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FalconsIn2012

Scouting Report: Chaisson vs Young

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2 hours ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

Define "leading" because that defense had a heck of a lot of talent on it. He didn't really lead in anything but sacks....and that was by a slim margin. 

The guy has talent and is a jack of all trades. But he doesn't excel at any one thing. Players at the next level need to have a definitive strength. What's his?

Murray is an attacking LB that makes plays coming downhill. I also greatly disagree with his coverage "sucking" as you put it. That's a huge over exaggeration. I don't see much coverage coming from K'Lavon's tape at all. 

Leading I’ll describe it when they were playing Bama or Clemson they weren’t going well and on the sideline the defense huddled who was at the forefront of the players doing the talking.

Yes there is a lot of talent on that LSU defense Chaisson was the leader of that defense make no mistake.

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1 hour ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

Then Alex Highsmith Round 4

But we likely have no safeties under contract in 2021 (if Rico is cap casualty), so safety should be addressed twice in this draft.  If we can get Winnfield Rd 2 and JR Reed late I’m thrilled

Safety class is deep take two back to back 4b and 7th

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See this is the other misnomer about Chaisson and size.

Bama have some NFL sized Olineman 320 plus guy and thee above handles it.So when people talking like this tells me they haven’t watched this guy.Comparing him to Beasley when did you see Beasley play the run like this.

This too me shows exactly what your getting pretty much the best clips and descriptions I’ve seen of what he’ll be and how he’ll translate at the next level.

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1 hour ago, GATXBOI said:

As for talent everyone surrounding murray who is going to the draft is going 1st or 2nd round.

That's it with murray he is only label as a lb.

Chiasson was definitely a leader on that defense that's one of the reasons he wore the number 18

10 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

Leading I’ll describe it when they were playing Bama or Clemson they weren’t going well and on the sideline the defense huddled who was at the forefront of the players doing the talking.

Yes there is a lot of talent on that LSU defense Chaisson was the leader of that defense make no mistake.

To make a quick Basketball analogy, there's a reason folks don't respect Kevin Durant's championships with Golden State. Everyone recognizes he's talented, but that team was already stacked with elite players without him. 

Chaisson is surrounded with elite defensive prospects at virtually every position. Now maybe that contributed to his lack of production. And I absolutely acknowledge the esteem the team holds him in. However I was strictly discussing ON THE FIELD leadership. Not sideline pep talks or good off field character. This team has enough boy scouts. We need guys that can produce between the numbers. And the fact is Chaisson has not proven he can do that consistently. 

I'm sorry if I come off as being difficult. I'm truly only interested in getting the very best talent for our team to help us win. Chaisson is a Jack of all trades and master of none. I'd rather take a guy that I KNOW has at least 1 high level skill. To me Murray can come in Day 1 and lead the team in tackles for loss, especially if we pair him with a later round DT to put beside Grady. Chaisson is not a true DE or a true LB. Couple that with his ACL injury and lack of production I'm scared to bank a 1st rounder on him. That doesn't concern you all even a little?

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

To make a quick Basketball analogy, there's a reason folks don't respect Kevin Durant's championships with Golden State. Everyone recognizes he's talented, but that team was already stacked with elite players without him. 

Chaisson is surrounded with elite defensive prospects at virtually every position. Now maybe that contributed to his lack of production. And I absolutely acknowledge the esteem the team holds him in. However I was strictly discussing ON THE FIELD leadership. Not sideline pep talks or good off field character. This team has enough boy scouts. We need guys that can produce between the numbers. And the fact is Chaisson has not proven he can do that consistently. 

I'm sorry if I come off as being difficult. I'm truly only interested in getting the very best talent for our team to help us win. Chaisson is a Jack of all trades and master of none. I'd rather take a guy that I KNOW has at least 1 high level skill. To me Murray can come in Day 1 and lead the team in tackles for loss, especially if we pair him with a later round DT to put beside Grady. Chaisson is not a true DE or a true LB. Couple that with his ACL injury and lack of production I'm scared to bank a 1st rounder on him. That doesn't concern you all even a little?

People down kd for the warriors because you were up 3-1 lost and then signed with the team that beat him. That's what made it surreal plus they won without him.

As for Chaisson and Murray they both are great playmakers. I wouldn't be mad at taking either one  as long as that inside is secured.

Also If LSU ran a 4-3 he could still be de or lb that's what makes him unique. He can play both and be productive as well as effective. 

Both are what we need fast and physical 

Edited by GATXBOI

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Posted (edited)

@MD-FalconFan13

I just watched film on Murray. Now these are my opinions.

