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The Welcome to the #Resistance, AG Barr Thread


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1 hour ago, Leon Troutsky said:

By the way, here’s a website from political scientist Michael McDonald who collects data on turnout:

https://electproject.github.io/Early-Vote-2020G/index.html

Every Sunday he puts out a weekly evaluation.  In the past, it was mostly about percent turnout and number of people who voted already.  But this Sunday he said that he might include some predictives or analysis of partisan lean.  It’s not like a forecast, but it should have some interesting insight.

So... did some number crunching on this. According to Wikipedia, the only counties that went blue in 2016 were Shelby, Davidson, and Haywood.

Voting is at 98.5% of 2016 turnout in those counties whereas voting is at 88.6% in red counties in 2016. So it does look like Dem areas are turning out in greater numbers so far. 

Highest turnout (Trump vote in 2016) - Turnout % compared to 2016:

Williamson (64% Trump in 2016) - 115%

Wilson (69%) - 110%

Rutherford (60%) - 112%

Loudon (75%) - 105%

Davidson (34%) - 102%

Cheatham (71%) - 104%

Based on the numbers I'm seeing, seems like an election margin like 2012 could be possible (Romney won by 20%)

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1 hour ago, eatcorn said:

No clue what your first two sentences are saying there.

I'm not entirely sure how we'd gauge percentage of what gets 'seen', but if there's good work out there, and someone is opting for garbage, that's on them, not the garbage.

The point is that rejecting 'the media' is lazy.

I’m saying you guys will reject someone like Marla being onboard with some ideas you agree with just because she wasn’t specific enough or pure enough in the dogma.

I’m not going to defend her arguments, I disagree with a lot of them. I just thought reacting to her comment the way a few of you did was strange. Like dogs just barking at her for walking in the neighborhood. How many people here bang on “the media” in broad, general terms? Possibly everyone at some point.

My local newspaper has some excellent journalism. Award winning journalists as a matter of fact. The paper struggles to stay in business and has very limited reach. There are many thousands of outlets for journalism and the vast majority of them have very limited reach. Most people rely on the most visible brands because they carry a certain reputation or political bent. Pretending like this is somehow different if you’re a conservative or a liberal or leftist is just goofy. 
 

1 hour ago, achilles return said:

i just think people conflate "excellent journalism" with nonpartisanship, or rather, an ideological centrism that tries to maintain a constant middle between two moving "sides". 

it's possible recognize a paper of record like the nytimes for it's generally decent journalism, and also recognize that it's editorial board has a specific ideological slant. these things are not necessarily mutually exclusive. 

 

I agree to an extent, but nonpartisan is not a dirty word and “centrism” is as broad and vague a description as there is in politics. It’s essentially just not subscribing to an ideological extreme.

I will say that excellent journalism is as much about the way a story is told as it is about the content itself. It is also inherently unbiased with regard to the parties involved. 

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2 minutes ago, Carter said:

I’m saying you guys will reject someone like Marla being onboard with some ideas you agree with just because she wasn’t specific enough or pure enough in the dogma.

I’m not going to defend her arguments, I disagree with a lot of them. I just thought reacting to her comment the way a few of you did was strange. Like dogs just barking at her for walking in the neighborhood. How many people here bang on “the media” in broad, general terms? Possibly everyone at some point.

My local newspaper has some excellent journalism. Award winning journalists as a matter of fact. The paper struggles to stay in business and has very limited reach. There are many thousands of outlets for journalism and the vast majority of them have very limited reach. Most people rely on the most visible brands because they carry a certain reputation or political bent. Pretending like this is somehow different if you’re a conservative or a liberal or leftist is just goofy. 

I reject marla because she's a sociopath, a hypocrite, and a liar.

If you care to look back into the deep dark archives of this board, you'd see that I've made this same argument a number of times, in response to a number of different people. This isn't a knee-jerk reaction for me. I've felt that blaming 'the media' is a lazy cop out for some time now.

Yes, lots more people see cable news. That doesn't mean that 'the media' is to blame for those people lapping up their garbage. 

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14 minutes ago, eatcorn said:

I reject marla because she's a sociopath, a hypocrite, and a liar.

