The Brotherhood is gonna cost Quinn his job

[MD-FalconFan13]

It was obvious that Vic was charmin soft the last 2 seasons and our FO decides to give him 15 mil this year. Jake Matthews has had very sporadic success but had the penalty that cost us the most in the SB and is getting paid like a top LT. I like Ricardo, but instead of pursuing Earl Thomas when he was available we paid him. Trufant is a decent CB but got paid like a top 5 CB and somehow gets abused by almost every high end WR we play. Freeman was at one time my favorite Falcon, but it should've been obvious that paying him was not in the best interest of the team.

A look at this roster shows over and over that Quinn has put establishing a culture of brotherhood and standing beside players over accountability. His biggest sin as a coach is that he let player loyalty trump establishing a culture of required perfomance and insisting on the best man winning the job.

When the story of Quinn's tenure here is written, it will show an admirable attempt to install a culture but a clear omission of what is most important in sports. You earn your paycheck based on what you can do for me now and in the future. The best players should play. And big pay days are for truly exceptional players, not marginal guys. It's a cardinal rule that you shouldn't grow attached to players because it hurts your judgment. And that's exactly what has happened here.

We are simply paying too many ok to slightly above average players. 

Matt, Julio, Deion Jones, Hooper and Grady Jarrett are our only blue chip players. Unfortunately Rico, Freeman, Matthews, Trufant and Mack are all getting paid at or near the top of the league at their position. Mack was a beast in his prime, but he's declining. The others have never REALLY been the best at their positions. They've had good years and parlayed them into big contracts.

I liked the Brotherhood at first. But somewhere along the way we lost focus on requiring our Brothers to perform and holding them responsible when they don't 

[Sun Tzu 7]

I truly believe the demise of Quinn has been the attrition of the d-line.  I'm leaning towards giving TD his walking papers because it's the 2nd time under 2 different staffs it happened but at least there was more effort this time.

Anyway lets take a look at the starting d-lines each season starting with 2016.

Looking at the dline's below it's hard to believe but it sure looks like guys like Brooks Reed, Shelby, UpShaw were the things that were keeping the dline from becoming the unmitigated disaster that it is now.  The staff began to rely more and more on Beasley and McKinnley and it hasn't paid off.  Now some of it is scheme related because they are trying to run a 3-4 front and don't have the right personnel for it but also don't have the right personnel for a 4 man front.  The results?  Massive confusing personnel changes.  Absolutely ZERO pressure.  Maybe better at stopping the run unless it goes to the edges but that's beside the point since teams pass most of the time anyway.

The sack numbers have never been great but the next staff HAS to make the dline a priority!  Make Sacks Great Again!!!!!

2016 - (34 sacks) Best season ever and decent production from the group.  Beasley leads the league in sacks and the emergence of Grady Jarrett.  Quinn responds by firing the d-line coach.

SLB/DE Brooks Reed

DE Derrick Shelby
DE/LB Vic Beasley
DE Dwight Freeney
DE Adrian Clayborn
DE Ra’Shede Hageman

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Tyson Jackson
DT/DE Courtney Upshaw
DT Jonathan Babineaux

2017 - (39 sacks) Probably the best talent in the Quinn ERA and one of the best defensive seasons

EDGE Vic Beasley
EDGE Takkarist McKinley
EDGE Brooks Reed

DE/DT Adrian Clayborn
DE/DT Jack Crawford
DE/DT Derrick Shelby
DE/DT Courtney Upshaw

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Dontari Poe

2018 - (37 Sacks) This is where things go South.  Clayborn, Upshaw, Poe are let go and replaced with a 3rd round pick, (Senat).  

DE Vic Beasley
DE Takkarist McKinley
DE Brooks Reed
DE Derrick Shelby

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Jack Crawford
DT Deadrin Senat
DT Terrell McClain
DT Justin Zimmer

2019 - (on pace for around 20 sacks) Technically Senat is on the team but I'm not sure he's played a snap.  On paper this should be a better group than 2018 but it's not.

DE Vic Beasley
DE Takk McKinley
DE Adrian Clayborn
DE Allen Bailey
DE/DT John Cominsky

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Jack Crawford
DT Tyeler Davison
DT Deadrin Senat

[408Falcon]

This sounds like a GM problem over a Brotherhood problem

[ya_boi_j]

Quinn's starting to look like the person that says what they need to say to get the job. Get the job and perform well for a while then the real him comes out once he's comfortable. 

[PokerSteve]

Quinn has gone all-out to ingratiate himself with his players. I understand why he would want to establish a tight bond with them, but I also know you have to maintain some separation to keep the respect of the players and be able to make decisions you know are going to be devastating to them and be able to do that time after time without emotional considerations warping the decision-making process.

