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FalconsIn2012

Value of The Run Game

61 posts in this topic

Just look at the Rams.  It’s amazing what Gurley does for their offense.  He finally gets touches and lots of yards...the result is Goff has 310 yards passing at halftime.  Rams have 400 yards offense at the half

No run game makes the Rams offense below average

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It’s hard to run the ball when your getting 0-2 yard gains every clip. Even more hard when your team is down 3 scores before you can blink. I will say My only real complaint is there isn’t any variation in the play calling. Like we know there’s gonna be a run on 1st and 10 for little to no gain. There’s never a shot play, play action, nothing to switch it up. They are way too predictable but I don’t blame him for leaning on the pass when the run game looks so shaky 

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1 hour ago, FalconsIn2012 said:

Just look at the Rams.  It’s amazing what Gurley does for their offense.  He finally gets touches and lots of yards...the result is Goff has 310 yards passing at halftime.  Rams have 400 yards offense at the half

No run game makes the Rams offense below average

They are also running a ton of 2 tight end sets and a lot of play action.

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24 minutes ago, Nino11 said:

It’s hard to run the ball when your getting 0-2 yard gains every clip. Even more hard when your team is down 3 scores before you can blink. I will say My only real complaint is there isn’t any variation in the play calling. Like we know there’s gonna be a run on 1st and 10 for little to no gain. There’s never a shot play, play action, nothing to switch it up. They are way too predictable but I don’t blame him for leaning on the pass when the run game looks so shaky 

One thing that I do not understand is why we don’t develop our screen game, RB in the flats more.   It helps jump start or supplant the run game when it’s struggling and Free seems to do very well in those scenarios, So that’s one issue my other is that we’ve lost our 3 step drop quick slants and dammit I wanna run that stretch play and stop always trying to shove it between tackles.  

Edited by BUBBASBEANS
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43 minutes ago, Rings said:

They are also running a ton of 2 tight end sets and a lot of play action.

The transition to 12 personnel started earlier in a November and has really paid off for Gurley and the offense.  McVay has traditionally ran almost exclusively out of 11 personnel

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1 hour ago, Nino11 said:

It’s hard to run the ball when your getting 0-2 yard gains every clip. Even more hard when your team is down 3 scores before you can blink. I will say My only real complaint is there isn’t any variation in the play calling. Like we know there’s gonna be a run on 1st and 10 for little to no gain. There’s never a shot play, play action, nothing to switch it up. They are way too predictable but I don’t blame him for leaning on the pass when the run game looks so shaky 

You speak truth.

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Through Week 12 we had run the ball 226 times.

 

0 or 1 tight end sets: 139 times at a 37% success rate (worst in the NFL)

2 or more tight end sets: 75 plays at a 53% success rate (second best in the NFL)

 

So why would you run almost twice as many plays out of sets you are the worst at vs sets that you are second best at?  Because...Dirk.

 

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33 minutes ago, Rings said:

Through Week 12 we had run the ball 226 times.

 

0 or 1 tight end sets: 139 times at a 37% success rate (worst in the NFL)

2 or more tight end sets: 75 plays at a 53% success rate (second best in the NFL)

 

So why would you run almost twice as many plays out of sets you are the worst at vs sets that you are second best at?  Because...Dirk.

 

This.

Wow.

Just smh

I admit I bought into the Dirk hype, BUT a lot of that weighed Mularkey being brought in and the supposed power run game returning.

THEN:

First 8 games of the year happened and DC+HC Dan Quinn was way in over his head trying to do too much with a record setting BAD defense; especially in the first half(trailing only season long tanker franchise Dolphins), along with failures of the offense created massive pass heavy situations.

We never saw the supposed vision of Mularkey’s part come through because both the execution by the offense combined with a near record setting pace defensive performance by the supposed guru failed us.

I’d rather have had Sark calling plays behind like we were...did he use 2 TEs and 13 personnel more often? At least get more true outside zone back to speed but we basically ask our OL to do too much with Dirk on an island and no Mularkey factoring in once we get behind in games.

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1 hour ago, Schwarzwald said:

This.

Wow.

Just smh

I admit I bought into the Dirk hype, BUT a lot of that weighed Mularkey being brought in and the supposed power run game returning.

THEN:

First 8 games of the year happened and DC+HC Dan Quinn was way in over his head trying to do too much with a record setting BAD defense; especially in the first half(trailing only season long tanker franchise Dolphins), along with failures of the offense created massive pass heavy situations.

We never saw the supposed vision of Mularkey’s part come through because both the execution by the offense combined with a near record setting pace defensive performance by the supposed guru failed us.

I’d rather have had Sark calling plays behind like we were...did he use 2 TEs and 13 personnel more often? At least get more true outside zone back to speed but we basically ask our OL to do too much with Dirk on an island and no Mularkey factoring in once we get behind in games.

No, Sark ran either the same or less, but he was actually worse in multiple tight end sets than without using the outside zone scheme.  It's all about playing to your team's strengths.  Shanny was better out of two RB sets (normally with w/ Dimarco at FB), Sark was best out of 1-1 personnel, but that fit the outsize zone scheme, Dirk does the opposite of what is working best. It's almost like he is drawing up a power run play while having outsize zone personnel on the field.