1. If anything inside linebacker on this defense. Would you replace debo with Murray?

2.He is a more athletic Campbell.

3.But his fit is a 3-4 Baltimore ravens Pittsburgh Steelers.

4. Everytime he went up against olinemen he got washed even mauled at times against LSU.

Now this is my arguement for Chaisson and I will no longer compare the two.

1. He is built for the outside. When he lines up its outside. 

2. Since its LSU pick one to recognize him as lb or de. True but in this league today he is a hybrid edge.

3. The man sets the edge tremendously and is on sound in coverage.

4. This dude can be a Jason Taylor type or an Bruce Irvin type... that's how deep his potential run. Since everyone wants us to resign Irvin.

5. Even if secluded to just full time de  we have Grady   and Fowler brah is gonna eat. Bring talk in on nascar.

 

Edited by GATXBOI

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3 hours ago, GATXBOI said:

I think the draft will fall to us and we are going to have to choose between Chaisson and a team wanting a QB wr or ot someone will want that 16 spot if we don't use it.

Go to look at alot of the top teams they are rebuilding. I'm only worry about the jets and raiders when it comes to Chaisson 

I really hope you are right. I just remember all the drafts where everyone talks up every qb and a bunch of them slide to later in the draft. You are right that a ton of teams need QB’s. And teams that have young QB’s have to be salivating over the talent at wide receiver.

I just hope teams don’t try to double dip in the first round by trading into the late first to get the QB or WR that falls. I always say if you have a QB you like then taking them in the 1st round makes sense with the extra year of control.

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3 hours ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

 

I hate to go back and forth, but I think you're making some very outlandish statements in regards to K'Lavon's abilities. He's not proven to be half the LB that Murray has. Again, Murray has more tackle THIS season than Chiasson's entire career. Same amount of PDs this season as Chaisson's career too. Let that sink in a bit. Also saying he's the "leader" of a defense with Delpit, the Thorpe award winner, AND Patrick Queen, a likely 1st Rd pick, is difficult to believe. Not to mention Stingley and Fulton who were 1 and 2 in the SEC in Pass Deflections making it tough to find any open receivers. Throw in JaCoby Stevens just for good measure. That defense was LOADED. 

What exactly makes Chaisson the leader?

You can make a solid case that Chaisson was the beneficiary of being surrounded by top notch talent. Everyone I named is either going to be a 1st or 2nd rounder this year or in the coming years. That's an overwhelming amount of talent. 

Murray however was the unquestioned leader of his defense. 

His team did. That is pretty much the only thing that matters. If your team looks at you and thinks you're a leader, you are.

 

https://fanbuzz.com/college-football/sec/lsu/lsu-jersey-18/

One of the most memorable things about athletes in sports are the numbers they wore. Michael Jordan is obviously No. 23, Wayne Gretzky is No. 99, and Tom Brady is No. 12, but LSU football has one of the most storied numbers in a single team’s history in all of sports.

In 2003, LSU was led to a National Championship by the first number No. 18, and ever since, the number has been passed down to football players who exemplify everything LSU Tigers. Who was the first though and how has it been passed down since then?

 

 

As for his lack of production....he was a 17 going on 18 year old coming into LSU. He barely played as a freshman. His soph year he had a sack and a tackle for a loss in his first game, but he tore his ACL. 2019 was his first full year starting. He's only 20 years old. He has tons and tons of growth potential.

 

 

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4 hours ago, GATXBOI said:

@MD-FalconFan13

I just watched film on Murray. Now these are my opinions.

1. If anything inside linebacker on this defense. Would you replace debo with Murray?

2.He is a more athletic Campbell.

3.But his fit is a 3-4 Baltimore ravens Pittsburgh Steelers.

4. Everytime he went up against olinemen he got washed even mauled at times against LSU.

Now this is my arguement for Chaisson and I will no longer compare the two.

1. He is built for the outside. When he lines up its outside. 

2. Since its LSU pick one to recognize him as lb or de. True but in this league today he is a hybrid edge.

3. The man sets the edge tremendously and is on sound in coverage.

4. This dude can be a Jason Taylor type or an Bruce Irvin type... that's how deep his potential run. Since everyone wants us to resign Irvin.

5. Even if secluded to just full time de  we have Grady   and Fowler brah is gonna eat. Bring talk in on nascar.

 

He played a heck of a game!

I'm starting to see what you see. I've continued my film study and though I don't like somethings, one thing I love is his non-stop motor. Its really impressive. Also I loved his rallying of the troops in the Peach Bowl. I think I'm starting to like him. 

