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The Joe Biden Presidency Thread


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Seems like rescuing dogs during lockdown is a thing around here. It happened to us this past week. This guy wandered up dirty and skinny, playing with my daughter in the front yard. After a few days o

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Just now, Jpizzle said:

Also the common position that a lot of conservatives like to take is that leftists want the government to run their lives.

 

The other common conservative position is that it's leftists who are burning **** down because they disagree with the government. 

 

 

Those feel like two mutually exclusive positions to me. I don't know how you can exist in both areas at the same time.......but here we be.

It's not surprising when there's that certain subset of conservatism that views anything not whatever their personal view of anarco capitalism looks like as THE left whether it's actually to the left or right of what they believe

Nazism is leftist. Facism is lefist They believe that **** and they'll never have to claim it or self evaluate to prevent it.

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Anyone gonna be surprised if Trump eventually responds to vote-by-mail by suggesting voter fraud that benefits him would be ok because the Democrats will definitely do it? I don’t think that would shock anyone. I’m actually kind of expecting it.

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16 minutes ago, Gritzblitz 2.0 said:

What's chilling is the cops know everyone has a camera phone.

And they still don't care.

 

On 6/1/2020 at 8:06 PM, Vogelgryff said:

The crap they do when they know there is a good chance they will be filmed. Imagine what they do when there is no camera around...

 

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Serious question to everyone back in Georgia, has there been any serious looting? Just skimming the past couple pages, I get the feeling that a lot of people seem to be trashing the police response to some of these protests, but not a lot of discussion of the violence and looting that is also occurring. I will admit I didn’t go back through the past 50 pages in the last week, so I may have missed it. 
 

I now live in San Francisco, and work in Oakland. I was at a peaceful protest in Oakland last Friday, and left well before sun down. A bit after I left, a federal security guard/officer was murdered in a targeted killing, and another wounded. While that news was making it through the crowd, and once the sun started setting, opportunists, without much overlap with protesters, began looting and burning. 
 

They looted and tried to burn a Target a block from my office. Above that Target were about 200 new apartments, and graffiti on the building complained about”gentrifiers.” Many other stores in Oakland and San Francisco were looted that night, and then all over the Bay Area the rest of the weekend. The next day, 2 gun stores in the Bay Area were picked clean, and it appears the same group stole 16 cars from a dealership. Only part of this has been recovered. As the crime progressed, the response by the police started to increase in aggression. 
 

By Monday morning, most of the police around the Bay Area had been working 16 hour days, 3 out of 4 days. They were breaking. Their responses got more aggressive. I saw a water bottle get thrown from a crowd at police, which triggered tear gas. The Friday I was there in person, I watched water bottles, glass bottles, rocks, etc. be thrown at the line with barely a response. Things had changed. 
 

i guess my point of all this is as follows: the police actions in MN were appalling and demand justice. The protests were and are justified, but as the line between protester and looter blurred, and the police were pushed past their normal limits, the actions of both sides became more aggressive. There are certainly examples on both sides that were out of control. What I don’t see in the last couple pages is any real discussion of the context of these photos, just a bunch of shots at police response in the US as if it is somehow on par with much more brutal crack downs in Hong Kong, or brutal repression in Iran that has cost the lives of a thousand Iranians for every American protester who has been killed in the last decade. When did a demand for reform with America require this level of false equivalency? What am I missing?

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52 minutes ago, Return of the Gaucho said:

Serious question to everyone back in Georgia, has there been any serious looting? Just skimming the past couple pages, I get the feeling that a lot of people seem to be trashing the police response to some of these protests, but not a lot of discussion of the violence and looting that is also occurring. I will admit I didn’t go back through the past 50 pages in the last week, so I may have missed it. 
 

I now live in San Francisco, and work in Oakland. I was at a peaceful protest in Oakland last Friday, and left well before sun down. A bit after I left, a federal security guard/officer was murdered in a targeted killing, and another wounded. While that news was making it through the crowd, and once the sun started setting, opportunists, without much overlap with protesters, began looting and burning. 
 

They looted and tried to burn a Target a block from my office. Above that Target were about 200 new apartments, and graffiti on the building complained about”gentrifiers.” Many other stores in Oakland and San Francisco were looted that night, and then all over the Bay Area the rest of the weekend. The next day, 2 gun stores in the Bay Area were picked clean, and it appears the same group stole 16 cars from a dealership. Only part of this has been recovered. As the crime progressed, the response by the police started to increase in aggression. 
 

