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Year By Year Comparison: Julio vs Jerry


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Julio has a more pass friendly era to play in, which gives him an advantage.  Rice had a new offensive system when defenses weren't yet accustomed to how to stop it, which gives him a big advantage.

Hard to really compare across eras, especially if one is with a new system.  Rice played in the equivalent of being in Shanahan's system every year of his career (but even moreso since defenses weren't even used to the concept at the beginning.)

Hard to argue against Rice as the GOAT wrt production.

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To me, Rice is the best player in NFL history and there is nobody close to him. He has records that IMO will never be broken. If there was ever a definitive GOAT, it's him.  Also, I think Rice is

I don't know man, hard for me to agree JJ had a better year when Rice has a higher YPC and double the TD's, more catches/yards or not.  Honestly, Rice's TD's are insane, and considering one of th

Found this in an article from 2018: Forty-seven players have surpassed 10,000 career receiving yards in NFL history. Those 47 players are distributed fairly evenly by volume after the 10,000-yard

The problem is it’s tough to separate the rest of Rice’s career and look just at his first 9 years.  We know how his story ends so the comparison is tough.  
 

But through 9 seasons, I’ll take Julio.  I know the TD difference is huge, but it takes more than a WR to score a TD.  The QB and OC play a huge role as well.  
 

Rice: 708 Receptions &  11,387 Yards in 140 Games

Jones: 797 Receptions & 12,125 Yards in 126 Games

 

So Jones has 90 more receptions and 800 more yards in 14 fewer games

 

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4 hours ago, Lornoth said:

I don't know man, hard for me to agree JJ had a better year when Rice has a higher YPC and double the TD's, more catches/yards or not. 

Honestly, Rice's TD's are insane, and considering one of the stats always praised on JJ's side is his YPC, Rice's stats are also crazy there. Truly the best NFL player of all time, imo.

He’s the Michael Jordan of football. 

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2 hours ago, 408Falcon said:

And you definitely can't have an * saying "If Jones doesn't get hurt this year he wins it".... When Rice had 22 TD's lol. And believe me. My dog is name Julio after JJ and majority of my Falcons jerseys are JJ jerseys. I love the man. But that * is some BS lol

Yeah, I added that edit after I made the initial post.  Didn’t realize he had 22 TD’s in 12 games.  Jones was still on pace to obliterate him in catches and yards that year

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42 minutes ago, VTCrunkler said:

Petyon compared to Matt looks like a favorable comparison compared to this current comparison.  

What’s odd is Julio holds all the number advantage except one.  TD’s. Every other meaningful metric goes to Jones by a large margin

Also consider that in the 90’s the best athletes started moving to Defense in college.   It’s harder to get tons of YAC when linebackers and safeties run 4.4-4.5 40’s

 

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42 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

What’s odd is Julio holds all the number advantage except one.  TD’s. Every other meaningful metric goes to Jones by a large margin

Also consider that in the 90’s the best athletes started moving to Defense in college.   It’s harder to get tons of YAC when linebackers and safeties run 4.4-4.5 40’s

 

If anything’s gunna hold JJ back its the lack of TDs. Let’s change that!

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42 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

What’s odd is Julio holds all the number advantage except one.  TD’s. Every other meaningful metric goes to Jones by a large margin

Also consider that in the 90’s the best athletes started moving to Defense in college.   It’s harder to get tons of YAC when linebackers and safeties run 4.4-4.5 40’s

 

And yeah theres no doubt who more of a physical specimen. But Jerry Rice seems like hes the ironman, cal ripken, of football. That yardage record probably wont wver be touched again. 

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11 minutes ago, opensource001 said:

I feel like  you are placing a greater emphasis on yards than touch downs.  Are you Dirk Koetter? 

LOL...if you only knew how much that remark annoys me.

Joking aside, a WR can’t get TD’s by himself.  It requires the right call by the OC, the proper read by the QB and an accurate throw.  The 49ers passed to score while the Falcons, especially early in Ryan’s career, prefer to run to score

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1 minute ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

LOL...if you only knew how much that remark annoys me.

