g-dawg

Next Move - Trade Hooper for 3rd rounder

270 posts in this topic

6 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1969 said:

No, I don't think that. I know how the salary cap works you smug mf. It's either eat the dead money now or keep them. There aren't any other options. Pull the bandaid off and start over. 

Nope. Tru and Free won’t help 2021 cap at all! Blow it all up for draft picks!! Massive rebuild :rolleyes:

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4 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

answer the question please.

Wes welker and Brandon lloyd. They let Welker go after he decided the incentives weren't reachable. So that tells me they were willing to pay him and 2 TEs.

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Bro next move is clean out the Scouting department! Steve Sabo Head of Scouting from Cleveland gotta do, Joel Collier, Ruston Webster, Phil Emery all these dinosaurs gotta go! most of them have had 5+ season with Falcons and our o-line and d-line still is terrible. Time for some front office folks to be held accountable. Blank needs to show he cares for fans and is making REAL changes this time. 

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10 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

Wes welker and Brandon lloyd. They let Welker go after he decided the incentives weren't reachable. So that tells me they were willing to pay him and 2 TEs.

exactly - Patriots weren't paying huge coin to their WRs - Falcons are.

Atlanta is likely the most unbalanced team with regards to offensive and defensive spending.   This will become even more lopsided if we trade Trufant and of course Beasley will be traded or cut as well.    Only two significant long-term contracts on defensive side in Debo and Grady.

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20 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1969 said:

Not true on Tru according to over the cap. If we trade him we eat his remaining guaranteed money but it clears everything else. It's a significant savings. Go look. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/desmond-trufant/2203/

Ya, I was joking. :tiphat:

We got a lot of contracts coming off the cap virtually in the next 1-2 years; given there is some dead money. No reason to let Hooper walk just for more space and creating a massive need in the process.

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1 hour ago, falcons007 said:

Trade Julio and Ryan posts  take the cake. This post isn’t far behind though. Losing sucks, it’s gonna be long year. 

Trade Julio is actually a legit argument since he will decline soon and the current return would still be first round picks. 

The trade Ryan posts I can only assume are children or trolls so not worthy of discussion. 

This post is stupid from a football standpoint so people are actually trying to discuss it like one when it would be such a dumb football move on multiple levels  

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14 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

exactly - Patriots weren't paying huge coin to their WRs - Falcons are.

Atlanta is likely the most unbalanced team with regards to offensive and defensive spending.   This will become even more lopsided if we trade Trufant and of course Beasley will be traded or cut as well.    Only two significant long-term contracts on defensive side in Debo and Grady.

We've moved on from Sanu, and We're likely to move on from Mack and Freeman is an option also.

Not going to save us a huge amount of coin, but it's at least looking to reduce the lopsidedness of our imbalance. 

With that said, I'm not advocating paying Hooper 9 or 10 million, and I don't think nobody in the league is going to pay him that either.

Kelce is the highest paid currently and he's had astronomical #'s for a TE. Hooper doesn't have that really. If Hooper wants that kind of money, then let him go, but don't just let him walk, and priority shouldn't be to simply trade him now.

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1 minute ago, NeonDeion said:

Trade Julio is actually a legit argument since he will decline soon and the current return would still be first round picks. 

The trade Ryan posts I can only assume are children or trolls so not worthy of discussion. 

This post is stupid from a football standpoint so people are actually trying to discuss it like one when it would be such a dumb football move on multiple levels  

  I think they need to pile up draft picks for the next couple of years until we can draft Ryan's replacement... The QB from Clemson... He's a once every 20 years QB.. Even let him sit behind Ryan for a year and learn.. by that time.. Ryan will more than likely be ready to ride off into the sunset.. Ryan is a great QB , to bad we haven't had the Veteran OL to take care of him this year.. like we should have gotten and taken the 2 DL from Clemson this last draft. I guess they'll never learn.. I knew Quinn was not the man for the job.. They gave him a chance and he didn't play his cards right.. 

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6 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

We've moved on from Sanu, and We're likely to move on from Mack and Freeman is an option also.