Whether Quinn's going overboard on the brotherhood mantra is the reason for his downfall is debatable. I don't think he did himself any favors keeping Beasley around and letting some other guys walk does come to mind.

Is the problem the players just aren't putting out the effort for Quinn? If that's the case, then the whole brotherhood thing fell flat and cost him his job. But if the problem is Quinn is just a lousy defensive coordinator who can't figure out how to get things back on track, then that is what cost him his job. Sadly, either way he has sealed his own fate.

[The Daywalker]

10 minutes ago, ya_boi_j said:

Quinn's starting to look like the person that says what they need to say to get the job. Get the job and perform well for a while then the real him comes out once he's comfortable. 

**** bro you just described half of America 

[ya_boi_j]

12 minutes ago, The Daywalker said:

**** bro you just described half of America 

I work with several. That’s how I know the drill

[theDIRTYcode]

I'm having a hard time judging TD. On one hand, we a combined 7 first round picks on the lines, 2 of those are top 10 picks. On the other, our lines are STILL a problem. 

We've invested, we just have **** to show for it.

[Diggable Birds]

4 hours ago, ya_boi_j said:

Quinn's starting to look like the person that says what they need to say to get the job. Get the job and perform well for a while then the real him comes out once he's comfortable. 

The Truth Lol...…..In corporate America when the real you comes out they get rid of you right away. Dan Schneider of all people cut his losses early -Arthur should do the same I mean seriously we cant be any worst

[Pacific_Falcon]

5 hours ago, Sun Tzu 7 said:

I truly believe the demise of Quinn has been the attrition of the d-line.  I'm leaning towards giving TD his walking papers because it's the 2nd time under 2 different staffs it happened but at least there was more effort this time.

Anyway lets take a look at the starting d-lines each season starting with 2016.

Looking at the dline's below it's hard to believe but it sure looks like guys like Brooks Reed, Shelby, UpShaw were the things that were keeping the dline from becoming the unmitigated disaster that it is now.  The staff began to rely more and more on Beasley and McKinnley and it hasn't paid off.  Now some of it is scheme related because they are trying to run a 3-4 front and don't have the right personnel for it but also don't have the right personnel for a 4 man front.  The results?  Massive confusing personnel changes.  Absolutely ZERO pressure.  Maybe better at stopping the run unless it goes to the edges but that's beside the point since teams pass most of the time anyway.

The sack numbers have never been great but the next staff HAS to make the dline a priority!  Make Sacks Great Again!!!!!

2016 - (34 sacks) Best season ever and decent production from the group.  Beasley leads the league in sacks and the emergence of Grady Jarrett.  Quinn responds by firing the d-line coach.

SLB/DE Brooks Reed

DE Derrick Shelby
DE/LB Vic Beasley
DE Dwight Freeney
DE Adrian Clayborn
DE Ra’Shede Hageman

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Tyson Jackson
DT/DE Courtney Upshaw
DT Jonathan Babineaux

2017 - (39 sacks) Probably the best talent in the Quinn ERA and one of the best defensive seasons

EDGE Vic Beasley
EDGE Takkarist McKinley
EDGE Brooks Reed

DE/DT Adrian Clayborn
DE/DT Jack Crawford
DE/DT Derrick Shelby
DE/DT Courtney Upshaw

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Dontari Poe

2018 - (37 Sacks) This is where things go South.  Clayborn, Upshaw, Poe are let go and replaced with a 3rd round pick, (Senat).  

DE Vic Beasley
DE Takkarist McKinley
DE Brooks Reed
DE Derrick Shelby

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Jack Crawford
DT Deadrin Senat
DT Terrell McClain
DT Justin Zimmer

2019 - (on pace for around 20 sacks) Technically Senat is on the team but I'm not sure he's played a snap.  On paper this should be a better group than 2018 but it's not.

DE Vic Beasley
DE Takk McKinley
DE Adrian Clayborn
DE Allen Bailey
DE/DT John Cominsky

DT Grady Jarrett
DT Jack Crawford
DT Tyeler Davison
DT Deadrin Senat

Would give tons more likes if I could. I think Cominsky can be a pretty serviceable player.

[Pacific_Falcon]

4 hours ago, theDIRTYcode said:

I'm having a hard time judging TD. On one hand, we a combined 7 first round picks on the lines, 2 of those are top 10 picks. On the other, our lines are STILL a problem. 

We've invested, we just have **** to show for it.

Does anybody actually really even know WTF that over-gelled goofball even does?!

[Lethal]

5 hours ago, ya_boi_j said:

Quinn's starting to look like the person that says what they need to say to get the job. Get the job and perform well for a while then the real him comes out once he's comfortable. 

