caponine

If this team keeps Quinn,

61 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, caponine said:

And this team fails again. Does some of the blame start leaning towards Arthur Blank ?? I think so , time and time again he has shown the inability to bring in a coach with all the tools not a Jim Mora, Bobby Petrino, Mike Smith or Dan Quinn that had bits and pieces. He never brings in the right coach,  and you have to ask why.  Enough is enough,  he also had a track record for keeping coaches well past their welcome 

 

Mike Smith and Dan Quinn came as bout as close to winning a championship as you could get without winning it. I'd say they were good hires that ran it's course.

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5 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Exactly. @caponine is suggesting that Blank has held on to the coaches for too long. I actually think it’s the opposite. Sean Payton had 3 straight 7-9 seasons, was always trusted by the owner. 
 

OP is half right. Blank is definitely a big part of the issue. But the “why” is wrong. Blank certainly seems to chase and overreact like you said. Look at the Julio trade...that had Blank written all over it. Smitty ran a smash mouth running team. And it seemed like Blank demanded him to be what he isn’t. And he was fired. Koetter re-hire reeks of Blank, not Quinn

Not only 3 strait losing seasons but 4 out of 5 (peyton may have been suspended in 2012 bit his finger prints were all on it)

Also 2 out of his first 3 years had losing or only .500

For all of Peyton's sucess.....the saints have had their share of failure under him.

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1 hour ago, falconsd56 said:

Not only 3 strait losing seasons but 4 out of 5 (peyton may have been suspended in 2012 bit his finger prints were all on it)

Also 2 out of his first 3 years had losing or only .500

For all of Peyton's sucess.....the saints have had their share of failure under him.

I hate Payton, and can't believe I'm defending that stupid scumbag, BUT.....

Even during his stretch of 4/5 seasons of 7-9 football (yes, I count 2012, it was TOTALLY his, still had the same players and the rest of his people on the staff), the offense never went away. He is an offensive-minded coach, Brees was always putting up great numbers. The fact that their defenses were weak was a large part of their lack of success. Payton did his job, but the defense didn't.

Now Quinn? He's supposed to be a defensive guy, but the defenses under him haven't been good. He needs to go.

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There has been too much turnover every since ryan got here. I hate that quinn is slow to make changes that bothers me more than anything. I also hate starting over. Seems like the falcons are always starting over.

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10 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Because I think Quinn (and Smitty when he was here) don’t have as much control of the team as we may think. 

 I enjoyed thinking Jerry Jones was the worse owner in football. Good points have been made about Blank I’ll throw my two cents in how is a GM suppose to negotiate team friendly deals when the owner is saying in every media outlet Falcon for life. 

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13 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

What head coach in the NFL “brings the whole package?” There isn’t many man. Probably less than 5. Belichick, Carroll, Zimmer, Harbaugh, and maybe Tomlin?

And those coaches all are successful because the owner actually trusts them to run the team. Mike Smith and Dan Quinn both aren’t necessarily BAD coaches. It’s looking more and more like they had somebody upstairs dictating how to run the team instead of trusting the coach they hired to play to his own strengths. Why do you think Jimmy Johnson left Dallas? And why do you think Jerry Jones hasn’t been to the conference championship game since 1996? 

Point is, the trend is showing that Blank absolutely knows how to hire the right coach. What needs to happen is he needs to hire his coach, and stay the **** out of the room after that. 

Agree. I admit I was slow to accept that Blank was the issue. But more and more it certainly appears that he is the one mucking things up behind the scenes.

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14 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Blame has already started going on Arthur Blank. And one could argue that Mike Smith, Dan Quinn, and Jim Mora were all actually good hires. All 3 of them coached the Falcons to the NFC championship game. Before Blank was the owner, the Falcons made it there...once. 

^^^this^^^

14 hours ago, caponine said:

True but they dont ever have all the tools , they each had a piece but not the whole.package , ya know ?? 

lol just admit when you're wrong and move on- geeeeeeez

Edited by Shagpill 2.0

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8 hours ago, falconsd56 said:

Not only 3 strait losing seasons but 4 out of 5 (peyton may have been suspended in 2012 bit his finger prints were all on it)

Also 2 out of his first 3 years had losing or only .500

For all of Peyton's sucess.....the saints have had their share of failure under him.