Not going to save us a huge amount of coin, but it's at least looking to reduce the lopsidedness of our imbalance. 

With that said, I'm not advocating paying Hooper 9 or 10 million, and I don't think nobody in the league is going to pay him that either.

Kelce is the highest paid currently and he's had astronomical #'s for a TE. Hooper doesn't have that really. If Hooper wants that kind of money, then let him go, but don't just let him walk, and priority shouldn't be to simply trade him now.

which is what I proposed in the OP.

PLAYER
piece of poop
TEAM
AGE
YRS
DOLLARS
AVERAGE SALARY
GUARANTEED
AT SIGNING
PRACTICAL GUARANTEES
% GTD
FREE AGENT
Travis Kelce (2016-2021) TE KC 30 5 $46,842,000 $9,368,400 $10,517,000 $20,017,000 42.73% 2022
Jordan Reed (2016-2021)  TE WAS 29 5 $46,750,000 $9,350,000 $14,000,000 $22,000,000 47.06% 2022
Zach Ertz (2016-2021) TE PHI 28 5 $42,500,000 $8,500,000 $13,138,527 $21,000,000 49.41% 2022
Cameron Brate (2018-2023) TE TB 28 6 $40,800,000 $6,800,000 $7,000,000 $18,000,000 44.12% 2024
Kyle Rudolph (2019-2023) TE MIN 29 4 $36,000,000 $9,000,000 $9,250,000 $9,250,000 25.69% 2024
Trey Burton (2018-2021) TE CHI 27 4 $32,000,000 $8,000,000 $18,000,000 $22,000,000 68.75% 2022
Jimmy Graham (2018-2020) TE GB 32 3 $30,000,000 $10,000,000 $11,000,000 $11,000,000 36.67% 2021
Tyler Higbee (2019-2023) TE LAR 26 4 $29,000,000 $7,250,000 $10,250,000 $15,500,000 53.45% 2024

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Kyle Rudolph getting $9mm/yr on average.

Trey Burton getting $8mm/yr on average

 

You don't think Hooper will get more than both of those guys?

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6 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

We've moved on from Sanu, and We're likely to move on from Mack and Freeman is an option also.

Not going to save us a huge amount of coin, but it's at least looking to reduce the lopsidedness of our imbalance. 

With that said, I'm not advocating paying Hooper 9 or 10 million, and I don't think nobody in the league is going to pay him that either.

Kelce is the highest paid currently and he's had astronomical #'s for a TE. Hooper doesn't have that really. If Hooper wants that kind of money, then let him go, but don't just let him walk, and priority shouldn't be to simply trade him now.

True. But Hooper has performed in bad conditions even better than Kelce,, I know, I have both of these TEs on my FF team.. Hooper has out played Kelce... I messed up last week trying to figure out which one I should play,, I'll just say.. I choose poorly and took Kelce ,, But if I had know My QB which is Kelce's QB was going to go down this season , I wouldn't even have drafted Kelce. 

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3 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

 

well they likely won't be able to franchise tag him so they will have to compete against the market on a level playing field.    Hooper is a West Coast kid so he may want to get closer to home as well.   Not seeing any "home team" discounts.    This is Hoops best chance to get the absolute most money he can - career year, still young, etc. etc.

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Ertz and Kelce's deals will be two years old by the time Hooper gets to market.   Hoop and his agent may very well try to at least get the same or more monies given the increase in salary cap over last two years - much the way Dak Prescott wants to top Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson while no one believes he is as good as those guys - and Dak will probably get it!

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2 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

Ertz and Kelce's deals will be two years old by the time Hooper gets to market.   Hoop and his agent may very well try to at least get the same or more monies given the increase in salary cap over last two years - much the way Dak Prescott wants to top Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson while no one believes he is as good as those guys - and Dak will probably get it!

Which is why he should be traded to the highest bidder now.

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4 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

Kyle Rudolph getting $9mm/yr on average.

Trey Burton getting $8mm/yr on average

 

You don't think Hooper will get more than both of those guys?

