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Should the Falcons fire Dan Quinn? Bill Barnwell ESPN

126 posts in this topic

6 minutes ago, CraigSmackDaddy said:

I may be the only one who agrees with you on this.  I don’t understand the hate for TD.  Still think this team has a lot of talent.  Should we have given Free and Tru large contracts, nope but hindsight is 20/20.

Hindsight??! There were plenty of people screaming not to do it. TD picks have been garbage.
 

SB caliber team in what sense? His picks outside of a couple always under perform.

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Something else to consider WRT Debo -- that one play that Bret Kollman outlined versus (I think) the Colts, where Allen and Tru didn't switch down, Debo was the ONLY guy on the defense who saw it, and he was late getting to the play because he was playing his assignment.

A lot of times, a guy can look bad because his teammates screwed up.  I remember last season several times people bagged on the corners when the safety missed his assignment and the corner almost made the play.  And vice-versa (though this was a pretty common problem with Kazee).

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3 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

Something else to consider WRT Debo -- that one play that Bret Kollman outlined versus (I think) the Colts, where Allen and Tru didn't switch down, Debo was the ONLY guy on the defense who saw it, and he was late getting to the play because he was playing his assignment.

A lot of times, a guy can look bad because his teammates screwed up.  I remember last season several times people bagged on the corners when the safety missed his assignment and the corner almost made the play.  And vice-versa (though this was a pretty common problem with Kazee).

I know what you are saying and im not really calling out those moments. Im running out of time because i need to break down my teams game. There was a play with a off tackle run to debo, instead of filling the game debo ran after someone else. Its like he didnt even see the run key. its mostly stuff like that and the jogging. 

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14 minutes ago, SPITFIRE said:

He was good. 

I want to see him keep the spot if he keeps playing well.  Bye Tru, hello $5M in cap space next year and $15M-$14M the following 2 years after.

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Just now, Ergo Proxy said:

I was to see him keep the spot if he keeps playing well.  Bye Tru, hello $5M in cap space next year and $15M-$14M the following 2 years after.

We seem to be playing a lot of man on 3rd downs and strangely we are playing off man in 3rd downs. 

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2 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

:ninja:

Sheff will probably replace Oliver's snaps when Tru is healthy, but honestly, Oliver was so-so this past game (as opposed to putrid in the first few).  So I'm willing to be a little more patient with him.

In either event, Tru can bounce next season if the cap allows.

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1 hour ago, FinalScore2.0 said:

Like I asked in another thread, what exactly do people expect to change by firing Quinn right now?

Morris or Mularky take over and change the defense. 

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1 hour ago, FinalScore2.0 said:

Like I asked in another thread, what exactly do people expect to change by firing Quinn right now?

No more freaking catchphrases! / thread

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After watching the game I feel like they made some progress. Second half of the game the Defense looked pretty good. It had that swarming look that has been missing. Offense also looks tough to stop when they come out in the 11 look. I feel like the deep crosses to Hooper will only work on the Cardinals though, we dont have that look enough to make people believe we are doing something else besides a mis-direction play.  Devonta looks good. Our problem imo on D is the scheme relies to much on good line backer player and we are missing that energy and force player in Neal. 

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8 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

Sheff will probably replace Oliver's snaps when Tru is healthy, but honestly, Oliver was so-so this past game (as opposed to putrid in the first few).  So I'm willing to be a little more patient with him.

In either event, Tru can bounce next season if the cap allows.

That's what happens when you no longer have mismatch CBs. Tru and Oliver don't play the same game. Sheffield isn't scared to jam at the LOS and play physical. Same with Oliver. As a result, you saw a small improvement at CB because of at least having CBs with the same play style. That's been overlooked for a while. Tru likes to avoid contact and rely on his athleticism. 

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Just now, vel said:

That's what happens when you no longer have mismatch CBs. Tru and Oliver don't play the same game. Sheffield isn't scared to jam at the LOS and play physical. Same with Oliver. As a result, you saw a small improvement at CB because of at least having CBs with the same play style. That's been overlooked for a while. Tru likes to avoid contact and rely on his athleticism. 

To be fair to Tru, it's hard to run with your head jammed up your ***.

Tru's problems honestly aren't physical, though I agree with you completely.  Tru's problems are between his ears.  And the sad thing is he knows better and he still puts that garbage on tape.  Just lazy.

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1 hour ago, FinalScore2.0 said:

Like I asked in another thread, what exactly do people expect to change by firing Quinn right now?

To begin, you only reach this point because you’ve hit rock-bottom as a team and as its HC.  It’s time for a new direction, even if that means an interim HC for the rest of the year. Letting Quinn go and putting someone else in charge gives fans and players a very visual, definitive turning-of-the-page no matter who that person is.

A change would take the weight of the Quinn drama off the players’ back. They would probably be excited to hear somebody with a fresh voice and viewpoint. Maybe the players would loosen up and play a little better for somebody else. Can’t play much worse.

Whoever is the interim HC, there will be no pressure on that guy or the players because they’re now trying to clean up the mess and regroup. No fan in their right mind would expect an instant transformation from where this team is at right now, especially on the defensive side of the ball. I’m among those who would just like to see somebody else with the Headset on the sidelines, even if they presided over another loss.

Again, the attendance these next two home games will tell the tale as to Quinn’s continuing on as HC. If the place is virtually empty, you know the announcers will really play that up and stir the pot with close-ups of Lame Duck Dan still standing along the sidelines pretending he’s not a lame duck. That would be an embarrassment for Blank.

