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mattyicefalcon

Ryan vs Rodgers = 2019 season

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3 hours ago, mattyicefalcon said:

I can see that...I was asking what do you guys see beyond that? 

Have you seen Rodgers play this season?

Hes the least explosive I have seen in past decade and yet hes been soo surgical and able to counter heavy pass rush.

They got a run game.surprised no one in the nfl gives aaron JONES his due...over 1000 rushing yards and 16 tds rushing.

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54 minutes ago, Schwarzwald said:

It’s play analysis not simple PPG. That doesn’t say how good an offense is or isn’t.

Why would a bipolar Winston be expected to be higher than middle of the pack in play to play rank?

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff/2019

But it’s an offensive efficiency stat, not a QB stat.  It seems illogical to score 30 ppg yet be labeled a bottom feeder in offensive efficiency.  I understand the turnovers matter, but they aren’t much impacting production

 

Lots of yards and average points = inefficient 

Lots of Yards and lots of Points = Efficient

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4 hours ago, FalconFanSince1969 said:

Aaron Jones is closing games, not Rodgers. Jones has as many rushing TDs as 22 teams.

 

There's your difference. Rodgers has a run game and doesn't have to attempt 633 passes (leads the NFL btw)

Bingo. A solid running game, and defense helps determine success.

If you look at the top 5 QBs in passing yards, depending on the Cowboys this weekend. All five could miss the playoffs.

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3 hours ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

But it’s an offensive efficiency stat, not a QB stat.  It seems illogical to score 30 ppg yet be labeled a bottom feeder in offensive efficiency.  I understand the turnovers matter, but they aren’t much impacting production

 

Lots of yards and average points = inefficient 

Lots of Yards and lots of Points = Efficient

They turn the ball over nearly 20% of their drives. That’s woefully inefficient. Falcons by comparison are at 13.6%...

And your post should clue you in on the answer. Their run game is 24th EPA/30th success rate. Their pass game is 13th EPA/11th SR. Hence, their overall rank being 17th. Not really bottom feeder.

PPG doesn’t tell you the whole picture of how they do with every play broken down. And, you can’t discount the turnovers; especially the rate with which it happens.

Edited by Schwarzwald

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7 minutes ago, Schwarzwald said:

They turn the ball over nearly 20% of their drives. That’s woefully inefficient. Falcons by comparison are at 13.6%...

And your post should clue you in on the answer. Their run game is 24th EPA/30th success rate. Their pass game is 13th EPA/11th ST. Hence their overall rank being 17th.

PPG doesn’t tell you the whole picture of how they do with every play broken down. And, you can’t discount the turnovers; especially the rate with which it happens.

So do they think TB should score 38pp?  I’m curious...under their model, they must assume with league average TO’s the Bucs would score 4-5 more ppg

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3 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

So do they think TB should score 38pp?

? What do you think they think? You can break down their offense and see what works and what doesn’t. If they do it for all teams, it’s not picking on Tampa. It helps understand them more.

Maybe if their pass game wasn’t throwing 2 picks a game or their offense didn’t lose the ball 1 in every 5 drives, their pass offense would be rated closer to top 5 instead of 13th/11th respectively; again hardly bottom feeder. :shrug:

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41 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

I’m curious...under their model, they must assume with league average TO’s the Bucs would score 4-5 more ppg

I don’t know enough about their metric code. But it certainly cuts into the value of their PPG if they are hurting their own Defense. I’d imagine their defense would be better if their offense could stay on the field. Chaos. Do they have many points allowed by the offense during a turnover; is it a pick 6 for example or fumble for a TD, or subsequently by the D on a short field? Makes that PPG average kinda hollow.

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8 hours ago, shc said:

THE difference is in the stats. Turnovers have kept us from being better. 

Not with how the defense played in the first 8 games.  I haven't looked up but is Ryan stats better in the second half than 1st half?  My guess is no yet the record is 1-7(or 1-6 if you want to) vs 5-2.  So Ryan TO wasn't the reason why Falcons didn't have a better record.  He could played mistake free and they might have went 2-6 or 3-5, but then again no QB can play mistake free.  Rodgers certainly didn't.

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It’s scheme and play calling, when Koetter stopped trying to force the ball to Stocker for some ungodly reason, Ryan’s ints cut down immensely.  Rodgers hasn’t even played that well, and please don’t try and say “look at his TD/int ratio”, it’s one of the least telling stats as to wether or not your qb is playing well or not.

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3 hours ago, treboyplay said:

I can’t believe Ryan and Rodgers are even being compared in any capacity. Numbers or not, the eyes tell me Rodgers is better. I know that’s not what the initial post was about, but I would never put Matt’s name near Rodgers. 

How many Packers games have you watched this year?  He has not played that well.

