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New Orleans 1st round draft trade blunders


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I know no one wants to talk about how good the Saints are. Obviously they're a really good team and have been one of the best and most consistent teams in the NFL the last 4-5 years. What's kind of amazing to me is how good they have been despite making some really idiotic draft trades that seemed doomed from the beginning. 

2011

The Saints draft Cameron Jordan at #24 overall with their own 1st round pick. He's had an excellent career. But then they got greedy and traded back into the 1st round to select Mark Ingram at #28. They traded their 2011 2nd round pick (#56) and their 2012 1st rounder (#27). Ingram has had a fine career but he's more had the career of a good undrafted free agent RB like Pierre Thomas than what you would expect from a 1st rounder. 

Some of the players available with their 2011 2nd rounder were Torrey Smith, Marcus Gilbert, Randall Cobb, Justin Houston, and DeMarco Murray. (This was an all time great draft class.) Some of the players available with their 2012 1st rounder were Kevin Zeitler, Harrison Smith, Mitchell Schwartz, and Cordy Glenn. 

This was just a total blunder and flies in the face of all evidence against using 1st round picks on running backs, let alone trading multiple picks for 1st round RBs. 

2018

The Saints came into the draft holding the #27 pick. Somehow they decided DE Marcus Davenport was the missing piece for winning a championship so they traded up to #14 with Green Bay to pick him. The cost was New Orleans' 2019 1st round pick (#30). Davenport has been extremely underwhelming so far. 

Some of the players available with their 2018 1st rounder were Darius Leonard, Braden Smith, and Courtland Sutton (This was a bit of a weak draft.). Some of the players available with their 2019 1st rounder were Kaleb McGary, Byron Murphy, and Deebo Samuel. 

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Thank the lord they made these screw ups or they would really be kicking our @$$es but it's something to look at these and wonder what they were thinking. 

As always, trading up in the draft is usually a bad idea. If you think you are one player away from a championship, you are probably wrong. If you can't believe the player you think is so great is slipping, you are probably wrong. 

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16 minutes ago, RetroRoq said:

Since 2000, We picked Duckett, Jenkins, Anderson, Baker, Jerry, Weatherspoon, Beasley, Neal and McKinley in the first round. 

The production of all these guys put together would equal a rather "meh" career for a good first rounder.

Saints win.

With the exception of Takk.

All of those guys played on teams that went to atleast one nfc championship game.

And all of them except Anderson,Takk and Jerry had big roles on those teams.

So yeah ...your post is dumb

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54 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

With the exception of Takk.

All of those guys played on teams that went to atleast one nfc championship game.

And all of them except Anderson,Takk and Jerry had big roles on those teams.

So yeah ...your post is dumb

I don't think Featherspoon, Trufart, Busterson, or Junkins were if I am not mistaken. We wasted alot of our own capital trading up for Trufart, and Takk.

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1 hour ago, falconsd56 said:

With the exception of Takk.

All of those guys played on teams that went to atleast one nfc championship game.

And all of them except Anderson,Takk and Jerry had big roles on those teams.

So yeah ...your post is dumb

well, if the season that they went to the championship game is the primary factor in judging overall first round pick value, then it should be noted that for the seasons where the they entered an nfc championship game, only Baker, Neal and Beasley had what I would consider first round pick type productive season.

In NFC Championship season:  Duckett was the 3rd leading rusher on the team with 509 yards; Jenkins had 7 receptions all season for 119 yards and Weatherspoon had 95 tackles (which was 59th in the NFL that year)3 sacks and one int.  These are all number one picks we are talking about in their NFC championship season (your standard)... so when the OP points out 3 picks that the Saints "may" have missed on... I just did the 'hold my beer', cause I think we got 'em beat on missed number ones.

But I didnt give more creedence to player contribution in terms of their NFC Championship seasons, instead I referenced their body of work... so, for the 9 picks named and their overall contribution as number one picks... yeah, its kinda "meh"

So yeah... my post was dumb (but accurate)

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1 hour ago, Osiruz said:

I don't think Featherspoon, Trufart, Busterson, or Junkins were if I am not mistaken. We wasted alot of our own capital trading up for Trufart, and Takk.

