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Why Matt Ryan takes so many sacks


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1 hour ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

Plays where every receiver is covered happens all the time but you have QB's that can buy enough time to spring their guy open and you have QB's that don't have that ability. Simple stuff. 

I also acknowledged Ryan didn't even have to vacate to his left and he could have bought even more time for his receivers to get open. It only takes 1 or 2 plays to change the whole scope of the game/ offensive drive. Is it too much to ask your 30 million dollar QB to put the team on his back and make a play despite poor pass blocking at least once or twice a game on crucial downs? I guess so when your QB is Matt. 

This is the NFL bro everything isn't always going to break your way. You sometimes have to will yourself into success.

there is no such thing as a perfect pocket in the nfl anymore with guys coming off the corners faster than runiing backs and 300 pounders runnining 5.00 flat,drew breese gets it done

ive even seen brady get out of the way sometimes

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There’s no one open. The pressure wasn’t even the worst I’ve seen it this season. He had multiple snaps yesterday where he has time to get through all 5 reads, and you could see his head moving f

Bro do you know how rare it is for a QB to get through all five reads? If a QB has time to get  through all five reads and no one is open, then no one is getting open.

The problem is the offense under Koetter is designed for long developing plays that this OL cannot block for. Need to go back to the quick passing game from years prior 

3 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

Koetter isn’t running the ball because Freeman sucks. We are not getting any kind of efficient production out of him.

If we had a brusier that could push the pile and break these little arm tackles that freeman can’t juke away from he would be more inclined to running.

I wouldn’t want to run with Freeman either tbh. I’d bank on my MVP QB and league best receiving core.

Ito looks nice and decisive running the ball.

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Just now, shango said:

there is no such thing as a perfect pocket in the nfl anymore with guys coming off the corners faster than runiing backs and 300 pounders runnining 5.00 flat,drew breese gets it done

ive even seen brady get out of the way sometimes

Exactly Brees and Brady know how to finesse and finagle a pocket so much better than Matt and it saves their *** soo many times.

But these guys on here are not observant and only watch falcon football so they wouldn’t know what I’m talking about.

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4 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

Koetter isn’t running the ball because Freeman sucks. We are not getting any kind of efficient production out of him.

If we had a brusier that could push the pile and break these little arm tackles that freeman can’t juke away from he would be more inclined to running.

I wouldn’t want to run with Freeman either tbh. I’d bank on my MVP QB and league best receiving core.

 

Ito looked pretty good averaging 5.5 yards per carry.

 

......too bad Koetter only let him get 2 carries.

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33 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

I’m not exaggerating your point. You’re exaggerating your point. I’m showing you where he held the ball for almost 6 seconds and you’re saying he should have done this and that and brought a few seconds more.

 

But that’s neither nor there. Basically what you’re saying is it’s Matt? You don’t have an issue with Kutty? If you’ve already answered that forgive me. I missed it.

Matt Ryan is not a playmaker.  We can go over this and over this.  Even on those " window" throws he made, he was making safe throws in most of them where only HIS receiver could get the ball.  Zip some up the middle of the defense and beat the corner, linebacker or safety with it.   You know he has a weak arm.  I didn't want to get into this back and forth but the OP is right.  You don't have to be Michael Vick to be a playmaker, just be able to extend plays or have the ability and instincts to make plays when the play call is covered or breaking down. 

Even if Ryan could run he doesn't have the arm to throw darts back across his body and has to set his feet, especially if forced to his left.  Does this make Ryan a bad quarterback? Obviously no.  What it does though is give the advantage to the defense when they know that if they shut down the initial play they don't have to worry about Ryan.  Daniel Jones up in New York is the prime example.  The Eli Manning model is gone.  The Daniel Jones playmaker at quarterback is where its at now because these defenses are just too big and fast now.  Daniel Jones is the type of quarterback who can flourish the way the NFL is going...

Edited by slickgadawg
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6 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Matt Ryan is not a playmaker.  We can go over this and over this.  Even on those " window" throws me made, he was making safe throws in most of them where only HIS receiver could get the ball.  Zip some up the middle of the defense and beat the corner, linebacker or safety with it.   You know he has a weak arm.  I didn't want to get into this back and forth but the OP is right.  You don't have to be Michael Vick to be a playmaker, just be able to send plays or have the ability and instincts to make plays when the play call is covered or breaking down. 

Even if Ryan could run he doesn't have the arm to throw darts back across his body and has to set his feet, especially if forced to his left.  Does this make Ryan a bad quarterback? Obviously no.  What it does though is give the advantage to the defense when they know that if they shut down the initial play they don't have to worry about Ryan.  Daniel Jones up in New York is the prime example.  The Eli Manning model is gone.  The Daniel Jones playmaker at quarterback is where its at now because these defenses are just too big and fast now...

Bro that is exactly where those throws are supposed to be placed. Where only your receiver can get them. I don’t know if you’re realizing this but the criticism you’re making is actually a compliment.

