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QB and why we need a new one, PERIOD!


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10 hours ago, dapanch420 said:

 

Nope put brady on this team and watch him struggle more than ryan.

Imagine Brady being told by Koetter to drop back and watch his WR's run around for ten seconds before bombing it deep. He'd be dead already. Either that or he'd organize a coup to topple Koetter, so maybe we would be better. :ninja:

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Thank god this was posted.  I was afraid we'd have to wait until after Christmas to see Matt Ryan Thread #844,261.  

The “vets” with better coaches : Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben, Russell Wilson, Tannehill The “Young guns” with better coaches: Mahomes, Josh Allen, Herbert, Lamar Jackson, Murray   Th

All I want for Christmas is a merged QB thread 

Ryan is between 19th and 21st best quarterback in the league today, this season, depending on which source you choose.  He's not the worst.  But yeah, nobody needs to think he's coming back stronger, faster, more accurate next year.  

Go re-run the Chargers, Saints, Saints, Packers, Bucs game, pick one.  Heck, pick any of the 12 Ls this year except Dallas, he does not own any part of that loss.  

Can you honestly say Matt Ryan left it all on the field 14 times this year?  7 times?  Did he even try at LAC?  GB?  

He's been great.  Let's move on, sooner the better.  We're as good as we will be until then. 

 

And if you really love him to pieces think about this, all he is doing now is eliminating his HoF chances.  

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1 hour ago, Killing Floor said:

Ryan is between 19th and 21st best quarterback in the league today, this season, depending on which source you choose.  He's not the worst.  But yeah, nobody needs to think he's coming back stronger, faster, more accurate next year.  

Go re-run the Chargers, Saints, Saints, Packers, Bucs game, pick one.  Heck, pick any of the 12 Ls this year except Dallas, he does not own any part of that loss.  

Can you honestly say Matt Ryan left it all on the field 14 times this year?  7 times?  Did he even try at LAC?  GB?  

He's been great.  Let's move on, sooner the better.  We're as good as we will be until then. 

 

And if you really love him to pieces think about this, all he is doing now is eliminating his HoF chances.  

With a better OC, he would easily have top-5 stats.  Easily

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8 hours ago, Killing Floor said:

But yeah, nobody needs to think he's coming back stronger, faster, more accurate next year.

Playing QB is very cerebral.  This is why defensive coaches talk up "affecting the QB" so much.  They know if the hits and hurries gets into the QBs head, he will not perform to his potential.  Do you think this applies to Ryan?

He is not going to get faster or stronger.  But, he is still a very good QB.  You are going to see that next season when we have an Offensive Coordinator who can coordinate an offense, call a play, and make an effective game plan.  Also, Chris Morgan's replacement, hopefully, will assess our blocking capabilities and work with the OC on personnel sets and blocking assignments to ensure we can run effective plays. 

Relax, Ryan's potential replacement will be drafted next spring. 

I want to emphasize a point to all of our fans.  It may be difficult to believe, but our personnel sets, game plans, blocking assignments, play revelations, field usage, and general strategies are so bad, the best players in the league cannot succeed here.  It is that bad.  Do not be surprised that after Koetter and Morgan are gone that some players you have given up on suddenly look like good players. 

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Brady is running a scheme where he has to HOLD THE BALL.   That has been the issue in the first half with the Buccaneers for the entire season.   It has thrown his timing off because he is used to the quick passing of the Patriot scheme he was running.  At halftime, Brady makes his adjustments with the receivers, and then Brady becomes Brady.

 

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9 minutes ago, Spts1 said:

Brady is running a scheme where he has to HOLD THE BALL.   That has been the issue in the first half with the Buccaneers for the entire season.   It has thrown his timing off because he is used to the quick passing of the Patriot scheme he was running.  At halftime, Brady makes his adjustments with the receivers, and then Brady becomes Brady.

 

Brady made the adjustments himself? Or did Leftwich start calling plays with shallower routes to help create quick passes?

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7 minutes ago, The Architect said:

Brady made the adjustments himself? Or did Leftwich start calling plays with shallower routes to help create quick passes?

Leftwich saw that the game plan was not working, made adjustments, continued to tweek the plan, and the Bucs saw success. Meanwhile, Dirk Koetter probably saw that the game plan was not working and ..................................  Uhhhh, I just do not know. 

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1 minute ago, NaGaBoy said:

Leftwich saw that the game plan was not working, made adjustments, continued to tweek the plan, and the Bucs saw success. Meanwhile, Dirk Koetter probably saw that the game plan was not working and ..................................  Uhhhh, I just do not know. 

That's where I was heading. We rarely tweak our game plan when things aren't working or attack weaknesses.

There's been many occasions where I've heard our players say that we don't change what we do based on who we're facing. Julio mainly but that could just be because he's Julio lol.

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6 minutes ago, NaGaBoy said:

Leftwich saw that the game plan was not working, made adjustments, continued to tweek the plan, and the Bucs saw success. Meanwhile, Dirk Koetter probably saw that the game plan was not working and ..................................  Uhhhh, I just do not know. 

Called more dives on 2nd and 10 and long developing route concepts on 3rd down. The DK way.

