FalconFan1st

How to fix a horrid O line?

69 posts in this topic

Have a unit that is built for the scheme.  Matthews, Mack & Ty are perfect outside zone lineman.  Brown & Carp are inside/power guys. Unfortunately they aren’t opening up running lanes on the inside and lack the athleticism to reach 2nd level on outside zone.  It all equals out to no run game.

Wes & Lindstrom at Guard would be a huge upgrade

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1 minute ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:
  • Cut Mack, Carpenter and Sombrero for $11.8M in cap relief
  • Move Lindstrom to OC
  • Move Jaymon to the left side. Of the bench
  • Move McGary to RG
  • Move Bloodline to RT
  • Draft Thomas for LT
  • Sign a free agent LG
  • Sign a back up swing tackle

If Thomas is available I’d consider it.  I’ve also heard from a person I trust that Matthews would make an All Pro center.  

ATLSlobberKnockers likes this

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46 minutes ago, FalconFan1st said:

The o line just continues to be bad.... historically bad. I get that many would like to replace MR but you cant deny how bad this line is. Is it the players or is it the line coach.......or both?

I think we probably should taken the money we paid Julio and used it on the offensive line and had Ridley, Hooper and kept Sanu and let Julio walk in 2021 because he will be almost out of prime. Lindstrom and McGrary is a good start though.

vitaman likes this

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How bout just decide how and what we are upfront then pick the best players available to run a certain scheme.

No more convoluted messaging from the HC commit to a certain thing and stay **** committed to it.

Im telling you now making guys who are predominant sided players and ask them to play the other side is a mistake.

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17 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:
  • Cut Mack, Carpenter and Sombrero for $11.8M in cap relief
  • Move Lindstrom to OC
  • Move Jaymon to the left side. Of the bench
  • Move McGary to RG
  • Move Bloodline to RT
  • Draft Thomas for LT
  • Sign a free agent LG
  • Sign a back up swing tackle

Would you take Thomas in top 5? That seems where our pick will end up. I know this depends on new coach but do you draft solely on the lines? Or at least mostly? 

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Scheme, playing to strengths/making it easier for players, and establishing an identity and sticking with it.

We didn't have some uber-talented OL in 2016. We just had an OC who knew how to scheme to players' strengths, attack opponents' weaknesses and establish a modern NFL offense identity. Yes, talent is important but the Cowboys were touted to having an elite OL a few years ago and they can't get past the divisional round and it's not because they don't have great talent on the OL. 

Talent isn't the end all be all. Everybody is talented in today's NFL. You can't just run past people anymore, put your hand up because you're open and catch a ball uncontested. Everybody is a supremely, talented athlete. You gotta get creative now. Scheme and the right playcaller gets you over the hump. Why do you think so many NFL games week in and week out are so close? You can get away with street ball in college. Not in the NFL.

When Dirk was hired, Quinn said "we're sticking with the outside zone scheme". OK? So Dirk was hired to run a WCO/Shanny/Sark scheme when he's always been known for seven step drops and "4 verticals". Oh, we also hire Mularkey to bring a power "punch" into the run scheme. We have barely seen a hint of the former scheme under Koetter's rule. He consistently can't outscheme anybody, leaves Ryan and a rookie RT on an island with his seven step drops and long developing routes, and pretty much requires his WRs to "beat the man in front of you" because creativity is thrown out the window with Dirk.

Sark at least tried. IDK what Dirk is doing and what Quinn saw in him.

 

Stevo, quotemokc, Halcon-1 and 10 others like this

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18 minutes ago, Falcons Fan MVP said:

I think we probably should taken the money we paid Julio and used it on the offensive line and had Ridley, Hooper and kept Sanu and let Julio walk in 2021 because he will be almost out of prime. Lindstrom and McGrary is a good start though.

We just spent 78 million and two 1st rounders on the OL last offseason.  The line also accounts for 53 million in CAP next year

Falcons Fan MVP and Stevo like this

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1 hour ago, Doctor Kildare said:

Fire the GM and his scouts who have proven over 12 years that they are not good at assembling line talent.

Yep TD must be fired. In TDs 12 years here the only two players he drafted or signed as FAs on the OL that were any good over multiple years were Matthew's and Mack. Mack was a no brainer at the time as well.

The Rock likes this

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7 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

We just spent 78 million and two 1st rounders on the OL last offseason.  The line also accounts for 53 million in CAP next year

And TD sucks and has killed our ability to recover from his horrible decisions.