And I never argued Ryan was a playmaker.

Edited by PeytonMannings Forehead
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7 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Matt Ryan is not a playmaker.  We can go over this and over this.  Even on those " window" throws he made, he was making safe throws in most of them where only HIS receiver could get the ball.  Zip some up the middle of the defense and beat the corner, linebacker or safety with it.   You know he has a weak arm.  I didn't want to get into this back and forth but the OP is right.  You don't have to be Michael Vick to be a playmaker, just be able to extend plays or have the ability and instincts to make plays when the play call is covered or breaking down. 

Even if Ryan could run he doesn't have the arm to throw darts back across his body and has to set his feet, especially if forced to his left.  Does this make Ryan a bad quarterback? Obviously no.  What it does though is give the advantage to the defense when they know that if they shut down the initial play they don't have to worry about Ryan.  Daniel Jones up in New York is the prime example.  The Eli Manning model is gone.  The Daniel Jones playmaker at quarterback is where its at now because these defenses are just too big and fast now.  Daniel Jones is the type of quarterback who can flourish the way the NFL is going...

Peep the guys bringing up “Vick” or “mobile” QB to exaggerate my point. No one is asking Ryan to be a mobile QB or buy 10+ seconds every time a play breaks down. 

Just a little more jazz in the pocket from Ryan and this offense could take off. Having a better arm would help but thats asking for too much. 

Observation skills suck for the homer crowd.  

Edited by Jerz #Quinning
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26 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

Koetter isn’t running the ball because Freeman sucks. We are not getting any kind of efficient production out of him.

If we had a brusier that could push the pile and break these little arm tackles that freeman can’t juke away from he would be more inclined to running.

I wouldn’t want to run with Freeman either tbh. I’d bank on my MVP QB and league best receiving core.

Kyle Shanahan got two productive seasons out of Freeman. Sark did as well before injuries slowed Free down.

What's Koetter's excuse? Koetter never got efficient production out of any RB except Maurice Jones-Drew, when Blaine Gabbert was the starter and he was an awful passer.

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Just now, Jerz #Quinning said:

Peep the guys bringing up “Vick” or “mobile” QB to exaggerate my point. No one is asking Ryan to be a mobile QB or buy 10+ seconds every time a olay breaks down. 

Just a little more jazz in the pocket from Ryan and this offense could take off. Having a better arm would help but thats asking for too much. 

Observation skills suck for the homer crowd.  

 

I'm not a homer. I'm just fair.

 

Ryan has not played well and I have not gone against that.

 

You said that Ryan couldn't throw in tight windows. Proof was shown that he could. Can't argue with proof.

 

You also said that Ryan wasn't mobile enough. The point of my post was that mobility doesn't make it easy to avoid pressure and sacks. Quality of the o-line and pocket awareness are more important than mobility. Brees and Brady have great pocket awareness but aren't known for being mobile.

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The Falcons are under no obligation to start Freeman just because he has a bigger contract. The problem is the other team seems to know when they're running the ball and when they're throwing the ball.

There are times when Freeman picks up a good gain, then get stuck on another run play. How often do we see three defenders in the backfield when Freeman gets the ball?

Koetter Is a bad play caller. Everything he runs is telegraphed. It's like 2013 and 14 all over again.

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Just now, DawnOfThemBirds said:

You said that Ryan couldn't throw in tight windows. Proof was shown that he could. Can't argue with proof.

 

You also said that Ryan wasn't mobile enough. The point of my post was that mobility doesn't make it easy to avoid pressure and sacks. Quality of the o-line and pocket awareness are more important than mobility. Brees and Brady have great pocket awareness but aren't known for being mobile.

Don’t put words in my mouth. Show me where I said Ryan couldn’t throw in tight windows.

Brees and Brady are the cusp of my whole thread. They know how to occasionally buy time and finagle a pocket much better than Ryan. And it saves their butts plenty of times and aids the offense.

The example I used with Minshew should’ve told you I’m not clammoring for a mobile QB. Just one with more pocket awareness. Do you guys comprehend anything?

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14 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

Bro that is exactly where those throws are supposed to be placed. Where only your receiver can get them. I don’t know if you’re realizing this but the criticism you’re making is actually a compliment.

And I never argued Ryan was a playmaker.

I would argue that he is a playmaker.

We have seen him make a **** ton of plays.

 

You don't get to 50,000+ yards and. 340ish tds without making some plays

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10 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

Don’t put words in my mouth. Show me where I said Ryan couldn’t throw in tight windows.

Brees and Brady are the cusp of my whole thread. They know how to occasionally buy time and finagle a pocket much better than Ryan. And it saves their butts plenty of times and aids the offense.

The example I used with Minshew should’ve told you I’m not clammoring for a mobile QB. Just one with more pocket awareness. Do you guys comprehend anything?

