Falcons GM Thomas Dimitroff: 'We've definitely gotten better'

[FalconFanSince1970]

10 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

So coaching doesn’t matter then ?

I stand by it coaching is everything you think alot of these good franchises win just with execution?

No chance it’s starts with the guy at top and then the vision.

Why not put your name on Koetter over Shanny then if coaching don’t matter **** bring Sark back to throw darts in the dark.

PS Shanny took the butt snapper Person to the SB this year with the Niners so I mean I’m not sure what the point is on that.

I know you don't get the point. You can't even explain why Shanny the God had the worst offense in the Ryan era in 2015. Your "it was the first year in the scheme" excuse was shot to hail when Mularkey and Kutty had Top 10 scoring offenses in the first year of their schemes. So what happened in 2015 under the God? What happened in his first two seasons in SF?

[kiwifalcon]

7 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

I know you don't get the point. You can't even explain why Shanny the God had the worst offense in the Ryan era in 2015. Your "it was the first year in the scheme" excuse was shot to hail when Mularkey and Kutty had Top 10 scoring offenses in the first year of their schemes. So what happened in 2015 under the God? What happened in his first two seasons in SF?

I thought that was pretty basic to see actually.

Implementation of the WCO and complex verbiage that went along with it.

Players and coaches getting in sink.

Even in 2015 there were very positive signs early on of which then they faded off.

I mean what else do you want me to say.2015 was the springboard for 2016 of which you saw what it looked like when it fully clicked.
 

Why don’t you put your name on Koetter or Sark being in the same planet as Shanny because of what you saw in 2015 Nevermind the fact that all of Sarks tenure was piggy backed off of what Shanny setup in 15-16 of which he screwed the pooch because the offense was to complex for him.

 

[falcons007]

11 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

I thought that was pretty basic to see actually.

Implementation of the WCO and complex verbiage that went along with it.

Players and coaches getting in sink.

Even in 2015 there were very positive signs early on of which then they faded off.

I mean what else do you want me to say.2015 was the springboard for 2016 of which you saw what it looked like when it fully clicked.
 

Why don’t you put your name on Koetter or Sark being in the same planet as Shanny because of what you saw in 2015 Nevermind the fact that all of Sarks tenure was piggy backed off of what Shanny setup in 15-16 of which he screwed the pooch because the offense was to complex for him.

 

It is basic stuff. Bill B said it himself, if Players were executing every play, I just need one play. Point is other team is trying to execute their plan to stop you. In 2015 it was players learning Shanny’s complex WCO verbiage. In 2016, it was Sark and Dirk in 2019. 
The same defensive players turned it around with new coach In second half last year. Rams offense sucked in 2016 but became top offense in 2017 with same core pieces and new coach. 

[autigerfan]

Reasons for optimism:

Lots of young guys got experience on the o-line and in the secondary last year.

Addressed needs at RB, DE and TE pretty well in Free Agency.  Hurst could be an upgrade over Hooper due to athleticism and Fowler likely improvement over Beasley if he can stay consistent.

Solid draft to address depth

Reasons for skepticism:

Lots of personnel turnover (I believe continuity will likely dictate team performance in a modified offseason)

Our division should be much improved.

Potential for Special Teams woes.  This has consistently been something we could hang our hats on and now we will have inexperience at kicker and punter.

 

 

[Vandy]

5 hours ago, falcons007 said:

It is basic stuff. Bill B said it himself, if Players were executing every play, I just need one play. Point is other team is trying to execute their plan to stop you. In 2015 it was players learning Shanny’s complex WCO verbiage. In 2016, it was Sark and Dirk in 2019. 
The same defensive players turned it around with new coach In second half last year. Rams offense sucked in 2016 but became top offense in 2017 with same core pieces and new coach. 

Good post. In other words, coaching matters. 

[FalconsIn2012]

On 6/22/2020 at 9:02 PM, HouseofEuphoria said:

No, those first 8 weeks or so the defensive calls and formations, when DQ was in charge,  were very questionable to everyone, including announcers during the game. That's why he stepped aside.

The issue had less to go with Quinn and far more to do with Henderson & Mallory.  They were so bad coaching the back end.  
 

Quinn did not forget how to coach a defense

 

And if you remove the Houston & Cardinals game the defense was allowing just 330 ypg Weeks 1-8.  The issue was the offense turning the ball over 15 times the first 8 games.  Plus numerous TO on downs by the offense

Defense YPG:

Week 1: 269

Week 2: 280

Week 3: 379

Week 4: 365

Week 5: 600

Week 6: 442

Week 7:  381

Week 8:  322

[falcons007]

3 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

The issue had less to go with Quinn and far more to do with Henderson & Mallory.  They were so bad coaching the back end.  
 

