A TDWII Observation: The Falcons Should Run, Not Walk From McDaniels…

[TheDirtyWordII]

If we were having this conversation 5 years ago, I would have felt otherwise.  I did feel otherwise…but I’m off the McDaniels bandwagon.  Here’s why…

February 6, 2018: Technically, he was never the HC of the Indianapolis Colts.  But on this date, he left a franchise and assistant coaches he hired (Colts DC - Matt Eberflus for one) in the lurch by backing out of a handshake agreement.  To the extent the Patriots might find themselves playing into February…well, we’ll see.  But right from the get-go, you know that any time waiting for McDaniels to be done with the 2019 season with the idea of hiring him will be trepidatious.  Now, could McDaniels have a HC career if he carried through on a redux of this…maneuver, again?  Well, the chances are small.  At the same time…on February 7, most people projected that because of his actions, he may have trouble ever getting a HC job again.  Yet, less than two years later, here we are.  But, another more ominous cloud hangs over McDaniels.

The Specter of New England: Belichick is 67.  While he backed off previous statements that he’d likely step down from coaching by the time he was 68, 67 is still 67.  And perhaps more relevant to the immediate future direction of Patriots, Tom Brady is 42.  The bottomline to any team that chooses to hire McDaniels is that within the next 5 years, there is a decent chance that the HC position for the New England Patriots will come available.  An ownership group that essentially put hair on McDaniels chest will commence the process of finding their next HC.  And you can bet they’ll look at McDaniels, and McDaniels will look at them.  The history together, the legacy they created…?  It’ll mean something.  When that time comes, McDaniels might ultimately turn the Kraft’s away.  But he’s been stubbornly loyal to the Patriots to date, he loves the area.  His family loves the area.  When and if he leaves New England, there’ll be a ‘cloud of uncertainty’ with regard to his commitment to the franchise that hires him…and rightfully so.  I’d just assume leave it be.

The Fruit of the Belichick Coaching Tree?:  Yes, there are HC’s that have extensive experience…but consider Belichick.  He was the Linebackers Coach for the New York Giants when they drafted Lawrence Taylor.  Sean McVay was born on January 24, 1986.  Later that year, Belichick would go on to coordinate one of the fiercest defenses in this history of the NFL in propelling the Giants to their first SuperBowl title.  There is an experience and success level combination he brings to the table that is unparalleled.

From my POV, I consider BB the greatest competitive advantage in professional sports.  He’s playing/coaching a different game than everyone else because he is who he is.  Consider SB XLIX when he a) did not call time out down by the goal line as it looked like Seattle was about to win the championship because ‘something just didn’t quite look right’ and b). had made the switch in game to Malcom Butler, an undrafted rookie FA at the time when starting NB Kyle Arrington had been torched repeatedly earlier in the game and c) actually worked on defending the same exact play in practice in the lead up to the SB. in the   According to the documentary ‘Do Your Job’ it was the first time they were in that personnel grouping all season.  Four years later, BB would surprisingly and famously bench Butler as the Patriots lost SBLII.  When questioned about it in the postgame, BB simply stated something to the effect of 'we played the players we thought gave us the best chance to win'.  And that was that...ultimately, even his most visible failures are beyond reproach.

While from an Assistant Coach/Coordinator standpoint, McDaniels has as qualified a resume as anyone in the NFL, he’s been in the bowels of the belly of an organization that’s been able to operate differently than the other 31 NFL franchises simply because of the unassailable credibility Belichick brings to the table.  It’s allowed him to take action(s) other coaches/GM’s simply do not have the capital (or balls) to consider (release Lawyer Milloy, trade Richard Seymour, acquire Randy Moss, acquire Antonio Brown, etc…).  It’s called The Patriot Way…but it’s really Belichick’s Way.  We’ve seen countless examples of franchises trying to import The Patriot Way into their organizations.  Most of them failing miserably.

So someday, Belichick will retire.  Someday, Josh McDaniels will get his own team to run.  Which comes first…we’ll see, but for me…I’d leave well enough alone.  There are plenty of potential head coaches in the sea.

[The O.D.B]

Taking over the Patriots post BB and TB is a suicide mission. By taking over the Pats JM would, in all likelihood, Destroy his own legacy with the team. After BB and TB they will be the team that no one wants to work for because even a decent season will look like failure. 