God. I tried to argue that point. And people went batsh** crazy on me. Along with the Vicodan scandal , the bountygate and the 7-9s. But all TAFT can see is he is a super hero of a coach.

Peyton would have been fired in a heartbeat had he been a Falcons coach. And thats the point some here are making. Blank fires in a knee jerk reaction, while behind the scenes making it difficult for the coach to succeed in the first place.

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13 hours ago, ATLSlobberKnockers said:

Sean Peyton had 3 losing seasons in.a row

DQ is not Sean Peyton.  Sean Peyton actually seems like he's a little more than just an overpaid cheerleader.

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1 hour ago, runshoot said:

God. I tried to argue that point. And people went batsh** crazy on me. Along with the Vicodan scandal , the bountygate and the 7-9s. But all TAFT can see is he is a super hero of a coach.

Peyton would have been fired in a heartbeat had he been a Falcons coach. And thats the point some here are making. Blank fires in a knee jerk reaction, while behind the scenes making it difficult for the coach to succeed in the first place.

Sean Peyton would be hired immediately as a HC in the NFL if he was fired.  You can't say the same for DQ. 

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59 minutes ago, Boise Falcon Fan said:

Sean Peyton would be hired immediately as a HC in the NFL if he was fired.  You can't say the same for DQ. 

Youre saying that with hindsight. Everyone in TAFT is saying that with hindsight. 

Go back in time. 

Its 2012. Before the season starts your coach is banned for a year due to bountygate. The year prior your coach was found to have stolen vicodin from the team med locker. The football 2012 season, your team that your head coach put together goes 7-9. The next year your team goes 11-5 2nd in the division and the following 3 years in a row you go 7-9. At the end of the 2016 season you just saw your division rivals go to the superbowl. The year before that the other divisional rivals were in the superbowl. As a saints owner and fan, you're at the bottom looking up.

Its now Feb 2017. 1 winning season in the last 5 years. ONE! That includes 2 scandals, one of which gets your coach banned for a year!

If you are telling me that fans weren't calling for Paytons head you're lying. If you're telling me that he wasn't on the hot seat of hot seats, youre lying. If youre telling me national and local papers werent calling for his head, youre lying. Simple internet search shows how many wanted him gone.

And thats the point. In a window where Sean looked like a complete tool, 1 winning season in 5, with 4 of those being 7-9 seasons and 2 scandals, you cannot say he too didn't look like an overpaid cheerleader. But they stuck with him. He looked like a clown and they stuck with him.

Its a double standard here in TAFT. Sean payton can do no wrong because people have zero ability to look at anything other than the right here and now. But when you look back at how many bad seasons and the chaos that Sean had and was allowed to work through it, it makes you wonder what really should be done with DQ. 

We have an owner that acts like TAFT. Knee jerk reactions and dictating what needs to happen. N.O. on the other hand let their coach run the team and fix it.

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52 minutes ago, runshoot said:

Youre saying that with hindsight. Everyone in TAFT is saying that with hindsight. 

Go back in time. 

Its 2012. Before the season starts your coach is banned for a year due to bountygate. The year prior your coach was found to have stolen vicodin from the team med locker. The football 2012 season, your team that your head coach put together goes 7-9. The next year your team goes 11-5 2nd in the division and the following 3 years in a row you go 7-9. At the end of the 2016 season you just saw your division rivals go to the superbowl. The year before that the other divisional rivals were in the superbowl. As a saints owner and fan, you're at the bottom looking up.

Its now Feb 2017. 1 winning season in the last 5 years. ONE! That includes 2 scandals, one of which gets your coach banned for a year!

If you are telling me that fans weren't calling for Paytons head you're lying. If you're telling me that he wasn't on the hot seat of hot seats, youre lying. If youre telling me national and local papers werent calling for his head, youre lying. Simple internet search shows how many wanted him gone.

And thats the point. In a window where Sean looked like a complete tool, 1 winning season in 5, with 4 of those being 7-9 seasons and 2 scandals, you cannot say he too didn't look like an overpaid cheerleader. But they stuck with him. He looked like a clown and they stuck with him.

Its a double standard here in TAFT. Sean payton can do no wrong because people have zero ability to look at anything other than the right here and now. But when you look back at how many bad seasons and the chaos that Sean had and was allowed to work through it, it makes you wonder what really should be done with DQ. 