You would be mistaken.

We made the nfc championship in 04,12 and 16

Spoon was drafted in 2010, Trufant in 13 and Jenkins in 2004

And we made the nfc division round in 17 with Takk as a rookie

So yeah ....you are wrong

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This thread is a fail. Every team has misses. As others have already stated we have missed on plenty. You can do the "They should have taken this guy" for every team every draft in every round.

Cameron Jordan has been one of the best pass rushers in the NFL over the last decade. Ingram may not have been as good as they like but he's still playing in the NFL and has had a overall solid career (7255 yards, 62 TDs). Hardly would call that a bust. Heck M. Turner had 7338 yards and 66 TDs for comparison.

Davenport has not worked out like they would have hope but they drafted Trey Hendrickson the year prior in the 3rd round who has absolutely been killing it this year. 

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15 minutes ago, RetroRoq said:

well, if the season that they went to the championship game is the primary factor in judging overall first round pick value, then it should be noted that for the seasons where the they entered an nfc championship game, only Baker, Neal and Beasley had what I would consider first round pick type productive season.

In NFC Championship season:  Duckett was the 3rd leading rusher on the team with 509 yards; Jenkins had 7 receptions all season for 119 yards and Weatherspoon had 95 tackles (which was 59th in the NFL that year)3 sacks and one int.  These are all number one picks we are talking about in their NFC championship season (your standard)... so when the OP points out 3 picks that the Saints "may" have missed on... I just did the 'hold my beer', cause I think we got 'em beat on missed number ones.

But I didnt give more creedence to player contribution in terms of their NFC Championship seasons, instead I referenced their body of work... so, for the 9 picks named and their overall contribution as number one picks... yeah, its kinda "meh"

So yeah... my post was dumb (but accurate)

Duckett was the short yardage back...his job was to get the tough yards and he did that.. he also had 8 rushing TD's in 2004.....he was the big D in the DVD rushing attack.

Spoon was part of a defense that was a top 5 defense in terms of scoring. 

The fact is that every guy mentioned played roles....some bigger and some smaller on teams with success.....so no your post was not accurate.

At the end of the day being a great player means nothing if your team sucks.

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1 minute ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

This thread is a fail. Every team has misses. As others have already stated we have missed on plenty. You can do the "They should have taken this guy" for every team every draft in every round.

Cameron Jordan has been one of the best pass rushers in the NFL over the last decade. Ingram may not have been as good as they like but he's still playing in the NFL and has had a overall solid career (7255 yards, 62 TDs). Hardly would call that a bust. Heck M. Turner had 7338 yards and 66 TDs for comparison.

Davenport has not worked out like they would have hope but they drafted Trey Hendrickson the year prior in the 3rd round who has absolutely been killing it this year. 

Davenport was a project - it was widely known we were taking a "chance" - because the upside was just too good. 

Year 1 was a true learning curve. Year 2 was marred by injury. Even this year missed games 1-4 ( maybe 3 ) with an elbow issue. He has been back since week 5 i believe. He is still growing into the position learning techniques that suit him and that dont. 

There is a reason we havent had a 100 yard rusher in a record setting 53 games straight. 

But like you also alluded to, where we "miss" ( subjective ) we also "hit" ( Hendrickson, Onyemata, Mike Thomas, Kamara etc ) in later round picks. 

 

AS for Ingram. He was a really really good RB. He ran mad. He led league at one point with yards after contact. Comparing him to a Pierre Thomas ( a la Marques Colston- last pick in 2008 draft i think ) isnt equal. Pierre was rare but out the league in 5-6 years. Ingram still getting it done in Baltimore. And had he stayed here, he and Kamara would rule the NFL for RB duos. ( due to our Oline ) 

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We got 8 years out of Ingram where the average career of a NFL RB is 2.66 years and he’s still running at a high caliber in Baltimore. The only RB from that class that remained on the team that drafted them longer than Ingram is Bilal Powell, and he wasn’t a bell cow like Ingram was. Ingram became our franchise leader in rushing TD’s and is only like 8 yards behind Deuce McAllister for the yardage record as well. So yeah, well worth trading back up for him, especially considering it’s not like we would’ve have our 2012 1st round pick anyway with the sham of a witch-hunt the NFL put on the following year. So essentially we traded our 2012 2nd round pick for Ingram. Makes it an even better trade.