Joking aside, a WR can’t get TD’s by himself.  It requires the right call by the OC, the proper read by the QB and an accurate throw.  The 49ers passed to score while the Falcons, especially early in Ryan’s career, prefer to run to score

Sorry, no offense intended, it was just immediately popped into my head.  I appreciate the levity though.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with any of your points, and your certainly right that it's not just all about the WR but if you score a TD your going to have less yards and catches just cause that's the end of the series (which you kind of just said).  I guess I just find the whole conversation odd.  Don't mind me though, I'm just here for the witty banter.

 

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8 minutes ago, opensource001 said:

Sorry, no offense intended, it was just immediately popped into my head.  I appreciate the levity though.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with any of your points, and your certainly right that it's not just all about the WR but if you score a TD your going to have less yards and catches just cause that's the end of the series (which you kind of just said).  I guess I just find the whole conversation odd.  Don't mind me though, I'm just here for the witty banter.

 

You’re good, my friend.  And don’t get me wrong.  I’m not saying Julio is better than Rice.  I just think his first 9 years were at least equal to Rice

One Rice Freudian Slip that always makes me smile

Jerry Rice admitted to cheating just days before calling Pats cheaters

Based on Jerry Rice's logic, we might need to put an asterisk next to a few of the 49ers Super Bowl titles. 

In a video segment that was published on ESPN.comon Jan. 17, Rice admitted that he used to put stickum on his gloves during his playing days. 

"I know this might be a little illegal, guys, I just put a little spray, a little stickum on them, to make sure that texture is a little sticky," Rice says in the video that was unearthed by the readers over at ProFootballTalk.com

Stickum and other adhesives were banned by the NFL in 1981. Rice played in the league from 1985 to 2004. So if Rice used stickum, it wasn't a "little illegal," it was all illegal. 

Rice's comment probably wouldn't have been a big deal if Deflategate never happened, but Deflategate did happen. In the days after the Patriots-Colts AFC title game on Jan. 18, Rice had some strong remarks on the subject of deflating footballs. 

 

In an interview with Jim Rome on Jan. 22, the Hall of Fame receiver flat out said the Patriots were cheating.  

"I'm going to be point blank, I feel like it's cheating," Rice said. "Because you have an edge up on your opponent and its unfortunate that it happened.... I've played in cold weather, I know how hard the football is and you can grip the leather just a little bit better [if it's deflated]."

Rice didn't stop with the cheating comment either, he also added that if the Patriots end up winning the Super Bowl, which they did, their title should have an asterisk next to it. 

 

"I think you have to really put an asterisk on it, because this is going to follow them, you know, for the rest of their lives, because when you look at it, when people go back and they think about the New England Patriots, they're going to think about these controversies," Rice said.

Even worse for Rice is what he said next, "I've always wanted to do things the right way," Rice said. "I didn't want to take any short cuts or anything like that."

Sure, Jerry. 

 

I don't personally think there needs to be an asterisk next to anyone's Super Bowl title (Patriots or 49ers), but if the NFL wants to strip away Rice's Super Bowl XXIII MVP award and give it to my dad, I'd be fine with that. 

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12 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

 The 49ers passed to score while the Falcons, especially early in Ryan’s career, prefer to run to score

But isnt that why the Falcons drafted Julio?  They were abandoning the "run first philosophy" to become more "explosive"

And when Rice played for the 49ers, their rushing TD totals were quite respectable with Roger Craig, Tom Rathman and Ricky Watters (them boys ran for a lot of TDS). Montana had over 20 rushing tds, Steve Young had over 20 rushing TDs.  The 49ers may have passed to score but a ton of those scores were on the ground.  Heck, even Jerry Rice had 10 rushing touchdowns when he played for the 49ers.

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8 minutes ago, RetroRoq said:

But isnt that why the Falcons drafted Julio?  They were abandoning the "run first philosophy" to become more "explosive"

And when Rice played for the 49ers, their rushing TD totals were quite respectable with Roger Craig, Tom Rathman and Ricky Watters (them boys ran for a lot of TDS). Montana had over 20 rushing tds, Steve Young had over 20 rushing TDs.  The 49ers may have passed to score but a ton of those scores were on the ground.  Heck, even Jerry Rice had 10 rushing touchdowns when he played for the 49ers.

Jones is used as a decoy once we push into scoring position.  I can’t fault him for that

 

Is Julio Jones’ Lack Of Touchdowns Really His Fault?