[TheDirtyWordII]

3 minutes ago, The O.D.B said:

Taking over the Patriots post BB and TB is a suicide mission. By taking over the Pats JM would, in all likelihood, Destroy his own legacy with the team. After BB and TB they will be the team that no one wants to work for because even a decent season will look like failure. 

Whether that’s true or not, I’m inclined to let that situation play out post BB before considering JMc.

[octoslash]

That's a lot of argument there OP and I agree with you because...I just don't like the guy. 

 

[kschreck]

4 minutes ago, octoslash said:

That's a lot of argument there OP and I agree with you because...I just don't like the guy. 

 

My take is similar to yours.  I don't have the developed perspective with supporting data, I just think he's made some jerk moves and would rather he be someone else's jerk than ours.  Maybe he's learned his lesson from Denver, maybe he hasn't.  Personally would rather the Falcons NOT find out first hand.  

The jerk store called and they're all out of Josh McDaniels.

[TheDirtyWordII]

3 minutes ago, kschreck said:

My take is similar to yours.  I don't have the developed perspective with supporting data, I just think he's made some jerk moves and would rather he be someone else's jerk than ours.  Maybe he's learned his lesson from Denver, maybe he hasn't.  Personally would rather the Falcons NOT find out first hand.  

The jerk store called and they're all out of Josh McDaniels.

Solid Seinfeld analogy.  Well done.

[CraigSmackDaddy]

Agreed.  No to Josh.  My biggest problem with moving on from Quinn is that I don’t see anyone out there that will be available that I’d like to see as the next HC.  

[rcky_mtn_falcon]

Whether or not we hire him the last part of the OP's argument is a non factor in my opinion.

If after 5 years he wanted to go back to the Patriots.

1. In 5 years we will know if we want to keep him or fire him anyway.

2. If the Patriots contact him without team approval that would be considered tampering. (Not that the Patriots are above breaking a rule or anything)

3. If the team were to give the Patriots permission then we're looking at being compensated.

 

I really haven't decided who I want as HC yet, and I'm not entirely convinced that Quinn will be fired.

[TheDirtyWordII]

Just now, rcky_mtn_falcon said:

Whether or not we hire him the last part of the OP's argument is a non factor in my opinion.

If after 5 years he wanted to go back to the Patriots.

1. In 5 years we will know if we want to keep him or fire him anyway.

2. If the Patriots contact him without team approval that would be considered tampering. (Not that the Patriots are above breaking a rule or anything)

3. If the team were to give the Patriots permission then we're looking at being compensated.

 

I really haven't decided who I want as HC yet, and I'm not entirely convinced that Quinn will be fired.

Couple of things...

1.  What about if it was in 2021/2022?
2 & 3.  Kraft has too much respect for Blank to not be above board in his approach...but draft choice compensation in 2022 to have to embark on yet another franchise upheaval (the 3rd in 7 years), yes, we're getting something, but we're on the merry-go-round of being left behind.  Whatever we get back would pale in comparison.

[rcky_mtn_falcon]

12 minutes ago, TheDirtyWordII said:

Couple of things...

1.  What about if it was in 2021/2022?
2 & 3.  Kraft has too much respect for Blank to not be above board in his approach...but draft choice compensation in 2022 to have to embark on yet another franchise upheaval (the 3rd in 7 years), yes, we're getting something, but we're on the merry-go-round of being left behind.  Whatever we get back would pale in comparison.

I agree that Kraft and Blank are friends and I doubt Kraft would try the end around. However if McDaniels is under contract then Blank can simply say no, or make it very painful. Say 3 - 1st round draft picks, especially considering how late the Patriots generally pick in that round. Then hope that Brady falls off a cliff or retires leaving us with much higher draft pick compensation.

It's a gamble, but it might be worth it.

I'm not even saying I want McDaniels, I'm just saying if that's the guy I wanted I wouldn't let possible future unknowns be the reason I don't hire him.

[Geneaut]

End of the day anything we think we know about the guy is speculation. I don't get caught up in this kind of stuff because another thing is I've been spectacularly wrong on coaching hires my entire life.

Edited December 12, 2019 by Geneaut

[g-dawg]

McDaniels is gonna wait for the Pats job to open - and even if he doesn't - he will come scurrying back to the Pats as soon as Belicheck does leave - could easily see him taking the Falcons job and then leaving us two years later.   Guess if he did, the Pats would have to give us draft picks - but honestly you don't want your coach wanting to leave while he is accepting your job.