Would you want to move up to get him?

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Edge setting has been an issue with Takk the last few seasons he tends to get get caught to square man up shoulder to shoulder in front of his opposite and gets caught guessing.

What Chaisson is showing you in this clip is how he secures the edge by getting to the outside shoulder of his opposite and forcing it back inside this alone would be a big improvement on the run defense side of things.

Also has the athleticism to defend RPO it showed it in this clip clearly.

 

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10 hours ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

Am I the only one that doesn't see the infatuation with Chiasson?

He's not really good at anything. Murray's skill set is much more desirable to me. He's got more tackles just this season than Chiasson does his entire career. His TFL this season almost match Chiasson's career totals. He's got the same amount of career sacks as Chiasson too. 

For a guy people are calling "the missing piece" Chiasson has a disturbing lack of quantitative production. Did I mention he also had an ACL tear in 2018? 

He's just about the same size as Murray as well. I think Chaisson can be a great player, but I just don't see why a guy with the measurable and performace that Murray has is being pushed down the board. 

The learning curve is steep with Chaisson. It will take about 3 years and he will have ups and downs. I’m kind of sick of thinking “Hey his athleticism is off the charts” and validating a pick based off that. His mental make up is better than Beasley but I don’t like taking players like Chaisson unless there is an elite defensive coach or player on the squad that can help him figure out his game. I like Javon Kinlaw more because at least at worse he can bullrush and collapse the inside pocket. If not him then Kenneth Murray to put at LB to replace De’Vondre Campbell he can do everything that Quinn wanted Campbell to do. Cover, rush the passer, diagnose plays and be aggressive. Playmaking type LB.

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1 hour ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

He played a heck of a game!

I'm starting to see what you see. I've continued my film study and though I don't like somethings, one thing I love is his non-stop motor. Its really impressive. Also I loved his rallying of the troops in the Peach Bowl. I think I'm starting to like him. 

Would you want to move up to get him?

 

5 hours ago, GATXBOI said:

@MD-FalconFan13

I just watched film on Murray. Now these are my opinions.

1. If anything inside linebacker on this defense. Would you replace debo with Murray?

2.He is a more athletic Campbell.

3.But his fit is a 3-4 Baltimore ravens Pittsburgh Steelers.

4. Everytime he went up against olinemen he got washed even mauled at times against LSU.

Now this is my arguement for Chaisson and I will no longer compare the two.

1. He is built for the outside. When he lines up its outside. 

2. Since its LSU pick one to recognize him as lb or de. True but in this league today he is a hybrid edge.

3. The man sets the edge tremendously and is on sound in coverage.

4. This dude can be a Jason Taylor type or an Bruce Irvin type... that's how deep his potential run. Since everyone wants us to resign Irvin.

5. Even if secluded to just full time de  we have Grady   and Fowler brah is gonna eat. Bring talk in on nascar.

 

Y’all see what y’all want to see on Murray. Y’all all so thirsty for a pass rusher y’all will take any one with the measurables that resemble your favorite pass rusher. Murray played inside at Oklahoma and dude still had as many sacks as the almighty Chaisson and this is with phenomenal defenders all over the LSU squad. Murray is the real deal but he played a position that isn’t prioritized by a lot of teams today’s game. But, if you have two playmakers on the second level that will force a lot of teams to either try to attack our defense deep, or check down/play the dink and dunk game which a lot of QB’s hate. In this pass happy league you need pass rushers, which we have already invested in, and a good LB core to protect the intermediate game and dammit all we have is Debo. It’s either Javon or Murray or bust.

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1 hour ago, Macintez said:

The learning curve is steep with Chaisson. It will take about 3 years and he will have ups and downs. I’m kind of sick of thinking “Hey his athleticism is off the charts” and validating a pick based off that. His mental make up is better than Beasley but I don’t like taking players like Chaisson unless there is an elite defensive coach or player on the squad that can help him figure out his game. I like Javon Kinlaw more because at least at worse he can bullrush and collapse the inside pocket. If not him then Kenneth Murray to put at LB to replace De’Vondre Campbell he can do everything that Quinn wanted Campbell to do. Cover, rush the passer, diagnose plays and be aggressive. Playmaking type LB.

So you ignore the vid presented and ignore what he did down the line in all the big games.

And all of a sudden Murray’s the guy oookkaaayyy then.You talk about learning curve you don’t think it’s as steep with Murray or is that just convenient for your argument.

Why is Murray a playmaker and Chaisson isn’t why is he going t9 have any less effect than Murray.He does more things for starters.