We have an owner that acts like TAFT. Knee jerk reactions and dictating what needs to happen. N.O. on the other hand let their coach run the team and fix it.

Fair or not, SP has a reputation as a really smart guy, and MANY teams would jump at the chance to have him as their head coach. That hasn't changed since the time he became a HC, so the "saying X in hindsight", doesn't really apply.  He's never really lost his luster.  DQ on the other hand, has lost his. To many, he seems like a high priced cheerleader.  SP has never come across as that type of HC. SP to DQ is apples to oranges. 

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18 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Blame has already started going on Arthur Blank. And one could argue that Mike Smith, Dan Quinn, and Jim Mora were all actually good hires. All 3 of them coached the Falcons to the NFC championship game. Before Blank was the owner, the Falcons made it there...once. 

You beat me to the punch with the blame already being there! 

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15 hours ago, rugger8 said:

Quinn should go because one week we can beat the Saints, and the next lose to Tampa Bay. There's a problem with consistency here. The problem is gutting the team is just another hard reset.

Bingo!

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1 hour ago, runshoot said:

Youre saying that with hindsight. Everyone in TAFT is saying that with hindsight. 

Go back in time. 

Its 2012. Before the season starts your coach is banned for a year due to bountygate. The year prior your coach was found to have stolen vicodin from the team med locker. The football 2012 season, your team that your head coach put together goes 7-9. The next year your team goes 11-5 2nd in the division and the following 3 years in a row you go 7-9. At the end of the 2016 season you just saw your division rivals go to the superbowl. The year before that the other divisional rivals were in the superbowl. As a saints owner and fan, you're at the bottom looking up.

Its now Feb 2017. 1 winning season in the last 5 years. ONE! That includes 2 scandals, one of which gets your coach banned for a year!

If you are telling me that fans weren't calling for Paytons head you're lying. If you're telling me that he wasn't on the hot seat of hot seats, youre lying. If youre telling me national and local papers werent calling for his head, youre lying. Simple internet search shows how many wanted him gone.

And thats the point. In a window where Sean looked like a complete tool, 1 winning season in 5, with 4 of those being 7-9 seasons and 2 scandals, you cannot say he too didn't look like an overpaid cheerleader. But they stuck with him. He looked like a clown and they stuck with him.

Its a double standard here in TAFT. Sean payton can do no wrong because people have zero ability to look at anything other than the right here and now. But when you look back at how many bad seasons and the chaos that Sean had and was allowed to work through it, it makes you wonder what really should be done with DQ. 

We have an owner that acts like TAFT. Knee jerk reactions and dictating what needs to happen. N.O. on the other hand let their coach run the team and fix it.

He won a SB. Our HC is the dufus tagged with 28-3 because of bad time management and play call selection

 

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18 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Blame has already started going on Arthur Blank. And one could argue that Mike Smith, Dan Quinn, and Jim Mora were all actually good hires. All 3 of them coached the Falcons to the NFC championship game. Before Blank was the owner, the Falcons made it there...once. 

Personally I thought Blank made the mistake of letting Reeves go after he lost Vick for the season.  Yet Quinn has Ryan for pretty much the whole season and still get to stick around?  We can excuse Reeves for losing that season, but can't do it for Quinn this season.

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16 hours ago, rugger8 said:

Quinn should go because one week we can beat the Saints, and the next lose to Tampa Bay. There's a problem with consistency here. The problem is gutting the team is just another hard reset.

And it’s not only that we lost to the Sucs, it’s how bad we looked while doing it that’s a problem as well! 

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20 minutes ago, Ezekiel 25:17 said:

And it’s not only that we lost to the Sucs, it’s how bad we looked while doing it that’s a problem as well! 

I totally agree with this.  The manner of which this team lost this year has been mostly embarrassing, and they have too much talent to be embarrassed like that.  

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19 hours ago, caponine said:

Idk how you can justify two losing seasons and keep Quinn. **** after the 2013 season, people wanted smith fired. Actually in 2012 if you can believe it 

Same way the Saints kept Payton after 3 losing seasons. I don't know if DQ is our final answer or not but I do know that changing coaches every 4 years doesn't get anybody anywhere except perpetually sucking...

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