[TheDirtyWordII]

9 minutes ago, rcky_mtn_falcon said:

I agree that Kraft and Blank are friends and I doubt Kraft would try the end around. However if McDaniels is under contract then Blank can simply say no, or make it very painful. Say 3 - 1st round draft picks, especially considering how late the Patriots generally pick in that round. Then hope that Brady falls off a cliff or retires leaving us with much higher draft pick compensation.

It's a gamble, but it might be worth it.

I'm not even saying I want McDaniels, I'm just saying if that's the guy I wanted I wouldn't let possible future unknowns be the reason I don't hire him.

See, for me I see the leverage as the other way around.  If McDaniels wants to leave, then it’s Mora Jr. all over again, and Blank loses any leverage because he can’t have his HC be a guy who wants to be elsewhere.  Would they find a suitable package?  Likely...but Kraft steers that convo, not Blank.

[Hashbrown3]

Whomever it will be AB needs to understand their intentions on the front end & put stipulations in the contract maybe.  It could also work both ways as the new GM could have clauses stipulating AB stay out of the decision making process in certain areas.  But that could potentially lead to points of contention I imagine.  That’s why they have meaningful vetting processes I guess.

[TheDirtyWordII]

1 minute ago, HASHBROWN3 said:

Whomever it will be AB needs to understand their intentions on the front end & put stipulations in the contract maybe.  It could also work both ways as the new GM could have clauses stipulating AB stay out of the decision making process in certain areas.  But that could potentially lead to points of contention I imagine.  That’s why they have meaningful vetting processes I guess.

I agree, but is it possible to understand JMC’s intentions on the front end?

[FalconsIn2012]

9 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

McDaniels is gonna wait for the Pats job to open - and even if he doesn't - he will come scurrying back to the Pats as soon as Belicheck does leave - could easily see him taking the Falcons job and then leaving us two years later.   Guess if he did, the Pats would have to give us draft picks - but honestly you don't want your coach wanting to leave while he is accepting your job.

This tells me the succession plan after Belichick is Steve Belichick.

 

And why would McDaniels go back with no Brady?

[g-dawg]

2 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

This tells me the succession plan after Belichick is Steve Belichick.

 

And why would McDaniels go back with no Brady?

because he likes the organization and the rest of Belicheck's staff - that he could probably keep in place.     Also possibility that Belicheck might stay on as GM, etc.

Where is the attraction to Falcons for McDaniels?  aging Julio at end of career,  Matt Ryan is really good but probably for only a handful more of years - owner meddlesome, etc.

McDaniels has already taken a job and gone back once - he clearly has loyalty to Pats organization and seems to be satified waiting it out.

[Hashbrown3]

6 minutes ago, TheDirtyWordII said:

I agree, but is it possible to understand JMC’s intentions on the front end?

AB would def address it & put it in writing because it’s such an obvious consideration.

More likely JMC would NOT make himself available if his intentions were to be in NE in the future though.

[ATLFalcons11]

Monkey wrench = Steve Belicheck

Clearly being groomed by his father for the Patriots HC role. Kraft will be more loyal to that than Josh McDaniels.

[MilleniumFalcon]

1 hour ago, The O.D.B said:

Taking over the Patriots post BB and TB is a suicide mission. By taking over the Pats JM would, in all likelihood, Destroy his own legacy with the team. After BB and TB they will be the team that no one wants to work for because even a decent season will look like failure. 

He might be like BB, in that, he doesn't want to follow the legacy of Bill Parcells and create his own legacy somewhere else.

[Da_Truth]

No more Patriots cast offs!  Let him stay with Bill.

[Knight of God]

I want nothing to do with him

[PeytonMannings Forehead]

1 hour ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

And why would McDaniels go back with no Brady?

Coaches are competitive by nature, just as much as players and often with bigger egos. What bigger boom would it be to the ego than to put the Pats offense on top and win the big one without the franchise’s greatest player? Something not even BB has done.

[ParanoidAndroid]

I see your argument but at this point, I'm getting so jaded and desperate for a championship (Cleveland Browns level) that I'm winning to throw logic out the door and roll the dice. It can't get any lower than that Superbowl loss. 

[FalconsIn2012]

9 minutes ago, Knight of God said:

I want nothing to do with him

48 Games Without Brady: 17 ppg.  
 

But honestly, it’s his ego that’s concerning, not his football mind