Quinn did not forget how to coach a defense

 

And if you remove the Houston & Cardinals game the defense was allowing just 330 ypg Weeks 1-8.  The issue was the offense turning the ball over 15 times the first 8 games.  Plus numerous TO on downs by the offense

Defense YPG:

Week 1: 269

Week 2: 280

Week 3: 379

Week 4: 365

Week 5: 600

Week 6: 442

Week 7:  381

Week 8:  322

Lmao, did you watch the games and or looking at some meaningless stats? DQ had no clue how to run the defense in first 8 weeks. Couple of dumb things he did among others.

1.  The run defense was atrocious with those crappy Under and over fronts. Vikings, Titans ran over the falcons. DQ was too dumb to understand he didn't have the DL nor Personnel to run those hybrid fronts. Ulbrich realized that and had more traditional front on early downs during the last 8 games. 

2. The big difference on the back end was Raheem Morris moving away from single high safety after realizing Kazee wasn't cut out for cover 3. 

On the offense with turnovers, the offense had to keep forcing the ball when there is historically worse Defense on the other end. The offense had no luxury to sit back and get the ball back. Texans game summed up the first eight games defense and offense. Offense gets the score to with in 8 points, the Defense gives up big play immediately. Then came pick 6 with score at 32- 40. The defense doesn't need to be top 5, it can't be historically worse. 

 

[falcons007]

21 hours ago, Vandy said:

Good post. In other words, coaching matters. 

Didn't you hear? Itss never DQ's fault, its execution, TD, DK, Henderson, Mallory or who ever. 

[falcons007]

Other than DVOA, expected points is another advanced stat which sums up the flow of game with down, distance, turnovers on both offense and defense. Here is the first 8 weeks expected points. 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/atl/2019.htm

 

Outside of the Eagles game, the Defense was dumpster fire in first 8 weeks. The offense was on positive side till the Rams game. 

[FalconFanSince1970]

On 6/24/2020 at 5:06 PM, Vandy said:

Good post. In other words, coaching matters. 

More than execution? LMAO.

[UnrealfalcoN]

4 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

More than execution? LMAO.

Execution has nothing to do with coaching? 😂

[FalconFanSince1970]

23 hours ago, UnrealfalcoN said:

Execution has nothing to do with coaching? 😂

Throwing stupid as picks, dropping balls, whiff blocking, missing tackles, committing dumass penalties, putting the ball on the rug, getting physically beat in coverage, not turning your head around, blowing coverage assignments, getting stoned by OLinemen on pass rushes, getting punts blocked, not shedding blocks, missing chipshot FGs are more a function of bad player execution than bad coaching. These are pros who have been playing football since peewee league. They are expected to execute these fundamentals. These things absolutely killed us the last two years. Not coaching.

[kiwifalcon]

Game planning has to do with coaching.

Lack of development has to do with coaching.

In game bone head decision making has to do with coaching.

Lets execute a bone headed game plan 

Lets not develop players 

Lets make bone head decisions in game.

Lets EXECUTE that.

Lets not set an IDENTITY let’s do that oh wait we are.

[UnrealfalcoN]

12 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Throwing stupid as picks, dropping balls, whiff blocking, missing tackles, committing dumass penalties, putting the ball on the rug, getting physically beat in coverage, not turning your head around, blowing coverage assignments, getting stoned by OLinemen on pass rushes, getting punts blocked, not shedding blocks, missing chipshot FGs are more aa function of bad player execution than bad coaching. These are pros who have been playing football since peewee league. They are expected to execute these fundamentals. These things absolutely killed us the last two years. Not coaching.

Then the coaches should be making the players work on these things during practice and demand better. 

Belichick works his players with seemingly no talent until they're polished. His no name players would never have poor execution 2 games in a row meanwhile talent gets squandered in Atlanta year after year

[kiwifalcon]

6 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

The issue had less to go with Quinn and far more to do with Henderson & Mallory.  They were so bad coaching the back end.  
 

Quinn did not forget how to coach a defense

 

And if you remove the Houston & Cardinals game the defense was allowing just 330 ypg Weeks 1-8.  The issue was the offense turning the ball over 15 times the first 8 games.  Plus numerous TO on downs by the offense

Defense YPG:

Week 1: 269

Week 2: 280

Week 3: 379

Week 4: 365

Week 5: 600

Week 6: 442

Week 7:  381

Week 8:  322

For me it wasn’t one side of the ball it was both.

This has to do with coaching and game planning.Basically what happend to the Falcons was the perfect storm not one part of the team complimented thee other this is the issue.Cohesion between the phases and poor preparation and game planning.

Teams had a beat on what we were trying to do and to me it looked like we weren’t prepared for it.We just kept executing poor game plans both sides of the ball the first half of the season.