If you care to look back into the deep dark archives of this board, you'd see that I've made this same argument a number of times, in response to a number of different people. This isn't a knee-jerk reaction for me. I've felt that blaming 'the media' is a lazy cop out for some time now.

Yes, lots more people see cable news. That doesn't mean that 'the media' is to blame for those people lapping up their garbage. 

I think there is certainly a discussion and some accountability to be had though regarding mainstream media’s role in the increasingly tribal, hyper partisan nature of American politics. They’ve largely opted for ratings and profits at the expense of truth and responsible discourse.

In any case “let’s burn down all media and start over” is a very vague statement that can be taken in different ways so I should probably just let Marla clarify it for herself if she cares to.

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7 minutes ago, Carter said:

I think there is certainly a discussion and some accountability to be had though regarding mainstream media’s role in the increasingly tribal, hyper partisan nature of American politics. They’ve largely opted for ratings and profits at the expense of truth and responsible discourse.

In any case “let’s burn down all media and start over” is a very vague statement that can be taken in different ways so I should probably just let Marla clarify it for herself if she cares to.

Oh of course. There are plenty of outlets that have turned to entertainment over news. They should be pretty easy to spot though, and the only reason they've done that is that people lap up entertainment.

As for marla: there's extensive posting history showing that she thinks 'the media' should just trumpet whatever garbage conspiracy theory she's obsessed with that day, or be 'burned down'....We know what she thinks, and it. is. stupid.

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Carter said:

I think there is certainly a discussion and some accountability to be had though regarding mainstream media’s role in the increasingly tribal, hyper partisan nature of American politics. They’ve largely opted for ratings and profits at the expense of truth and responsible discourse.

In any case “let’s burn down all media and start over” is a very vague statement that can be taken in different ways so I should probably just let Marla clarify it for herself if she cares to.

Eh...I'm just a sociopath so why bother?  😉

I agree with all that you said on the subject though.

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1 hour ago, Carter said:

I’m saying you guys will reject someone like Marla being onboard with some ideas you agree with just because she wasn’t specific enough or pure enough in the dogma.

I’m not going to defend her arguments, I disagree with a lot of them. I just thought reacting to her comment the way a few of you did was strange. Like dogs just barking at her for walking in the neighborhood. How many people here bang on “the media” in broad, general terms? Possibly everyone at some point.

My local newspaper has some excellent journalism. Award winning journalists as a matter of fact. The paper struggles to stay in business and has very limited reach. There are many thousands of outlets for journalism and the vast majority of them have very limited reach. Most people rely on the most visible brands because they carry a certain reputation or political bent. Pretending like this is somehow different if you’re a conservative or a liberal or leftist is just goofy.

my outright rejection of marla's media criticism is because her idea of good media means being deferential to the right regardless of fact. i've read enough of her own words to know it's not a substantive criique, and i think giving it unearned credit for merely being in the ballpark of a good take is damaging. maybe that's harsh, but hey, that's what happens when the girl cries hunter biden enough times to annoy me.

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I agree to an extent, but nonpartisan is not a dirty word and “centrism” is as broad and vague a description as there is in politics. It’s essentially just not subscribing to an ideological extreme.

see, and i would disagree here. non-partisan is a dirty word, at least to me, because it's inherently dishonest. it's pretending to be absent of ideology, but in reality, none of us are - and i'm immediately suspicious of sources that attempt to obscure or hide their ideological underpinnings. in fact this is a critique of mainstream media that i might nominally share with the right, but the difference is that the right's solution is to force a religious deference to their ideology in all forms of media whereas i merely require honesty and transparency. the nyt is a bourgeois liberal paper that advances a us-centric view of the world and especially of us foreign policy. i don't need to shut it down or necessarily change it's content, i just want it recognized for what it is. 

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I will say that excellent journalism is as much about the way a story is told as it is about the content itself. It is also inherently unbiased with regard to the parties involved. 

and i would strongly disagree here. in my opinion, excellent journalism is adherence to the truth. it makes no attempt to correct for "party bias" because the truth exists and if that impugns one party or the other, so be it. advocating for a false middle is one reason i personally think media is increasingly distrusted.  worrying about the appearance of bias while in service to the truth can only undermine your credibility. 

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