[PokerSteve]

4 hours ago, ya_boi_j said:

I work with several. That’s how I know the drill

I sense a serial comedy just waiting to happen... 

[ya_boi_j]

9 minutes ago, PokerSteve said:

I sense a serial comedy just waiting to happen... 

Lol

[EddieK]

Our main problem is giving good players, great players money. Paid Jake Matthews, Free, Tru, and I'll include Debo like they're elite, when they're only average-to-good.

[Ovie_Lover]

6 hours ago, 408Falcon said:

This sounds like a GM problem over a Brotherhood problem

Exactly. How people think a HC has final say over the roster is beyond me.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.si.com/nfl/2015/02/03/atlanta-falcons-dan-quinn-roster-control

[Wardog357]

Oh Brother...….you mean the brotherman might have rah rahed himself right out of a job? You have to change it up a little...….same ish gets old for everyone eventually.

[Falcons Fan MVP]

12 hours ago, 408Falcon said:

This sounds like a GM problem over a Brotherhood problem

Dan Quinn chose the players TD signed them.

[Knight of God]

17 hours ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

It was obvious that Vic was charmin soft the last 2 seasons and our FO decides to give him 15 mil this year. Jake Matthews has had very sporadic success but had the penalty that cost us the most in the SB and is getting paid like a top LT. I like Ricardo, but instead of pursuing Earl Thomas when he was available we paid him. Trufant is a decent CB but got paid like a top 5 CB and somehow gets abused by almost every high end WR we play. Freeman was at one time my favorite Falcon, but it should've been obvious that paying him was not in the best interest of the team.

A look at this roster shows over and over that Quinn has put establishing a culture of brotherhood and standing beside players over accountability. His biggest sin as a coach is that he let player loyalty trump establishing a culture of required perfomance and insisting on the best man winning the job.

When the story of Quinn's tenure here is written, it will show an admirable attempt to install a culture but a clear omission of what is most important in sports. You earn your paycheck based on what you can do for me now and in the future. The best players should play. And big pay days are for truly exceptional players, not marginal guys. It's a cardinal rule that you shouldn't grow attached to players because it hurts your judgment. And that's exactly what has happened here.

We are simply paying too many ok to slightly above average players. 

Matt, Julio, Deion Jones, Hooper and Grady Jarrett are our only blue chip players. Unfortunately Rico, Freeman, Matthews, Trufant and Mack are all getting paid at or near the top of the league at their position. Mack was a beast in his prime, but he's declining. The others have never REALLY been the best at their positions. They've had good years and parlayed them into big contracts.

I liked the Brotherhood at first. But somewhere along the way we lost focus on requiring our Brothers to perform and holding them responsible when they don't 

 

[Stray Dog THA GAWD]

20 hours ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

I liked the Brotherhood at first. But somewhere along the way we lost focus on requiring our Brothers to perform and holding them responsible when they don't 

It starts with Blank.  He hasn't fired a GM since he bought the team, unless you count Reeves!

[shc]

On 10/15/2019 at 11:13 AM, Sun Tzu 7 said:

2016 - (34 sacks) Best season ever and decent production from the group.  Beasley leads the league in sacks and the emergence of Grady Jarrett.  Quinn responds by firing the d-line coach.

 

2017 - (39 sacks) Probably the best talent in the Quinn ERA and one of the best defensive seasons

2018 - (37 Sacks) This is where things go South.  Clayborn, Upshaw, Poe are let go and replaced with a 3rd round pick, (Senat).  

2019 - (on pace for around 20 sacks) Technically Senat is on the team but I'm not sure he's played a snap.  On paper this should be a better group than 2018 but it's not.

 

How do things start to go south in 2018 when it is just 2 less sacks?  I mean technically that is south, but nowhere near as south as we are now, and better than 2016.

I feel like its trying to prove that false narrative of our line went to sh*t because we let Poe walk.

[Sun Tzu 7]

Just now, shc said:

How do things start to go south in 2018 when it is just 2 less sacks?  I mean technically that is south, but nowhere near as south as we are now, and better than 2016.

I feel like its trying to prove that false narrative of our line went to sh*t because we let Poe walk.

Do you remember 2018?

Here's a quick re-fresher.

There was a game where the Falcons didn't score on 2 drives,  Takk had 3 sacks,  they blocked a punt, and scored over 35 points.  They lost that game.

I wasn't talking about the sacks but the overall defense as a whole.  And it wasn't because they let Poe walk.  It was because they let Poe, Upshaw, & Clayborne walk and replaced them with a 3rd round draft pick.  It was so bad they picked up two different guys to help.

The **** we're seeing now started then but all the injuries masked it.  Had everyone stayed healthy there were going to problems with that defense and that's what we are seeing now.

On paper this should be a much better dline but this defense is re-defining what it means to play worse.