As for Davenport, the jury is still out, but it’s looking like a far better pick than you want to admit.

 

Y’all really just let anybody start threads here huh? :lol:

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21 minutes ago, Iron Saint said:

We got 8 years out of Ingram where the average career of a NFL RB is 2.66 years and he’s still running at a high caliber in Baltimore. The only RB from that class that remained on the team that drafted them longer than Ingram is Bilal Powell, and he wasn’t a bell cow like Ingram was. Ingram became our franchise leader in rushing TD’s and is only like 8 yards behind Deuce McAllister for the yardage record as well. So yeah, well worth trading back up for him, especially considering it’s not like we would’ve have our 2012 1st round pick anyway with the sham of a witch-hunt the NFL put on the following year. So essentially we traded our 2012 2nd round pick for Ingram. Makes it an even better trade.

As for Davenport, the jury is still out, but it’s looking like a far better pick than you want to admit.

 

Y’all really just let anybody start threads here huh? :lol:

Always felt like y'all underutilized Ingram to some degree. Had he been the sole lead back on a team, he would have been fine. He's been under appreciated in the league for a while now if you ask me. Very good back, but never gets the notice he nationally deserves

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27 minutes ago, Iron Saint said:

We got 8 years out of Ingram where the average career of a NFL RB is 2.66 years and he’s still running at a high caliber in Baltimore. The only RB from that class that remained on the team that drafted them longer than Ingram is Bilal Powell, and he wasn’t a bell cow like Ingram was. Ingram became our franchise leader in rushing TD’s and is only like 8 yards behind Deuce McAllister for the yardage record as well. So yeah, well worth trading back up for him, especially considering it’s not like we would’ve have our 2012 1st round pick anyway with the sham of a witch-hunt the NFL put on the following year. So essentially we traded our 2012 2nd round pick for Ingram. Makes it an even better trade.

But longevity doesn't help you win a championship. You're better off with someone like Demarco Murray who is capable of singular monster seasons than Ingram who peaks at "solid" but is consistent. 

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Just now, tl;dr said:

Always felt like y'all underutilized Ingram to some degree. Had he been the sole lead back on a team, he would have been fine. He's been under appreciated in the league for a while now if you ask me. Very good back, but never gets the notice he nationally deserves

Entirely agree myself. Payton was on the record at various points stating that he was the only one that was holding Ingram back from reaching his full potential, especially in the early years 2011-2013.

In 2014, Payton FINALLY started feeding him more and stopped rotating backs as much as we were. Now once we got Kamara, the back rotating returned, but Payton managed it much better than he did in 2011-13, at least for the first year in 2017. 2018 he leaned heavier of Kamara which somewhat limited his effectiveness compared to 2017.

But definitely a great dude. I’m hoping when he’s done in Baltimore, he’ll come back for one more season here and get those 8 or so yards for that franchise yardage record because he definitely deserves it.

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41 minutes ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

This thread is a fail. Every team has misses. As others have already stated we have missed on plenty. You can do the "They should have taken this guy" for every team every draft in every round.

Obviously every team misses and as I said the Saints are overall doing an excellent job. I'm mostly pointing out how the Saints misses have been compound misses that involve 2-3 picks and not just one. They do so well with their other picks that staying put and using all their picks would have been smarter. 

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5 minutes ago, Iron Saint said:

Entirely agree myself. Payton was on the record at various points stating that he was the only one that was holding Ingram back from reaching his full potential, especially in the early years 2011-2013.

In 2014, Payton FINALLY started feeding him more and stopped rotating backs as much as we were. Now once we got Kamara, the back rotating returned, but Payton managed it much better than he did in 2011-13, at least for the first year in 2017. 2018 he leaned heavier of Kamara which somewhat limited his effectiveness compared to 2017.