By Monday morning, most of the police around the Bay Area had been working 16 hour days, 3 out of 4 days. They were breaking. Their responses got more aggressive. I saw a water bottle get thrown from a crowd at police, which triggered tear gas. The Friday I was there in person, I watched water bottles, glass bottles, rocks, etc. be thrown at the line with barely a response. Things had changed. 
 

i guess my point of all this is as follows: the police actions in MN were appalling and demand justice. The protests were and are justified, but as the line between protester and looter blurred, and the police were pushed past their normal limits, the actions of both sides became more aggressive. There are certainly examples on both sides that were out of control. What I don’t see in the last couple pages is any real discussion of the context of these photos, just a bunch of shots at police response in the US as if it is somehow on par with much more brutal crack downs in Hong Kong, or brutal repression in Iran that has cost the lives of a thousand Iranians for every American protester who has been killed in the last decade. When did a demand for reform with America require this level of false equivalency? What am I missing?

Could simply be difference in context and location. I've protested in Denver and the looting has been minimal (good amount of graffiti though) while police response has been pretty dang brutal. I also think it makes sense to hold police to a higher standard, and value human life over material things, so the brutality towards people is looked at far harsher than the looting (for me). Looting/rioting has also diminished considerably the last few days, so there's that.

But yeah, killing cops is obviously unacceptable and could easily be part of that escalated aggression. Though a dozen protesters have died and hundreds have been wounded, so... just hard for me to lay the blame solely on that. It's a systemic issue where police take out their emotions on others and are rarely held to account. They need more training, more accountability, more mental health services, more resources for rreporting...more of just about everything besides military equipment lol.

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1 hour ago, Return of the Gaucho said:

Serious question to everyone back in Georgia, has there been any serious looting? Just skimming the past couple pages, I get the feeling that a lot of people seem to be trashing the police response to some of these protests, but not a lot of discussion of the violence and looting that is also occurring. I will admit I didn’t go back through the past 50 pages in the last week, so I may have missed it. 
 

I now live in San Francisco, and work in Oakland. I was at a peaceful protest in Oakland last Friday, and left well before sun down. A bit after I left, a federal security guard/officer was murdered in a targeted killing, and another wounded. While that news was making it through the crowd, and once the sun started setting, opportunists, without much overlap with protesters, began looting and burning. 
 

They looted and tried to burn a Target a block from my office. Above that Target were about 200 new apartments, and graffiti on the building complained about”gentrifiers.” Many other stores in Oakland and San Francisco were looted that night, and then all over the Bay Area the rest of the weekend. The next day, 2 gun stores in the Bay Area were picked clean, and it appears the same group stole 16 cars from a dealership. Only part of this has been recovered. As the crime progressed, the response by the police started to increase in aggression. 
 

By Monday morning, most of the police around the Bay Area had been working 16 hour days, 3 out of 4 days. They were breaking. Their responses got more aggressive. I saw a water bottle get thrown from a crowd at police, which triggered tear gas. The Friday I was there in person, I watched water bottles, glass bottles, rocks, etc. be thrown at the line with barely a response. Things had changed. 
 

i guess my point of all this is as follows: the police actions in MN were appalling and demand justice. The protests were and are justified, but as the line between protester and looter blurred, and the police were pushed past their normal limits, the actions of both sides became more aggressive. There are certainly examples on both sides that were out of control. What I don’t see in the last couple pages is any real discussion of the context of these photos, just a bunch of shots at police response in the US as if it is somehow on par with much more brutal crack downs in Hong Kong, or brutal repression in Iran that has cost the lives of a thousand Iranians for every American protester who has been killed in the last decade. When did a demand for reform with America require this level of false equivalency? What am I missing?

We talked about the looting and burning at great length when it started in Minnesota and Night 1 of the Atlanta protests. 

Other than that I'm not sure what you want us to talk about specifically unless we're just supposed to invest equal time/critiscm for its own sake. Lately the headlines of have been dominated by police going on ham on disproportionately less aggressive protestors or even outright peaceful ones even as many cities have achieved enough of a level of peace to give the protests a little more fishing line and lift the curfews. 

Surely you can see how it's more egregious when those we invest with authority and control all the power in the situation excercise violence than a random crowd of civilians with as much agency and varied motivations as there are people in the crowd. The tools to make looting and burning down Target illegal are already a matter of policy. Meanwhile not two hours ago we caught a police department in a bold lie that we only even know about cause it was caught on camera. If It wasn't for that the system is designed as such that they most likely gotten away with it. Because when all evidence is equal their word becomes reality and they alone posses the legal tools for coercive violence. They therefore must be held to the higher standard.