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On 12/21/2020 at 9:16 AM, TheDirtyWordII said:

Hold on...so you admit, only thing that changed in TB was Brady...and that looks worth at least 3 wins.

In IND, Rivers comes in replaces Jacoby Brissett forced into action because Andrew Luck retired late in TC.  They go 7-9. Colts with Luck in 2018 = 10-6 (after being 4-12 without Luck in 2017).  Now they are 10-4.  

So...by your own admission, the QB change/upgrade is THE PRIMARY factor here with regard to the respective fates of these two franchises.

Yet in Atlanta, we’re on the verge of going 4-12, and 18-30 for the 2nd time in the last 8 years.  And we want to lay the blame on Everybody But Matt Ryan.

Gotcha <stifles laugh since person I educated just proved my point without realizing they proved my point>...

My guy, you're overlooking the fact that both teams had a competent OC before upgrading at QB. If you're saying Matt needs to be upgraded, then it sounds like you're also okay with just keeping Kutty as long as Ryan is gone. If that's the case, please be prepared for an abysmal year(s) of suck until DK is gone at minimum. You're trying to push an agenda and it isn't so cut and dry.

The Chargers did exactly what you want the Falcons to do, and they're no better than we are. They got the rookie QB everyone wanted instead of the aging vet. Speaking of which, Chargers are oddly the team some around here want the Falcons to be. Rookie QB, young edge rusher, commitment to running the ball, etc.. Why are they 5-9?! Hmmmm....

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12 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

My guy, you're overlooking the fact that both teams had a competent OC before upgrading at QB. If you're saying Matt needs to be upgraded, then it sounds like you're also okay with just keeping Kutty as long as Ryan is gone. If that's the case, please be prepared for an abysmal year(s) of suck until DK is gone at minimum. You're trying to push an agenda and it isn't so cut and dry.

The Chargers did exactly what you want the Falcons to do, and they're no better than we are. They got the rookie QB everyone wanted instead of the aging vet. Speaking of which, Chargers are oddly the team some around here want the Falcons to be. Rookie QB, young edge rusher, commitment to running the ball, etc.. Why are they 5-9?! Hmmmm....

Why do you consider Leftwich a competent OC?  He had less than two years experience as one.  And as far as Brady being OC’ed by Leftwich...please.  Leftwich was drafted 3 years after Brady, and his career flamed out.  You think Brady is taking anything that comes out of Leftwich’s mouth as anything more than input/suggestion?  The difference in that offense in 2020 is Brady...not some green OC who had little track record of success in the role.

I think the Chargers job is a significantly better job to market than the Falcons job BECAUSE of Herbert.  So we’ll be trotting out an opportunity to work with an overpaid, declining veteran QB against building your coaching career around the most exciting young QB in the game.

The problem now is that we’ll hire the leftovers in this coaching cycle because the Falcons job is unattractive and you guys can complain about how that coaching staff is misusing Ryan.  Again.  And again.  And again.

 

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19 hours ago, TheDirtyWordII said:

Hold on...so you admit, only thing that changed in TB was Brady...and that looks worth at least 3 wins.

In IND, Rivers comes in replaces Jacoby Brissett forced into action because Andrew Luck retired late in TC.  They go 7-9. Colts with Luck in 2018 = 10-6 (after being 4-12 without Luck in 2017).  Now they are 10-4.  

So...by your own admission, the QB change/upgrade is THE PRIMARY factor here with regard to the respective fates of these two franchises.

Yet in Atlanta, we’re on the verge of going 4-12, and 18-30 for the 2nd time in the last 8 years.  And we want to lay the blame on Everybody But Matt Ryan.

Gotcha <stifles laugh since person I educated just proved my point without realizing they proved my point>...

I believe that is the most presumptuous commentary I have read on here and I have read some doozies.  I am not going to tell you what is wrong with this.  Print it, go sit down somewhere quiet, and meditate on your comments.  Ask yourself with each statement what is wrong with this. 

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8 hours ago, TheDirtyWordII said:

Why do you consider Leftwich a competent OC?  He had less than two years experience as one.  And as far as Brady being OC’ed by Leftwich...please.  Leftwich was drafted 3 years after Brady, and his career flamed out.  You think Brady is taking anything that comes out of Leftwich’s mouth as anything more than input/suggestion?  The difference in that offense in 2020 is Brady...not some green OC who had little track record of success in the role.

I think the Chargers job is a significantly better job to market than the Falcons job BECAUSE of Herbert.  So we’ll be trotting out an opportunity to work with an overpaid, declining veteran QB against building your coaching career around the most exciting young QB in the game.

The problem now is that we’ll hire the leftovers in this coaching cycle because the Falcons job is unattractive and you guys can complain about how that coaching staff is misusing Ryan.  Again.  And again.  And again.

 

Like I said, you're pushing an agenda and it's obvious. Leftwich didn't throw 30, yes, THIRTY freaking interceptions. Winston had over 5k yards and threw 30 TD's. You're kidding yourself if you think Tom Brady just came in and changed everything on his own. Let me guess, NE is missing the playoffs because Tom Brady isn't there and not because they have a mess at QB right now huh?