Rushing Success Rate on < 2 TEs vs 2+ TEs:

2019: 37% / 53%
2018: 50% / 40%
2017: 48% / 44%
2016: 48% / 51%

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2 hours ago, Rings said:

Through Week 12 we had run the ball 226 times.

 

0 or 1 tight end sets: 139 times at a 37% success rate (worst in the NFL)

2 or more tight end sets: 75 plays at a 53% success rate (second best in the NFL)

 

So why would you run almost twice as many plays out of sets you are the worst at vs sets that you are second best at?  Because...Dirk.

 

One word answer.  It rhymes with smirk

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1 hour ago, Rings said:

No, Sark ran either the same or less, but he was actually worse in multiple tight end sets than without using the outside zone scheme.  It's all about playing to your team's strengths.  Shanny was better out of two RB sets (normally with w/ Dimarco at FB), Sark was best out of 1-1 personnel, but that fit the outsize zone scheme, Dirk does the opposite of what is working best. It's almost like he is drawing up a power run play while having outsize zone personnel on the field.

Rushing Success Rate on < 2 TEs vs 2 or more TEs:

2019: 37% / 53%
2018: 50% / 40%
2017: 48% / 44%
2016: 48% / 51%

The bolded is absolutely spot on

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14 minutes ago, falcndave said:

Wondering if he has watched the Rams the last few weeks...

Heck, just look at today’s CAR vs WAS game.

Now, think about our first meeting against CAR.

Their run Defense has been HORRIBLE this year. Absolutely bad. Always giving up over 100 yards.

We committed to it; just like the NO game the week prior, and they shut it down while the pass game had a solid game. 22 carries for 59 yards by our backs.

Haskins...a no threat passer so far...the Panthers get ran all up and down the field...30 rushes for 248 yards. 8.3 yard per carry.

What does that tell you about the Falcons running game?

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10 minutes ago, falcndave said:

Wondering if he has watched the Rams the last few weeks...

They have given TG 50 attempts the four games leading up to today.  Ran for 230 yards over that time.  Am I missing something

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9 minutes ago, The Rock said:

We don't have any mauling lineman who can push the pile. Too many finesse players. 

It's because they were brought in for Shanny & Sarks scheme, not Dirks.  Not many maulers have the lateral quickness/agility to succeed in an outside zone scheme.

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3 hours ago, Rings said:

Through Week 12 we had run the ball 226 times.

 

0 or 1 tight end sets: 139 times at a 37% success rate (worst in the NFL)

2 or more tight end sets: 75 plays at a 53% success rate (second best in the NFL)

 

So why would you run almost twice as many plays out of sets you are the worst at vs sets that you are second best at?  Because...Dirk.

 

This is partially the result of being down 2-3 touchdowns before you can say Lucy. 

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2 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

This is partially the result of being down 2-3 touchdowns before you can say Lucy. 

How does being down 2-3 touchdowns dictate how many tight ends you can put on the field when running the ball?  This isn't a pass vs run thing.

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Just now, Rings said:

How does being down 2-3 touchdowns dictate how many tight ends you can put on the field when running the ball?  This isn't a pass vs run thing.

If you're down several TD's, you tend to lean more pass happy in trying to catch back up. Outside of Hooper, Graham is the only pass catching TE we have, and it makes no sense in running 12 personnel if teams know you're just going to run the ball because your other TE isn't a threat as a receiver. You really need pass catchers in this situation.

This is an overlook thing about the Ravens offense. They have 3 TE's that can block as well as catch adequately. Mark Andrew's in particular does both at a high level. They run or pass and teams would have to stay on their toes.

We're usually stuck with 1.5, since Stocker is limited as a receiver. Not to mention, he was inactive. 

As a DC, I would just committ on stopping the run if you're going to show me an obvious run look. Now if we had Hooper and Julio, 12 would look more enticing.

 

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20 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

If you're down several TD's, you tend to lean more pass happy in trying to catch back up. Outside of Hooper, Graham is the only pass catching TE we have, and it makes no sense in running 12 personnel if teams know you're just going to run the ball because your other TE isn't a threat as a receiver. You really need pass catchers in this situation.

This is an overlook thing about the Ravens offense. They have 3 TE's that can block as well as catch adequately. Mark Andrew's in particular does both at a high level. They run or pass and teams would have to stay on their toes.

We're usually stuck with 1.5, since Stocker is limited as a receiver. Not to mention, he was inactive. 

As a DC, I would just committ on stopping the run if you're going to show me an obvious run look. Now if we had Hooper and Julio, 12 would look more enticing.

 

OK.  We can look at that.  Lets remove when we are down more than two touchdowns.  When down 14 points or less:

0-1 TE Sets: 117 snaps - 35% success rate (worst in NFL)
2+ TE Sets: 66 snaps - 55% success rate (second best in NFL behind only the Gaints at 56%)

We've only ran the ball 43 times all year when down more than two touchdowns, so although the logic you displayed makes sense, it's 19% of their running plays so it is too small of a sample size to make that much of a difference.

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