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7 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

So you ignore the vid presented and ignore what he did down the line in all the big games.

And all of a sudden Murray’s the guy oookkaaayyy then.You talk about learning curve you don’t think it’s as steep with Murray or is that just convenient for your argument.

Why is Murray a playmaker and Chaisson isn’t why is he going t9 have any less effect than Murray.He does more things for starters.

Jack of all trades and master of none is Chaisson. What is his definitive role on this defense if we pick him? Oh, when he comes in he’s going to get 10 plus sacks, cover TE’s and running backs, be an excellent run defender that takes excellent angles and just be the perfect LB... He has a good motor, ok, he has good athleticism... In the NCAA it’s players that make plays solely off of that. Will that translate to the NFL? Look all I know is that as soon as he steps into the NFL he will be playing with guys that are veterans, been playing in the league 5-6 years with a ton of experience with knowledge and good coaching. You better be a student in the classroom if you want to excel and he hasn’t had a lot of that at LSU. The **** with the burst off the snap they said the same thing about Beasley. It’s plenty of guys in this draft with explosiveness. Give me someone with that and the X/O knowledge to be in the right place and right time to make a play.

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13 minutes ago, Macintez said:

Jack of all trades and master of none is Chaisson. What is his definitive role on this defense if we pick him? Oh, when he comes in he’s going to get 10 plus sacks, cover TE’s and running backs, be an excellent run defender that takes excellent angles and just be the perfect LB... He has a good motor, ok, he has good athleticism... In the NCAA it’s players that make plays solely off of that. Will that translate to the NFL? Look all I know is that as soon as he steps into the NFL he will be playing with guys that are veterans, been playing in the league 5-6 years with a ton of experience with knowledge and good coaching. You better be a student in the classroom if you want to excel and he hasn’t had a lot of that at LSU. The **** with the burst off the snap they said the same thing about Beasley. It’s plenty of guys in this draft with explosiveness. Give me someone with that and the X/O knowledge to be in the right place and right time to make a play.

See again your uninformed the guy lives in the film room and everything he’s done is transferable.Take the edge setting for example go and have a look at Takk defending the run on the edge last year.

Then check Chaisson.

The NFL veteran bit that’s the same for every person entering the NFL what has that to do with anything.

What are you on about right place at the right time did you even watch that clip that’s exactly what Chaisson does.

Beasley and Chaisson aren’t the same player just be honest just say you don’t like the guy don’t make **** up he’s not this and that when there’s boat load of clips and game footage out there that says different.

Anyone that compares Beasley with Chaisson I know for **** sure hasn’t had a good look at him.

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11 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

Great post.  Spot on.

Chaisson’s final 4 games vs elite competition each week was obscene.  “In those games he recorded 20 pressures, five sacks, four hits, 11 hurries, 4.5 tackles for loss and 18 tackles. Because of that strong finish to the season combined with anticipated great combine numbers, Chaisson could set himself up as a first round draft pick.”

Obscene but the jack of all trades doesn’t cut it the next level apparently even though he puts numbers like this up against the best college football throws up.

Purple/

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19 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

See again your uninformed the guy lives in the film room and everything he’s done is transferable.Take the edge setting for example go and have a look at Takk defending the run on the edge last year.

Then check Chaisson.

The NFL veteran bit that’s the same for every person entering the NFL what has that to do with anything.

What are you on about right place at the right time did you even watch that clip that’s exactly what Chaisson does.

Beasley and Chaisson aren’t the same player just be honest just say you don’t like the guy don’t make **** up he’s not this and that when there’s boat load of clips and game footage out there that says different.

Anyone that compares Beasley with Chaisson I know for **** sure hasn’t had a good look at him.

You are pulling from one game. LSU got up and all they had to do was pin their ears back and rush the passer, EARLY in the game. Murray was neutralized Joe Barrow has demolished every defensive deep the entire season one player on defensive can’t overcome that. Chaisson is a 3-4 outside LB that can rush the passer and that’s IF you have the pieces around him AND you don’t ask him to do anything else. Murray can play ALL 3 LB positions all we have to do is plug and play him. What ppl on this board about Chaisson is the same mess people said about Barkevious Mingo, the sammme thing. Get me an LB that can lead on the field and can kill it in the classroom. Multiple NFL scouts have said Murray has top 15 or even 10 talent. I just can’t get on this Chaisson love train just because he’s fast with measurables.

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11 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

Great post.  Spot on.

Chaisson’s final 4 games vs elite competition each week was obscene.  “In those games he recorded 20 pressures, five sacks, four hits, 11 hurries, 4.5 tackles for loss and 18 tackles. Because of that strong finish to the season combined with anticipated great combine numbers, Chaisson could set himself up as a first round draft pick.”