So Quinn basically supplemented wholesale change to his defense and the tide turned the players responded to a different plan and voice.

[falcons007]

13 minutes ago, UnrealfalcoN said:

Then the coaches should be making the players work on these things during practice and demand better. 

Belichick works his players with seemingly no talent until they're polished. His no name players would never have poor execution 2 games in a row meanwhile talent gets squandered in Atlanta year after year

You should watch football life of Bill Belichick. They had few episodes of 2009 season how the team prepares and so on. Heck even Brady talks to him on the offensive plays and gets his approval. He prepares the players on what to watch, expect and their roles. The players goes and execute most of the time. Coaching is a big deal as the parity in NFL players is close.

[10 Yard Fight]

*Wait-And-See Mode Activated*

[Vandy]

3 hours ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

More than execution? LMAO.

SMH. See below.

2 hours ago, UnrealfalcoN said:

Then the coaches should be making the players work on these things during practice and demand better. 

Belichick works his players with seemingly no talent until they're polished. His no name players would never have poor execution 2 games in a row meanwhile talent gets squandered in Atlanta year after year

Yup. 

2 hours ago, falcons007 said:

You should watch football life of Bill Belichick. They had few episodes of 2009 season how the team prepares and so on. Heck even Brady talks to him on the offensive plays and gets his approval. He prepares the players on what to watch, expect and their roles. The players goes and execute most of the time. Coaching is a big deal as the parity in NFL players is close.

Yup 2.0. 

[Vandy]

3 hours ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Throwing stupid as picks, dropping balls, whiff blocking, missing tackles, committing dumass penalties, putting the ball on the rug, getting physically beat in coverage, not turning your head around, blowing coverage assignments, getting stoned by OLinemen on pass rushes, getting punts blocked, not shedding blocks, missing chipshot FGs are more aa function of bad player execution than bad coaching. These are pros who have been playing football since peewee league. They are expected to execute these fundamentals. These things absolutely killed us the last two years. Not coaching.

Every bit of that happened, and every bit of that was because team was poorly prepared coming out of gate game 1. That’s coaching 101, and yes that’s true even in pee wee football. 
 

Game 1 minny ran the ball right down our throat, and Quinn made no adjustments to stop it. How many throws did their QB have that game, 10? That’s embarrassing. Our D also made Jacoby Brissett and Marcus mariota look like pro bowl QBs.
 

bottom line...Our DC got his *** handed to him 1st 8 games of season by opposing OCs, until he finally replaced himself and suddenly/magically the players started executing. Funny how that works. 
 

 

[kiwifalcon]

22 minutes ago, Vandy said:

Every bit of that happened, and every bit of that was because team was poorly prepared coming out of gate game 1. That’s coaching 101, and yes that’s true even in pee wee football. 
 

Game 1 minny ran the ball right down our throat, and Quinn made no adjustments to stop it. How many throws did their QB have that game, 10? That’s embarrassing. Our D also made Jacoby Brissett and Marcus mariota look like pro bowl QBs.
 

bottom line...Our DC got his *** handed to him 1st 8 games of season by opposing OCs, until he finally replaced himself and suddenly/magically the players started executing. Funny how that works. 
 

 

I don’t get it what are we missing.

To me it’s so clear what’s wrong with this team the last 2 years it’s borderline sickening.

Offensively potentially we have the talent to have a top 5 offense every year since 2016 but have stuttered around the midfield.

Defensively like you mentioned DQ showed humility and vulnerability and handed the reigns over to Rah & Brick and the team responded if that isn’t coaching man I don’t know what is.

[falcons007]

1 hour ago, Vandy said:

Every bit of that happened, and every bit of that was because team was poorly prepared coming out of gate game 1. That’s coaching 101, and yes that’s true even in pee wee football. 
 

Game 1 minny ran the ball right down our throat, and Quinn made no adjustments to stop it. How many throws did their QB have that game, 10? That’s embarrassing. Our D also made Jacoby Brissett and Marcus mariota look like pro bowl QBs.
 

bottom line...Our DC got his *** handed to him 1st 8 games of season by opposing OCs, until he finally replaced himself and suddenly/magically the players started executing. Funny how that works. 
 

 

The worst part was QB found rhythm playing the Falcons. Mariotta lost his jobs couple games after playing falcons. Kyler Murray was looking like a big bust. Deshaun Watson flat out sucked first 5 weeks before playing Falcons. It was disgraceful, in words of Jim Mora. 

Change the rant to Defense for first half of 2019, Falcons couldn't do diddly poo defensively.... 

 

[falcons007]

1 hour ago, kiwifalcon said:

I don’t get it what are we missing.