Burton would be my standard. In terms of receiving ability, Hooper and Burton are possibly even, with Hooper getting a slight nod. Burton on the other hand is considered one of the best blockers at the position.

That's why I said to give him a lower base and put incentives in. If he's that good of a receiver, then he'll make his money regardless with the incentives. 

Rudolph is just overpaid.

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9 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

Ertz and Kelce's deals will be two years old by the time Hooper gets to market.   Hoop and his agent may very well try to at least get the same or more monies given the increase in salary cap over last two years - much the way Dak Prescott wants to top Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson while no one believes he is as good as those guys - and Dak will probably get it!

I will say this and leave it alone, depending on what Kittle gets should be what we structure Hooper's deal off of.

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25 minutes ago, NeonDeion said:

Trade Julio is actually a legit argument since he will decline soon and the current return would still be first round picks. 

The trade Ryan posts I can only assume are children or trolls so not worthy of discussion. 

This post is stupid from a football standpoint so people are actually trying to discuss it like one when it would be such a dumb football move on multiple levels  

You can’t trade Julio for next two years with the cap hit. Julio would have 36 M cap hit next year   Assuming the team trading will take his contract. Falcons will have 16 M dead money with the trade.. 

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2 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

Burton would be my standard. In terms of receiving ability, Hooper and Burton are possibly even, with Hooper getting a slight nod. Burton on the other hand is considered one of the best blockers at the position.

That's why I said to give him a lower base and put incentives in. If he's that good of a receiver, then he'll make his money regardless with the incentives. 

Rudolph is just overpaid.

Burton will have also signed his contract two seasons before Hooper deal is up. Hooper will get 10+ on the open market. I'm not sure we can afford it and I'd much rather use that money elsewhere (defense) plus get a pick (2nd or 3rd) than have Hooper. 

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5 minutes ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

Which is why he should be traded to the highest bidder now.

Salary Cap:

2017 - $168mm

2018 - $177mm - Kelce signed ($9.3mm/yr on average),   Ertz signed ($8.5mm/yr on average)

2019 - $188mm - Rudolph signed ($9mm/yr on average)

2020 -  $199mm? 

Agreed that Hooper should be pegged under Kelce and Ertz but better than Rudolph.  In 2020's projected cap dollars, the equivalent would be $9.5mm if Rudolph signed the same contract in 2020 w/ the same increase in salary cap.

Fairly certain the number (on average) that Hoop and his agent will be gunning for is $10mm/yr.

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5 hours ago, g-dawg said:

I know all the man-love for Austin Hooper in TATF but trading him is the smart move.
 

Hoop is good - not great.  He’s not a vertical threat and not some freakish end zone weapon.

Hoop will likely command $9-10mm/yr in open market where the top guys that hit UFA are overpaid.

Falcons already have potential replacement on roster in Jaden Graham just like Russell Gage is replacement for Sanu.

This move paired with Sanu trade give new GM and HC the opportunity to reshape this roster and free up cap space.  If some team is desperate and wants to franchise and re/sign him - maybe Falcons get lucky and garner 2nd rounder in return.

I wish I had a dislike button to click...

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7 minutes ago, Geaux_Falcons said:

Burton would be my standard. In terms of receiving ability, Hooper and Burton are possibly even, with Hooper getting a slight nod. Burton on the other hand is considered one of the best blockers at the position.

That's why I said to give him a lower base and put incentives in. If he's that good of a receiver, then he'll make his money regardless with the incentives. 

Rudolph is just overpaid.

lots of folks are overpaid - doesn't mean agents don't use those contracts.

I am the one being REALISTIC about what the market will bare - you are just bending down the market value because you HOPE the Falcons can sign him and he won't make it painful.

I promise you Hoop's agent won't be using vaseline - he's going in dry!

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5 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

I mean, OP has a point. The falcons have been giving top dollar to a lot of average to above average guys. Freeman, Trufant, etc. Even the Debo and Jarrett contracts don’t look that great at this current moment. That could change though. Im torn. I like Hooper. He’s a decent player. But that’s just it, he’s decent. He’s not a star or a significant difference maker 

He's better than decent...

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