 

My bad, PeytonManning's Forehead responded to another poster about Ryan's arm strength. I thought it was you.

 

I agree with Brees and Brady. Both have great pocket awareness. They also have good o-lines.

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21 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

How many games they win?

??? That’s not the premise of your thread and he’s been really sucking hard this year. Taking sacks. Missing open receivers. Heck go read the latest article yesterday about him in the Houston Chronicle. This is just an example of the type of QB you desire sucking donkey balls so far this year which just proves that there’s a whole lot more to it than being mobile. 

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Just now, Black Francis said:

??? That’s not the premise of your thread and he’s been really sucking hard this year. Taking sacks. Missing open receivers. Heck go read the latest article yesterday about him in the Houston Chronicle. This is just an example of the type of QB you desire sucking donkey balls so far this year which just proves that there’s a whole lot more to it than being mobile. 

You sure like to babble don’t you? Where in my thread did I even mention Deshaun Watson or a QB “like” him.

Learn how to interpret someones stance correctly and comprehend for a change.

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3 hours ago, Geneaut said:

I did. I filled in your blanks.

I don't think the conversation has anything to do with wanting Michael Vick back.  I've said it 100 times.  Part of the problem is that Matt Ryan doesn't extend plays.  I don't think anyone believes we need a QB that runs 4.42.  What we need is a guys that can do more than what all QB's should be able to do.  I think a lot of people see Ryan as a guy that he only does the minimum the QB position requires.  If a WR is open, he hits him.  That's great and all, but I look at it as you are paid to win games.  I need you to actually go out an make a couple of plays/throws a game that keep the team moving and or winning.  Now, we can have this conversation about other players too.  RB, we don't have one right now.  Julio has done his part, not so much Sunday.  Ridley was really good as a rookie, but absent for some reason this year.  QB gets the most money, the ball is in his hands on every snap, he has to be a difference maker to have a real shot.

Ryan, for all his success doesn't elevate the team at any point in a game.  Brees, Rodgers, Mahomes, Brady, Roethlisberger have all been that "X" factor at times.  Ryan has never been that.  If you just want a QB to hit open WRs, fine.  We have that.  Ryan will continue to get yards and win some games.  If you want to win a title, you need a guy to stand out at times during a game.

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39 minutes ago, Black Francis said:

Deshaun Watson was the most sacked player last year. 62. 

You’re actually helping make the OP point. How can far less athletic QBs get sacked less? Because they know how to be just elusive enough to avoid the rush and deliver the ball.

You don’t need Vick or Deshaun level of athleticism, but you definitely need a more athletic QB if everyone acknowledges the other players are getting more athletic. And you see that around the league.

Deshaun holds the ball and they seem to have a lot of long routes in their playbook.

People are confusing “spectacular running play” with “avoid the rush and make a play”.  Matt does have slow feet and for some reason doesn’t keep both hands on the ball sometimes when he gets sacked, which leads to the fumbles.

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7 minutes ago, Jerz #Quinning said:

You sure like to babble don’t you? Where in my thread did I even mention Deshaun Watson or a QB “like” him.

Learn how to interpret someones stance correctly and comprehend for a change.

You mentioned elusivenes and not being nimble which I agree Ryan is not I’m just pointing out that there is more to sacks and sustaining drives than that by using an example of a player who is very elusive and very nimble that led the league in sacks last year at 62 and already has 18 this year. My response was perfectly reasonable. I comprehend just fine. Your takes are simplistic at best. Ryan can’t run = more sacks. Watson can run = more sacks? Wait how does that work? 

Also,  it’s not that important. Also if “like” ooooooohhh is code for “black” then just go there I can take it. I’m Black Francis  man! 

 

 

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49 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

Bro that is exactly where those throws are supposed to be placed. Where only your receiver can get them. I don’t know if you’re realizing this but the criticism you’re making is actually a compliment.

And I never argued Ryan was a playmaker.

That wasn't a criticism of his placement, my criticism is his ball speed.  The throws where a quarterback beats the defender to the ball with arm strength.  Those were very good throws by Ryan in those examples...

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Just now, Black Francis said:

You mentioned elusivenes and not being nimble which I agree Ryan is not I’m just pointing out that there is more to sacks and sustaining drives than that by using an example of a player who is very elusive and very nimble that led the league in sacks last year at 62 and already has 18 this year. My response was perfectly reasonable. I comprehend just fine. Your takes are simplistic at best. Ryan can’t run = more sacks. Watson can run = more sacks? Wait how does that work? 

Also,  it’s not that important. Also if “like” ooooooohhh is code for “black” then just go there I can take it. I’m Black Francis  man! 

I think Brees is elusive and nimble on his feet. Have you seen him work a pocket? The example I used was Gardner freaking Minshew. You assumed Watson was the peak of my stance since he is so athletic and nimble. LOL Your response was so off base on a simplistic take. Hmmm

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