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7 minutes ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

I think the line is better than it appears.  An OC who schemes to protect the line would make a world of difference

I agree with this...Koetter is absolutely not calling plays to our strengths the majority of the time, the game he called for Schaub against Seattle would really help a ton and that game was a quick passing game which is very West Coast like.....F that guy.

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1 hour ago, LouDog said:

Its a little to early to give up on McGary as a tackle but if he doesnt improve significantly against speed rushers, at some point I wouldn't mind seeing how he looks at LG.

I predict the new coaching staff will move him to guard if there is not immediate improvement. It's not like we don't need another guard and he might be a probowl player at the guard position. 

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1. Let Lindstrom come back and let McGary and Lindstrom Mesh together the rest if the year 

 

2.I'm going to give this space from the others because it's most important... Bring in a better play caller ... I heard forever that the vikings O-Line sucks... Right now the 49ers is playing with Daniel Brunskill (the PS guy for us) as their LT because of injuries and Mike Person as their RG... 

They have really good play callers who don't put their OLINE in bad position with there play calling.... 

 

3.It's tough but we have to release Mack and Ty

4.Draft C Tyler Biadasz in the late 1st - our first 2nd round pick

5. Let Carp and Brown compete for the LG position

 

 

 

FalconFan1st and kiwifalcon like this

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27 minutes ago, thajames said:

I agree with this...Koetter is absolutely not calling plays to our strengths the majority of the time, the game he called for Schaub against Seattle would really help a ton and that game was a quick passing game which is very West Coast like.....F that guy.

I just don’t understand that gameplan compared to all the others we have seen.  It’s the only one that protected our OL and played to our strengths.  We probably have 6 wins if that gameplan was used every week

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In our case we’ve committed to McGary & Lindstrom it is now upto whoever the powers that be to build around these 2.

Thee only position I look for an upgrade is LG this coming off season.

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Quote

How to fix a horrid O line?

  1. Hire a Head Coach with a cohesive vision for the identity of the overall team, and how each unit will contribute to forging that identity.
  2. Hire an Offensive Coordinator whose vision and philosophy furthers the Head Coach's vision, and whose play calling (if the Head Coach is not the play caller) will advance the team's building of an identity.
  3. Hire an Offensive Line coach who is best capable of forging the disparate pieces into one cohesive unit.
  4. Draft players that fit that scheme and who embody that identity. Trade or release players who cannot/will not.
  5. Give the unit time to bond and coalesce.

Everything else is chasing soap bubbles in a hurricane.

 

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3 hours ago, FalconFan1st said:

The o line just continues to be bad.... historically bad. I get that many would like to replace MR but you cant deny how bad this line is. Is it the players or is it the line coach.......or both?

I do not want to replace Ryan, but watched the NO game again and saw some very alarming things out of Ryan. In several of the sacks he held the ball for way too long, and the commentator Dungy even said the same. Ryan and the coaching staff are not helping the OL out this year, while they should be learning how to gel with each other. Hate to say it, but Ryan looked lost without Jones/Hooper! 

The fail of the OL is a team effort.

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2 hours ago, The Don™ said:

Scheme, playing to strengths/making it easier for players, and establishing an identity and sticking with it.

We didn't have some uber-talented OL in 2016. We just had an OC who knew how to scheme to players' strengths, attack opponents' weaknesses and establish a modern NFL offense identity. Yes, talent is important but the Cowboys were touted to having an elite OL a few years ago and they can't get past the divisional round and it's not because they don't have great talent on the OL. 

Talent isn't the end all be all. Everybody is talented in today's NFL. You can't just run past people anymore, put your hand up because you're open and catch a ball uncontested. Everybody is a supremely, talented athlete. You gotta get creative now. Scheme and the right playcaller gets you over the hump. Why do you think so many NFL games week in and week out are so close? You can get away with street ball in college. Not in the NFL.

When Dirk was hired, Quinn said "we're sticking with the outside zone scheme". OK? So Dirk was hired to run a WCO/Shanny/Sark scheme when he's always been known for seven step drops and "4 verticals". Oh, we also hire Mularkey to bring a power "punch" into the run scheme. We have barely seen a hint of the former scheme under Koetter's rule. He consistently can't outscheme anybody, leaves Ryan and a rookie RT on an island with his seven step drops and long developing routes, and pretty much requires his WRs to "beat the man in front of you" because creativity is thrown out the window with Dirk.

Sark at least tried. IDK what Dirk is doing and what Quinn saw in him.

 

I remain unconvinced that Koetter was Quinn’s idea. 

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