January 6, 2019

 

Julio Jones and touchdowns. Name a more platonic relationship.

At least, that’s what the media and NFL community will have you believe. Does the Alabama product deserve the blame?

This should go without saying, but it’s something that a lot of fans seem to forget: outside of the occasional tipped pass, 99% of a receiver’s production comes from being targeted. Putting completion percentages aside, if a quarterback isn’t throwing to his receiver, said receiver isn’t going to produce. 

 

For Jones, that’s been the (unfortunate) story of his career. 

According to profootballreference.com, Jones did most of his damage this past season when the Falcons’ offense was on their own 21-50; hauling in 51 of his 81 targets in that zone for 835 yards. Once the Falcons crossed into opponent territory, Jones’ targets dipped. 

When the Falcons were anywhere between the opponents’ 49-20, Jones was targeted 54 times, pulling in 40 targets for 593 yards. 

In the red zone, Jones was only targeted 17 times (10 receptions for 100 yards and five TDs). 

When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones (and his 6’3″ frame) was only targeted seven times, which he “turned” into three receptions for three(!) yards and two TDs. 

Now, all of those numbers could be attributed more to Steve Sarkisian’s ineptitude to run an NFL offense over the past two seasons. However, this has been a trend for his entire career… literally. 

 
  • In 2017, Jones was targeted in the red zone only 18 times. He totaled a mere five receptions for 33 yards and one TD. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was only targeted 11 times, (four receptions for 16 yards and one touchdown). 
  • The year prior (2016), Jones was targeted in the red zone nine times. He was credited for four receptions for 22 yards and two touchdowns. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was only targeted six times (three receptions for 11 yards and two touchdowns). 
  • 2015 seems to be the anomaly (when current San Francisco 49ers head coach Kyle Shanahan was offensive coordinator) for Jones. Shanahan utilized Jones effectively, helping Jones turn his 21 red zone targets and 12 targets between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line into 12 receptions for 83 yards and five touchdowns and six receptions for 29 yards and four touchdowns, respectively. 
 
  • In 2014, Jones was targeted in the red zone 11 times. He saw seven receptions for 59 yards and two touchdowns. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was only targeted five times. He caught two passes for 16 yards and one touchdown. 
  • In 2013, Jones was targeted in the red zone nine times. He caught five passes for 17 yards and one touchdown. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was only targeted seven times. He brought in four of those targets for 12 yards and one touchdown. 
  • 2012 was a solid year for Jones. He was targeted in the red zone 20 times (second-highest total of his career). As a result, he caught 11 passes for 108 yards and seven touchdowns. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was targeted 10 times which he converted into three receptions for 20 yards and three touchdowns. 
  • In 2011 (his rookie season), Jones was targeted just eight times in the red zone, when he caught four passes for 48 yards and two touchdowns. When the Falcons were between the opponents’ 1-10 yard line, Jones was only targeted one (!) time, never catching a pass or touchdown.
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Julio Jones frustrated with lack of red zone targets as Falcons lose 5th straight
 

Atlanta Falcons wide receiver Julio Jones is unhappy with the team's play in the red zone, and blamed much of his frustration on the play calling. Despite boasting the league's fifth most productive offense from a yardage standpoint, the Falcons average just 23.3 points per game, ranking 14th in the league.

Jones was asked why he wasn't getting targets in the red zone following the team's fifth consecutive loss on Sunday, and specifically why he wasn't getting fade routes and jump balls called his way.

"I just go out there and just do what I'm told to do," Jones said, via Vaughn McClure of ESPN. "If we're getting those looks, I think they'll call those plays. But I don't know. I don't know what we're getting down there. I don't know what the thinking is as far as if we're going to throw the jump balls or if we're going to run the ball or whatever look we're getting down there."

"We practice throughout the week throwing jump balls, throwing fades, throwing all these little things," Jones said. "But when the game comes, you never know what's going to come up."

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29 minutes ago, Duff_Man said:

Jerry Rice also played nine seasons with no salary cap.