To me it’s so clear what’s wrong with this team the last 2 years it’s borderline sickening.

Offensively potentially we have the talent to have a top 5 offense every year since 2016 but have stuttered around the midfield.

Defensively like you mentioned DQ showed humility and vulnerability and handed the reigns over to Rah & Brick and the team responded if that isn’t coaching man I don’t know what is.

The body language showed in those games Kiwi, the team wasn't prepared nor confident to go play. I remember making a thread after the Houston game. I was 3 rows behind the falcons bench, there was no energy in how the defense came out in second half. Ryan was the only two guys trying to rally the team and fight till 4th quarter.

https://boards.atlantafalcons.com/topic/4073272-watching-this-team-on-side-lines-this-team-has-quit

 

Its pretty much same story in 2018, I was right behind Falcons bench in Cleveland. The last few weeks, the defense came out prepared.

[FalconsIn2012]

10 hours ago, falcons007 said:

Lmao, did you watch the games and or looking at some meaningless stats? DQ had no clue how to run the defense in first 8 weeks. Couple of dumb things he did among others.

1.  The run defense was atrocious with those crappy Under and over fronts. Vikings, Titans ran over the falcons. DQ was too dumb to understand he didn't have the DL nor Personnel to run those hybrid fronts. Ulbrich realized that and had more traditional front on early downs during the last 8 games. 

2. The big difference on the back end was Raheem Morris moving away from single high safety after realizing Kazee wasn't cut out for cover 3. 

On the offense with turnovers, the offense had to keep forcing the ball when there is historically worse Defense on the other end. The offense had no luxury to sit back and get the ball back. Texans game summed up the first eight games defense and offense. Offense gets the score to with in 8 points, the Defense gives up big play immediately. Then came pick 6 with score at 32- 40. The defense doesn't need to be top 5, it can't be historically worse. 

 

LOL...heading into week 5 the offense was scoring a whopping 17 ppg.  They also turned the ball over 8 times which opponents turned into 51 points.  All of the Vikings points came off TO’s.  
 

The run defense:  weeks 1-8 allowed 940 yards.  Weeks 9-17 allowed 830 yards.  We played really well in our bear fronts late in 2018 so that must have been the logic for the move to 53/34 looks.  I never liked the move and ultimately it was Quinn who moved us back to 43 under, not Ulbrich. 
 

Your take on the offense “having to force” things because of an historically bad defense is laughable.  Your constant defense of Koetter is weird.  I get supporting your team, but it’s ok to call Koetter below average until he proves otherwise.  To your point, let’s look at a few of the games:
 

Vs Minnesota: the offense goes 3 & out and gets punt blocked.  Next possession Ryan throws INT.  Two possessions later Freeman fumbles.  3 of the first 4 possessions of the season were TO’s that created short fields.  This game falls squarely on the offense cause the “historically bad” defense allowed 260 total yards and had to overcome 4 short fields.  
 

Vs Eagles: a game we controlled for the most part.  Should have been a blowout.  Defense forced several early TO’s but the offense could not do crap with the short field.  We refused to run and despite having a lead threw the ball all game and ultimately had several late INT’s that let Philly back in the game.  Another solid job by the defense and crap the bed performance by the offense.  
 

So far it’s the defense carrying the squad.  Heading into Week 3 they allowed just 270 total ypg & forced 3 TO’s.  The ppg looks bad because of 7 TO’s by the offense.  How is a defense supposed to overcome that? 

[FalconsIn2012]

On the season, we had 25 TO’s on offense and 17 of them came in games we lost.  Turnovers still decide who wins and who looses most of the time.  Unfortunately, DK’s offenses are always turnover prone.  They are pass happy and require longer throws into tighter windows.  His teams will move the ball easily between the 20’s and sputter in the redzone.  It’s every single year with him...and that’s  why I don’t like him as an OC.  
 

A good OC makes football easier for his players.  Koetter does the opposite.  He requires his WR’s to run longer routes, his OL to hold their blocks longer and his QB’s to make more difficult throws.  Explosive plays are great, but how about some efficiency.  It’s ok to play pitch & catch and let your playmakers make plays.

[FalconsIn2012]

3 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

I don’t get it what are we missing.

To me it’s so clear what’s wrong with this team the last 2 years it’s borderline sickening.

Offensively potentially we have the talent to have a top 5 offense every year since 2016 but have stuttered around the midfield.

Defensively like you mentioned DQ showed humility and vulnerability and handed the reigns over to Rah & Brick and the team responded if that isn’t coaching man I don’t know what is.

Last year was all about turnovers.  

• First 8 weeks we were -11 TO margin and predictably went 1-8.

• Final 8 weeks we were +6 TO margin and went 6-2.

Play clean games and our talent should be enough to win more often than not.