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20 hours ago, mattyicefalcon said:

Guys....this year what's the difference between these 2 QBs beyond stats below?

Why has Rodgers able to thrive soo much and Ryan production dropped? Inspite of putting MVP level stats last year almost identical to 2016?

What happened?

2019
 - Rodgers - 
3,679yds - 
24TD 
-3INT
----97.9

2019 - Ryan - 4153yds - 25TD - 14INT ---- 92.9 

Funny thing is, Lafleur has made Rodgers take a break from his natural playing style to just run a smooth offense in GB and make no mistakes and Rodgers has finally bought into it.. Being a balanced team and using the run will potentially prolong Rodgers career toowe should have tried to keep Lafleur tbh.. And he was smart not to gut that coaching staff when he came in. Its paying off

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4 hours ago, treboyplay said:

I can’t believe Ryan and Rodgers are even being compared in any capacity. Numbers or not, the eyes tell me Rodgers is better. I know that’s not what the initial post was about, but I would never put Matt’s name near Rodgers. 

Agree, Rodgers is probably one of the best passers to ever play professional football 

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21 hours ago, mattyicefalcon said:

Guys....this year what's the difference between these 2 QBs beyond stats below?

Why has Rodgers able to thrive soo much and Ryan production dropped? Inspite of putting MVP level stats last year almost identical to 2016?

What happened?

2019
 - Rodgers - 
3,679yds - 
24TD 
-3INT
----97.9

2019 - Ryan - 4153yds - 25TD - 14INT ---- 92.9 

Rodgers has been crap. Have you watched the games? Ryan has had a better season than Rodgers despite the INTs. TQBR for Ryan is at 61.1 while Rodgers is at 54. Rodgers has struggled to get 200 yards passing in games the last 7 weeks.

People screaming "but turnovers!" don't understand that the plays Ryan makes that Rodgers isn't making also count for something. What would our record be if Ryan was averaging around 200 yards passing per game the last 8 weeks?

Conversely, give Ryan Green Bays defense the first 8 weeks of the year and we have a shot at running the table. 

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2 minutes ago, Dr Long Shot said:

Rodgers has been crap. Have you watched the games? Ryan has had a better season than Rodgers despite the INTs. TQBR for Ryan is at 61.1 while Rodgers is at 54. Rodgers has struggled to get 200 yards passing in games the last 7 weeks.

People screaming "but turnovers!" don't understand that the plays Ryan makes that Rodgers isn't making also count for something. What would our record be if Ryan was averaging around 200 yards passing per game the last 8 weeks?

Conversely, give Ryan Green Bays defense the first 8 weeks of the year and we have a shot at running the table. 

You guys that don't watch football and just look at stats are a different breed.. No wonder yall look so silly many times trying to predict winners and losers.. Football is a team sport where stats have little to no bearing on the outcome.. Ryan is a prime example of that, all the useless stats in the world cants give him a championship ring

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1 hour ago, ⚡Slumerican⚡ said:

You guys that don't watch football and just look at stats are a different breed.. No wonder yall look so silly many times trying to predict winners and losers.. Football is a team sport where stats have little to no bearing on the outcome.. Ryan is a prime example of that, all the useless stats in the world cants give him a championship ring

Well apparently all the books in the world can't make you smart, so there's that...

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1 hour ago, Dr Long Shot said:

Rodgers has been crap. Have you watched the games? Ryan has had a better season than Rodgers despite the INTs. TQBR for Ryan is at 61.1 while Rodgers is at 54. Rodgers has struggled to get 200 yards passing in games the last 7 weeks.

People screaming "but turnovers!" don't understand that the plays Ryan makes that Rodgers isn't making also count for something. What would our record be if Ryan was averaging around 200 yards passing per game the last 8 weeks?

Conversely, give Ryan Green Bays defense the first 8 weeks of the year and we have a shot at running the table. 

I saw his entire play vs Vikings defense on the road.

And he was surgical.....even though he did not have a TOUCHDOWN.

He did not put his team in bad spot. 

But, agree that Packers defense and Aaron Jones  has carried him this year.

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2 hours ago, Boise Falcon Fan said:

This is true as well. I watched the game the other night, and Rodgers is constantly throwing 2 yard passed to Davante Adams.

Whatever it takes to keep moving chains.

I hate it when we just need few yards and Matt Ryan drops back 4-5 steps for big home run plays.....smh!

I mean gees! Get the first down ....get close to red zone and then freakin make them pay! 

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24 minutes ago, mattyicefalcon said:

I saw his entire play vs Vikings defense on the road.

And he was surgical.....even though he did not have a TOUCHDOWN.

He did not put his team in bad spot. 

But, agree that Packers defense and Aaron Jones  has carried him this year.

You cant teach monkeys new tricks.. You're wasting your time trying to explain to some of these guys how champions are won.. Just trying to save u a headache 

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