True...Jerry had 10 HOF players making his job easier at some point during his time in SF.  And he didn’t like lesser receiver getting touches...lol

 

“Maybe I’ve been spoiled over the years, but this is not 49ers football,” he said. “Or maybe the Man’s giving me a sign. “If you ask me if I’m having a good time, no. Is this something that might want to make you retire, **** yes. All I know is I’m not having a good time. Maybe it’s time for me to move on.”

Yes, that’s Jerry Rice saying he’s not having fun and threatening retirement in 1998. And that was after a win in which he had the second-most targets on the team and scored a touchdown. And he had 10 catches on 19 targets the week before! He was was leading the NFL in receptions at the time! Yet, he was apparently so frustrated that he thought J.J. Stokes’ 8 targets and Terrell Owens’ two touchdowns might be a sign from God.

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On 7/22/2020 at 8:32 PM, FalconsIn2012 said:

You’re good, my friend.  And don’t get me wrong.  I’m not saying Julio is better than Rice.  I just think his first 9 years were at least equal to Rice

One Rice Freudian Slip that always makes me smile

Jerry Rice admitted to cheating just days before calling Pats cheaters

 

 

 

 

 

That's funny.  I hadn't seen that before.

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On 7/23/2020 at 10:48 AM, RetroRoq said:

But isnt that why the Falcons drafted Julio?  They were abandoning the "run first philosophy" to become more "explosive"

And when Rice played for the 49ers, their rushing TD totals were quite respectable with Roger Craig, Tom Rathman and Ricky Watters (them boys ran for a lot of TDS). Montana had over 20 rushing tds, Steve Young had over 20 rushing TDs.  The 49ers may have passed to score but a ton of those scores were on the ground.  Heck, even Jerry Rice had 10 rushing touchdowns when he played for the 49ers.

Exactly. When the WCO is ran correctly (ala Falcons in 2016), that’s what happens.  
 

I’ll never understand the OC hiring of Koetter, I knew we were abandoning the WCO when that happened. 

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On 7/23/2020 at 12:02 AM, MAD597 said:

JJs lack of Tds will keep him from being talked about in the same class as other WR greats. For some reason he has an issue with TDs given the number of receptions and yards he has.

This is true. His TD numbers are bafflingly poor given how good the rest of his numbers are. 

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On 7/22/2020 at 2:27 PM, athell said:

Yea no...you can't just overlook TD's so the premise is flawed from the jump.

Not to mention Jerry's numbers are absolutely insane considering the era that he played in.  No knock on Julio, but Jerry is the GOAT by a mile and I think it's disingenuous to compare careers.

Didn't you say in the other thread I was crazy because I pointed to JJ11's low TD total as a flaw?

be consistent.

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On ‎07‎/‎22‎/‎2020 at 5:14 PM, FalconsIn2012 said:

Through 9 years it’s Jerry & Julio....nobody else is close

Larry Fitz I believe is in the conversation when it comes to overall yardage. But Julio stinks when compared to jerry, TO, or Moss as far as TD totals. AS far as YPG and overall yardage I believe when all is said and done Julio might be able to make a run at Jerry's record. Jerry Rice's TD's are madden type stuff. No one is scoring 22Tds in 12 games. 

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On 7/22/2020 at 9:20 PM, FalconsIn2012 said:

Let’s ask it a different way: what would Julio do if drafted by the 49ers in 1985

This is impossible to say because by all measurable stat, JJ (And honestly half the WR's in the NFL) Should be better than Rice. Rice wasn't ever particularly speedy, or powerful, or anything else that you could measure. But he still went out and crushed it every week. Honestly if anything I think both WR's would play better if they switched era's. JJ's strong enough to take on the more beat-em-up style of coverage that was back then and Rice playing with DB's forced to give him space? In a pass-happy league? Insane. 

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On 7/22/2020 at 6:06 PM, caponine said:

How did Jerry get in this ??? You're comparing them through 9 years as if they had the exact same 9 years. Jerry far surpasses Julio sorry.  I dont think Julio is the 2nd or third best tbh. Still think its Moss and T.O. You cant leave out Marvin Harrison eithe

You really think Julio doesn't deserve to be in the same sentence as Jerry?! You have bumped your dang head. Julio is already easily mentioned in the same sentence as Moss (outside of his rookie and his Pats year they almost went perfect- it's not hard to compare) or TO - you forgot Megatron btw.  Stop being a hater. 

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