Then the team will come out and get trashed by the Rams and then the Seahawks to put the icing on the fail cake. Doesn't seem like much more of an attractive scenario to finish out the year than just firing him and appointing an interim imo. Especially since there hasn't been one iota of progress made on cleaning up the defense in these last few weeks.

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Just now, JDaveG said:

To be fair to Tru, it's hard to run with your head jammed up your ***.

Tru's problems honestly aren't physical, though I agree with you completely.  Tru's problems are between his ears.  And the sad thing is he knows better and he still puts that garbage on tape.  Just lazy.

Yep. He thinks he can just out athletic guys and it works sometimes but the more crafty guys give him fits because of his lazy technique. The problem is he's in scheme designed for proper technique first, then athleticism. You don't play your assignment correctly, you and the rest of the defense are beat before it begins. 

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1 hour ago, SPITFIRE said:

This is a red hearing, when we sent pressure he ran out of the pocket and picked up more yardage. This kid was more than exception of escaping the pocket. Your best option is to rush few and keep more eyes on him in coverage to try and control the passing game. 

A red herring? We have 5 sacks on the season lol :doh:

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3 minutes ago, vel said:

That's what happens when you no longer have mismatch CBs. Tru and Oliver don't play the same game. Sheffield isn't scared to jam at the LOS and play physical. Same with Oliver. As a result, you saw a small improvement at CB because of at least having CBs with the same play style. That's been overlooked for a while. Tru likes to avoid contact and rely on his athleticism. 

He has been afraid since that injury...

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Just now, Ergo Proxy said:

He has been afraid since that injury...

Yep. Plays a totally passive game. Even in run defense. He's avoided contact like the plague in a scheme that demands physicality. Think about that. That's why I'm for scrubbing this whole thing. DQ deserves a lot of the blame for allowing these things for so long. Tru should have been on a very short leash after that Browns game but because he was the "#1 CB on the team" he was allowed to keep going. All of this set precedence to what was allowed. Now it's snowballed into a problem I don't think he can correct. 

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3 minutes ago, vel said:

Yep. Plays a totally passive game. Even in run defense. He's avoided contact like the plague in a scheme that demands physicality. Think about that. That's why I'm for scrubbing this whole thing. DQ deserves a lot of the blame for allowing these things for so long. Tru should have been on a very short leash after that Browns game but because he was the "#1 CB on the team" he was allowed to keep going. All of this set precedence to what was allowed. Now it's snowballed into a problem I don't think he can correct. 

Vic our pass rush specialist and Tru our #1 CB...

Look no further as to why we can't get off the field on 3rd downs. (Also checks on Neal's replacement and tackling/YAC stats, yep)

I've noticed Foye spelling Debo a few snaps so far this season. Pitch count or protecting his foot?

I've also seen Campbell play Vic's spot at "OLB" in the Base D.

This front is better vs the run but Tyeler would've been just fine at 1T and Grady at 3T in base in the old 4 man front.

The issue is we don't have enough DEs vs the run??? Bailey and Cominsky, even Takk, gotta be good enough on run D to let us go back to 4-3 and get Foye on the field more and Vic pushed to less snaps.

What could hurt?

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7 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Vic our pass rush specialist and Tru our #1 CB...

Look no further as to why we can't get off the field on 3rd downs. (Also checks on Neal's replacement and tackling/YAC stats, yep)

I've noticed Foye spelling Debo a few snaps so far this season. Pitch count or protecting his foot?

I've also seen Campbell play Vic's spot at "OLB" in the Base D.

This front is better vs the run but Tyeler would've been just fine at 1T and Grady at 3T in base in the old 4 man front.

The issue is we don't have enough DEs vs the run??? Bailey and Cominsky, even Takk, gotta be good enough on run D to let us go back to 4-3 and get Foye on the field more and Vic pushed to less snaps.

What could hurt?

The thing is, Vic has the athleticism and strength to set the edge and play the run well.  I've seen him do it.  As with pass rushing, it's his lazy effort that is a problem.  He's capable of doing it, he just won't give it sufficient effort to develop it consistently.

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3 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

The thing is, Vic has the athleticism and strength to set the edge and play the run well.  I've seen him do it.  As with pass rushing, it's his lazy effort that is a problem.  He's capable of doing it, he just won't give it sufficient effort to develop it consistently.

He's been better in the 3-4/5-2 at setting the edge but he was replaced just last year and put on a pitch count for failing in Base 4-3...

Also:

 

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19 minutes ago, Dr Long Shot said:

A red herring? We have 5 sacks on the season lol :doh:

Talking about this game vs this quaterback. Its not a one size fits all thing, you cannot just suddenly start calling plays out of your gameplan or just abandon the research you did because they convert a play. Moving mobile quarter backs off the spot with inside pressure does not really serve a purpose other than putting them on the run which they are comfortable with. 

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1 hour ago, vel said:

DQ is the DC. The defensive coordinator of this team is doing a terrible job. They are the worst defense in the NFL. The previous DC was fired and replaced with the current DC because he was going to do a better job. He is failing at that. Hence, firing the DC is a no brainer. It just so happens to be the HC. DQ made this bet. He's losing it and at the same time losing his job in the process. The offense took their lumps but are finding their footing. If they win any games in the near future, it will be because of the offense scoring 50 points because 30 clearly doesn't cut it. 

Smitty got fired for less. He was 2-6 by the bye week. DQ is headed for a worse output with an easily more talented roster. 

Quinn appointed himself defensive coordinator because he knew that regardless of who the coordinator was, this was his last rodeo with Arthur Blank.  He decided if he was going down, he was gonna be the one to determine that, not another coordinator...

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