But if you want some of the disscussion to apparoch this from another angle then most of us would probably invite you to contribute.

To put it bluntly the few who've dropped in here to put emphasis on the looting and the police incitement have invaribly ended up trying to muddy the point of tge protests in favor of some narrative about Antifa terrorism or that they (the protestors) had it coming. 

Which isn't to say that the alternative view to the riots isnt there to be offered but we have quite obviously have different agendas so that's probably not always our focus.  Personally while I'm very concerned about people trying to hurt officers, I'm honestly not nearly as interested in most property damage when in comparison to human life and health, tho that isn't to say that that's meaningless either. 

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But really tl; dr,  kinda seems to me that nationally we're getting to a better place with how the crowds compose themselves (tho its still a work in progress) while the authoritative response has actually gotten more violent this week, (at least in hot spots) beginning Monday with the freaking executive branch ordering up an assault on a peaceful assembly.

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We went from "OMG the capital is on fire yall!" in DC just 4 nights ago to "yeah yall don't even need a curfew".It seems to be at least "improving" everywhere but New York, where let's be honest the police department seems to be reveling in making an *ss out of themselves right next to the looters.

I don't think Atlanta had had a serious problem from the crowds but that first night.  Night 2 they tried to build a barricade over by the Ferris Wheel, got overran promptly and the rest  of the night was more on the police culminating in that couple that got dragged out of their car.

Imo they've been unlawfully quick to start breaking out the zip tie cuffs even before curfew here and there but really since the weekend everybody on both sides have been cool here from what I can tell.

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I've made it known that I'm fully aware that blacks in America have been treated extremely poorly and unfair in this country's entire history. But can we also admit that that not all racial violence is whites against blacks or any other minority group? Several years ago I got into a discussion with someone that tried to convince me up and down that blacks could not be racist and I'm still dumbfounded by such a sentiment. Several years ago my brother was very badly beaten up and nearly lost an ear and ended up in the hospital simply because he was white and found himself in the wrong place at the wrong time and was jumped by a group of black guys. Blacks or any other group of people are just as capable of being racist as whites are, it's just not something we hear about because of how out of proportion it is when it's compared to whites. I get that, but that doesn't make it right.

The problem with this country isn't a whites or blacks or Latino or any other group problem. The problem in this country is a human problem. There are terrible humans in every single ethic group on the planet. Instead of screaming for black lives matter we should be screaming for all lives matter. Every life is precious and important and such be treated as such. Racial violence of any kind shouldn't be accepted. If a white person is committing hate crimes against blacks they should be brought to justice. If a black person is committing hate crimes against whites they should be brought to justice. If a Latino person is committing hate crimes against a white or black person they should be brought to justice. But it shouldn't just end there. If whites are committing hate crimes toward other whites they should be brought to justice and same for any other ethic group.

We need to stop looking at this as a police vs. people problem but as a human vs. human problem. Sadly for too many decades we've put the police up on a predistool that grants them the ability to abuse their powers because they know they won't be held accountable for it. Did you know that officers in the state of Alabama cannot be held liable for any car accidents they are at fault for. They can kill someone and nothing can be done because they're granted immunity in such cases. Who in their right mind thought it was a great idea to put the police in a position to where they could openly abuse their power without fear of prosecution. I hate that I'm even having to say such because I've got a few friends who are cops and they're truly good people who don't think they're above the law but far too many do. We need full fledged police reform. The images that I've seen the last week plus of peaceful protesters or even people that have nothing to do with protests being harmed by overzealous police officers needs to stop. We need to change the way we view police officers. We need to realize they are not above the law and start treating them as such. It's not a problem that can be fixed over night but it can and should be fixed one person at a time. I hope to one day live in a world where no one should have to fear the police because of their skin color.

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10 hours ago, WhenFalconsWin said:

Gramps, take WFW advice, I think it is past you latest depends changing...saying this as a friend buddy, there is not enough Fabreze in your house to combat that smell. 

🇺🇸 Biden in a landslide!    Bunker Boy has fk'ed this country up long enough. He needs to return to civilian life where he can live the life of fraud that he is best suited for. He can return to swindling dummies like you that will succumb to his next scam.

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2 hours ago, Big_Dog said:

🇺🇸 Biden in a landslide!    Bunker Boy has fk'ed this country up long enough. He needs to return to civilian life where he can live the life of fraud that he is best suited for. He can return to swindling dummies like you that will succumb to his next scam.

^ew ew that smell

 

 

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