AS om contribution of not just 1st round guys but mid round picks.

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6 minutes ago, falcons007 said:

I disagree. KB did what coaches asked him to do. KB is an example of a guy who did his job, nothing special but made plays. He stuck to his assignments and didn’t play hero ball. People underestimate how smart he played as joker in 2012 defense.

This is inexplicable given the outcome.  If I were a coach, and I saw the ball going outside play after play, and Bierman was crashing inside play after play, I think I would assign outside contain.  Yet, that did not happen.  I remember plays where the QB did not even make reads downfield.  He knew that outside screen was good for 6-7 yards on a routine basis.  Why try something else when that is working.

Your assumption is that the coaching staff was beyond stupid...or blind.

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16 minutes ago, NorthGaBoy said:

This is inexplicable given the outcome.  If I were a coach, and I saw the ball going outside play after play, and Bierman was crashing inside play after play, I think I would assign outside contain.  Yet, that did not happen.  I remember plays where the QB did not even make reads downfield.  He knew that outside screen was good for 6-7 yards on a routine basis.  Why try something else when that is working.

Your assumption is that the coaching staff was beyond stupid...or blind.

No. That’s your assumption. Mike Smith would have cut KB if he was dumb. Smitty didn’t play around.

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Just now, falcons007 said:

No. That’s your assumption. Mike Smith would have cut KB if he was dumb. Smitty didn’t play around.

That is not an assumption.  I have game recordings of this.  Are you just slinging **** to see what sticks to the wall?  Did you possibly watch Bierman play and not observe this?  I am having some real doubts regarding why you would try to convince anyone this did not happen.  I have eyes.  I know better.

Yesterday, I started thinking you had an agenda.  Today, I am reasonably certain. 

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6 minutes ago, NorthGaBoy said:

That is not an assumption.  I have game recordings of this.  Are you just slinging **** to see what sticks to the wall?  Did you possibly watch Bierman play and not observe this?  I am having some real doubts regarding why you would try to convince anyone this did not happen.  I have eyes.  I know better.

Yesterday, I started thinking you had an agenda.  Today, I am reasonably certain. 

Lol. So are you implying only you noticed and coaching staff didn’t? Or are you implying MS was bum to tolerate KB? Every one has few clips and plays. You have no clue if coaches asked him to do it or not. If coaches didn’t MS would have sent him packing. 
KB was definition of overachiever. The guy not gifted but gave everything and more.

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2 hours ago, falcons007 said:

2008 had many good contributors and were key part of the team. 

Sure, but had he drafted Glenn Dorsey in that spot instead of Matt Ryan, I don’t think he lasts as long as he did. Also worth noting, the rest of that draft is long gone. Matt is the only guy that has lasted multiple coaching staffs from that draft. 

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On 5/28/2021 at 3:34 PM, falcons007 said:

The biggest problem for Falcons has been poor starts in first 5 games of the season. NFL odds of a winning season drop dramatically after a 1-4 start and almost impossible to make playoffs with 0-5 start. Falcons have NFL worst, 2-13 Record under DQ for first five games from 2018-2020.  The big part of the reason for starting slow has been. the historically worse defense during those first 5 weeks. 

Three year Historic dumpster D in first five weeks (2018-2020)

The defense wasn't just bad, it was historically one of. the worst. Two of those defenses in past 3 years rank in 3 of the worst defensive performances in franchise history (first five games). All three of the defenses in those years rank as top 25 all time worst defenses in the NFL.  Falcons had the worst ranked defense in almost all categories.

Points given up: 32 rank.

TD given up: 32 Rank

QB passer rating: 32 Rank

Sacks : 32

Total yards given up: 31

 

2020 Season: 

The 2020 season was supposedly going to be different with Raheem Morris and Ulbrich taking over the play calling.However, 2020 is the third worst 5 game defensive start in the franchise history.

Points: 31

TD: 32

Yards: 31. 

QB Passer rating: 32. 

Sacks : 29

The 2018 and 2019 seasons are no different with Falcons being worst in the NFL in most categories. 

Falcons lost multiple games scoring more than 30 points or 40 points during. that time frame. 

Falcons schedule is favorable in first 5 weeks. If Dean Pees has the defense playing average or better will go long way in starting 3-2 or 4-1. A fast start to the season will help AS, and the falcons to stay relevant in January. 

Pees is teaching players to be smart and understand their roles and concepts. Hopefully Falcons would never have to see this garbage again. 

 

 

Itll take a few years to purge this talentless defense before any coach can make it respected.. Im not even sure Pees has enough years left on this earth to see this team aquire decent talent.. I know you have football knowledge so im not telling you anything you dont already know.. But please dont add fuel to some of these guys fires believing Pees is going to fix our defense in just one season 🙈

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17 minutes ago, Slumerican said:

Itll take a few years to purge this talentless defense before any coach can make it respected.. Im not even sure Pees has enough years left on this earth to see this team aquire decent talent.. I know you have football knowledge so im not telling you anything you dont already know.. But please dont add fuel to some of these guys fires believing Pees is going to fix our defense in just one season 🙈

What planet do you live on where you believe you need blue chips at all 11 positions?  Coaching makes much more of a difference than you give credit.

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