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31 minutes ago, TheDirtyWordII said:

Why do you consider Leftwich a competent OC?  He had less than two years experience as one.  And as far as Brady being OC’ed by Leftwich...please.  Leftwich was drafted 3 years after Brady, and his career flamed out.  You think Brady is taking anything that comes out of Leftwich’s mouth as anything more than input/suggestion?  The difference in that offense in 2020 is Brady...not some green OC who had little track record of success in the role.

I think the Chargers job is a significantly better job to market than the Falcons job BECAUSE of Herbert.  So we’ll be trotting out an opportunity to work with an overpaid, declining veteran QB against building your coaching career around the most exciting young QB in the game.

The problem now is that we’ll hire the leftovers in this coaching cycle because the Falcons job is unattractive and you guys can complain about how that coaching staff is misusing Ryan.  Again.  And again.  And again.

 

Leftwich was shut out in the first half.  He made adjustments and steam rolled the Falcons.  How does that compare to what the Falcons did?  His career as a QB has nothing to do with this.  Come on guy, focus.  Yes, Brady is a team player.  He listens to Leftwich.  You apparently have no idea how Brady was handled by Bellichick.  Do you really think Bruce Arians will allow a QB to go rogue on his OC?  Of course not.  You are throwing up fud in hopes it will provide a way to win this debate.  There is no prize for winning a debate on this forum.

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1 hour ago, The Architect said:

Brady made the adjustments himself? Or did Leftwich start calling plays with shallower routes to help create quick passes?

Line protections because Brady has to hold the ball, communication with receivers on where to be on certain routes (timing). Tampa doesn't run quick passes as the norm like Brady did in New England. Thats the point. Brady is learning on the fly, concepts that Ryan has BEEN doing.

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5 minutes ago, Spts1 said:

Line protections because Brady has to hold the ball, communication with receivers on where to be on certain routes (timing). Tampa doesn't run quick passes as the norm like Brady did in New England. Thats the point. Brady is learning on the fly, concepts that Ryan has BEEN doing.

They did plenty of quick passes in the second half of the game. And always adjust to do so after their slow starts every week.

His weapons at receiver (we're probably better at TE with Howard injured) are a lot better than what we have so even when they're running the same concepts he'll have open targets sooner. Antonio Brown is the 3rd option lol. Line is better, RB is better even with the injuries, defense is better even with the injuries. He's a better QB than Ryan but our situations aren't really comparable.

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10 hours ago, etherdome said:

With a better OC, he would easily have top-5 stats.  Easily

Not even top 15.  That's the problem the club keeps missing.  He's steadily declined since the Super Bowl catastrophe (which is at least 50% on his shoulders).  He is slower, his decision making is totally suspect, he's less accurate and most of all he plays like a coward.  A new OC, new line, more Pro Bowl receivers, Pro Bowl RB, none of that addresses the fact that he's declined and has lost really all the athleticism that made him great.  We're all stuck on "he used to be great so he will be fine if we only..."

No, never great or even average again, sooner we move on the sooner we break .500.

Same argument against Todd Gurley is the argument for Matt Ryan, "Used to be...".

I hate that this is true.  But it is inarguable.  His judgment and poor playing (His) are indefensible.  

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On 12/21/2020 at 9:53 AM, matty72780 said:

First let me say, I love Matt Ryan, he’s meant so much to this franchise and under the right scheme he can be amazing (see Shanny’s offense). However, Matt Ryan constantly holds the ball forcing unnecessary coverage sacks and basically throws a boneheaded pick nearly every game. Let’s take a look at the NFL today though and see what other teams are working with. 
 

Better QBs in the NFL than Matt Ryan:

The “vets”: Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben, Russell Wilson, Tannehill

“Young guns”: Mahomes, Josh Allen, Herbert, Lamar Jackson, Murray

You could also make a case for guys like Carr and Watson but I left them out. This means as much as we want to deny it, Matt Ryan is NOT a top 10 QB anymore and we have arguably the best 2 WRs in the NFL on this team. Sure Koetter is horrible but at some point we have to realize the NFL is full of young talent and while other franchises are building their franchise QBs into vets we’re stuck with an aging team just making it harder and harder to compete at the level that these teams will be in the event we face them come playoff time. 
 

Matt Ryan - thank you for your service and thanks in advance for taking a new QB under your wing (since you’ll be on the team till 2022 due to your salary/cap hit), but it’s time to look to the future everyone. 
 

No, QB is not our problem, it would be a wasted pick at this time, and the cap hit would be prohibitive.

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On 12/22/2020 at 12:05 PM, Geaux_Falcons said:

Like I said, you're pushing an agenda and it's obvious. Leftwich didn't throw 30, yes, THIRTY freaking interceptions. Winston had over 5k yards and threw 30 TD's. You're kidding yourself if you think Tom Brady just came in and changed everything on his own. Let me guess, NE is missing the playoffs because Tom Brady isn't there and not because they have a mess at QB right now huh?

Would you look at that Byron Leftwich offensive coordinate?

This domination is all Byron Leftwich.

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