But definitely a great dude. I’m hoping when he’s done in Baltimore, he’ll come back for one more season here and get those 8 or so yards for that franchise yardage record because he definitely deserves it.

Even then, I felt the Kamara/Ingram duo made both players better. At that point, it made much more sense than it did early in his career. 

Ingram is really such a good dude though. He deserves so much of the goodness that has come his way

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56 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

You would be mistaken.

We made the nfc championship in 04,12 and 16

Spoon was drafted in 2010, Trufant in 13 and Jenkins in 2004

And we made the nfc division round in 17 with Takk as a rookie

So yeah ....you are wrong

Even if I am wrong those guys are still terrible players, making a roster doesn't make them all of a sudden star players or amounted to anything. None of those guys made the probowl except Trufart, and he did it because QBs were not throwing in his direction. 

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Just now, Osiruz said:

Even if I am wrong those guys are still terrible players, making a roster doesn't make them all of a sudden star players or amounted to anything. None of those guys made the probowl except Trufart, and he did it because QBs were not throwing in his direction. 

No they were not terrible players.

 

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5 minutes ago, Osiruz said:

Even if I am wrong those guys are still terrible players, making a roster doesn't make them all of a sudden star players or amounted to anything. None of those guys made the probowl except Trufart, and he did it because QBs were not throwing in his direction. 

Jenkins was lousy, Trufant had a 2nd round career as a 1st rounder, and I'll ride or die Weatherspoon was awesome in 2011-2012 but was never the same after the 2013 injury. 

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45 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

Duckett was the short yardage back...his job was to get the tough yards and he did that.. he also had 8 rushing TD's in 2004.....he was the big D in the DVD rushing attack.

Spoon was part of a defense that was a top 5 defense in terms of scoring. 

The fact is that every guy mentioned played roles....some bigger and some smaller on teams with success.....so no your post was not accurate.

At the end of the day being a great player means nothing if your team sucks.

Lets try this one more time, remember, these were number one picks.

Now with full 20/20 hindsight, of the players that I named and knowing the cap implications that #1 picks usually come with... if you had the 32nd pick in the draft in the year they were drafted, would you still draft them if they were available... and who?  Remember, you have full knowledge of the finished product at your disposal, how many of these role players would you take?  Feel free to consider their NFC Championship game seasons.

At the end of the day, being a great player means a LOT even if your team sucks.  Being a SUCK player means a lot less when your team is good ( I will grant you that argument and for that, I was accurate)

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8 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

No they were not terrible players.

 

Lol 🙄, featherspoon has 2 career int, like 8 sacks in 8 years, and 25 tfl. He ended his career as a journeyman and played in 16 games only once, and at his absolute pinnacle best he was whiffing on tackles. That's production you expect for a 7th rounder or a UDFA. 

Don't get me started on Junkins. He broke 700 yards and 4tds like once? Couldn't even make another team once we dropped him. 

If you think DE Jamal Busterson was anything but worthless you need mental help and probably suffer from stockholm syndrome. That dude played with the same energy as a parking cone and collected like 4 career sacks. 

I'll give you that Trufart had a big role on our defense, but really we don't even miss him this year and neither did we miss him in 2016. He was a good player but definitely not one worth trading up for. Consider we could have had Aleg Ogletree and David Bakhtiari for those pics. He is arguably worth the pick. 

We traded up for Takk when the pick should have been TJ Watt. We could have also stood pat and took Budda Baker and either of Kamara, Cooper Kupp, Kareem Hunt, or JuJu Smith Schuster. Trader Tom made a mess of things in a loaded draft.  

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7 hours ago, RetroRoq said:

Since 2000, We picked Duckett, Jenkins, Anderson, Baker, Jerry, Weatherspoon, Beasley, Neal and McKinley in the first round. 

The production of all these guys put together would equal a rather "meh" career for a good first rounder.

Saints win.

Wow Peria Jerry, not only did I completely forget of his existence, if you reminded me of him I would have never have been able to tell you we grabbed him in Round 1.  Yikes.

 

edit: I forgot about the knee injury too, that probably ruined him... I feel bad now.

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