Final 4 games vs elite competition.

1 game wake up there is boatloads of film out there your just not watching it and making **** up.

@Macintez.

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4 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

Final 4 games vs elite competition.

1 game wake up there is boatloads of film out there your just not watching it and making **** up.

@Macintez.

I’m not worried about people that co-sign you. LSU demolished every defense to where they couldn’t even run the ball because they were already behind and those were the best stats he could come up with? But he’s an elite prospect? Ok.

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13 minutes ago, Macintez said:

I’m not worried about people that co-sign you. LSU demolished every defense to where they couldn’t even run the ball because they were already behind and those were the best stats he could come up with? But he’s an elite prospect? Ok.

Imagine being upset because a player is good at everything. This is your argument. 

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10 hours ago, Macintez said:

The learning curve is steep with Chaisson. It will take about 3 years and he will have ups and downs. I’m kind of sick of thinking “Hey his athleticism is off the charts” and validating a pick based off that. His mental make up is better than Beasley but I don’t like taking players like Chaisson unless there is an elite defensive coach or player on the squad that can help him figure out his game. I like Javon Kinlaw more because at least at worse he can bullrush and collapse the inside pocket. If not him then Kenneth Murray to put at LB to replace De’Vondre Campbell he can do everything that Quinn wanted Campbell to do. Cover, rush the passer, diagnose plays and be aggressive. Playmaking type LB.

But can he cover, he sure wasn't asked to do it much at Oklahoma? There is a lot of projection there based on his athleticism and my worry is he is another Stephone Anthony or Jarrad Davis. If we go the off-ball LB route, I think Queen would be a safer pick because of his value in coverage. 

You might not be a fan, but the NFL places far more value these days on a guy like Chaisson over Murray.

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51 minutes ago, Macintez said:

I’m not worried about people that co-sign you. LSU demolished every defense to where they couldn’t even run the ball because they were already behind and those were the best stats he could come up with? But he’s an elite prospect? Ok.

I think you’re grasping at straws when it comes to Chaisson.  He is a well rounded OLB who can put his hand in the dirt or play standing up equally well.  A monster vs the run and solid yet high ceiling potential rushing the passer

 

Seahawks NFL Draft Profile: K'Lavon Chaisson

 
 
 
 
 

Strengths

Playing with a motor that is constantly running hot, Chaisson looks like a road runner rocketing off the edge at the snap and gains ground rapidly. He possesses an explosive initial step and even against top-tier opponents such as Alabama, opposing tackles often drew false start penalties trying to get into their pass sets early to compensate for his upfield burst and speed.

A quick twitch athlete, Chaisson has the flexibility and ankle flexion to quickly turn the corner on tackles and engulf opposing quarterbacks. Thanks to his elite lateral quickness for the position, he’s also superb executing stunt games and consistently disrupted the pocket rocketing through the A-gap after twisting inside.

 

While it comes in spurts and he can be overpowered by stronger linemen at times, Chaisson can be a disruptive force defending the run, as he produced 13.5 tackles for loss last season. He throws violent hands and uses his length effectively to create separation against blockers, especially when setting the edge. He pursues the football relentlessly sideline to sideline and excels finishing plays in space, including making tackles coming from the backside of the play frequently.

Often playing in a two-point stance for the Tigers, Chaisson proved himself capable of dropping into coverage against tight ends and has the athletic traits to excel as an off-ball defender in a 3-4 scheme. With a chiseled 250-pound frame, he has the ideal build for a modern EDGE hybrid and has room to add muscle once he enters the league.

Weaknesses

For all of the physical tools Chaisson brings to the table, his athleticism and tenacity haven’t always resulted in the type of production scouts look for from elite pass rushers. He finished with a respectable 6.5 sacks during LSU’s run to a national championship last year, but only had 3.0 sacks in 11 games prior.

While he’s displayed functional counters, including spin, swim, and rip moves, he struggles to consistently deploy them and often relies on his pure athleticism to beat blockers as a rusher. Once he’s locked up at the end of a speed rush and the tackle sets anchor against him, he will keep battling but hasn’t shown the consistent ability to get off of the block and properly utilize his pass rushing tool box.

From a technical standpoint, Chaisson is far more polished as a run defender and exhibits the mindset necessary to hold serve at the point of attack. But to play as a three-point defensive end in a 4-3 scheme at the next level, he will need to become friends with the weight room and add a bit more functional power to hold up in the trenches.

 

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