Ultimate X’s and O’x thread

[Spts1 6,615]

4 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

We were in Nickel 74% of the time last year. Base 22%. 

It's a passing league. Increasingly, it's a basketball-passing league....get versatile athletes on the field and match-em up. 

Send this memo to Zeke out in Dallas, Mexico or wherever he is at...

[Spts1 6,615]

1 minute ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

But even Baltimore isnt doing the old style 3-4 as much anymore. They had 6+ defensive backs on the field 26% of the time last year. They were in Nickel 57% of the time. Pittsburgh was almost a pure thirds split between base 3-4, nickel, and dime+. 

 

Arena Football League Lite...

[TheFatboi 28,987]

Just now, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

But even Baltimore isnt doing the old style 3-4 as much anymore. They had 6+ defensive backs on the field 26% of the time last year. They were in Nickel 57% of the time. Pittsburgh was almost a pure thirds split between base 3-4, nickel, and dime+. 

 

Absolutely. Nobody is. When I say a team is this or that I’m talking about their base formation of what you would see against 21 personnel. Every team still has a base defense so you can just use one word and they know what it means. “Base”. Of course im a passing league defenses are in nickel much more. But their base defense is whatever the defensive philosophy is built on. More teams are multiple depending on who they play. Quinn is going multiple but his base defense is still 4-3. 

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry 7,402]

6 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

This. It's getting to the point of "find the best guys and just run nickel"

Eventually some team is gonna start running two TE's or bring a FB back and just run down teams throats. Seattle did it for awhile. Pats did it last year vs the Chargers.

Think you're gonna see it a lot more from NE and Philly this year. SF too.

[vel 32,056]

35 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

We really could run any defensive formation we want.

On any snap. They can show one and shift to another. It's enough talent to do it. 

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry 7,402]

4 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Send this memo to Zeke out in Dallas, Mexico or wherever he is at...

I feel bad for that dude. Really for all RBs. He's among the best of his generation. Unfortunately, he's largely replaceable. Especially there.  

 

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry 7,402]

1 minute ago, vel said:

On any snap. They can show one and shift to another. It's enough talent to do it. 

That's what Fangio does and its worked for him for years. Terrific disguises on the back end. Messing with keys and forcing confusion in the QBs eyes. 

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry 7,402]

6 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Arena Football League Lite...

*shrug*

We've been saying this for years....passing is much much more efficient than rushing. Honestly, at this point, the only true value running the ball gives you is on 3rd and short and the ability to grind the clock with a lead. It doesnt provide any value to play action aside from the "fake" element. It's a negative EPA play in pretty much every other scenario. 

I know the traditionalists dont want to hear it but it is what it is. 

[vel 32,056]

8 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

But even Baltimore isnt doing the old style 3-4 as much anymore. They had 6+ defensive backs on the field 26% of the time last year. They were in Nickel 57% of the time. Pittsburgh was almost a pure thirds split between base 3-4, nickel, and dime+. 

 

Baltimore is what I hope we go for. That defense was built for 2019 football. Same with the Chargers unit, except they weren't ready to play 3 yards and a cloud of dust football. I think we're equipped to match styles for whatever the week calls for. 

[Ovie_Lover 29,582]

7 minutes ago, vel said:

Baltimore is what I hope we go for. That defense was built for 2019 football. Same with the Chargers unit, except they weren't ready to play 3 yards and a cloud of dust football. I think we're equipped to match styles for whatever the week calls for. 

Chargers are weak af at DT and LB tho

[Spts1 6,615]

35 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

*shrug*

We've been saying this for years....passing is much much more efficient than rushing. Honestly, at this point, the only true value running the ball gives you is on 3rd and short and the ability to grind the clock with a lead. It doesnt provide any value to play action aside from the "fake" element. It's a negative EPA play in pretty much every other scenario. 

I know the traditionalists dont want to hear it but it is what it is. 

I have to disagree.  What you are saying is true because of the " copycat " element of coaching but from a play style, I still prefer either a running game or a balanced attack.  Baltimore and San Francisco under Harbaugh got to the Superbowl with ground and pound offenses that could throw the ball when necessary.  In fact, as great as the Falcon offense has been, that offense would score soo quick that the defense would be out there for a long time and is known for giving up big leads ever since Quinn became head coach.  This difference in opinion on passing offenses vs ball control offenses started back with Buddy Ryan straight right crossing Gilbride on national tv back in the 90s...  Gilbride was trying to run the score up and not let Ryan's defense get a break...

in FACT, thats the year that Houston blew that 35-3 lead in the playoffs...

"  run the ball, you killing my defense "

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by slickgadawg

[vel 32,056]

6 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

Chargers are weak af at DT and LB tho

Yea that's why they couldn't hunker down and play physical football when they needed to. But their pass defense was legit. So fun to watch. 

[Ovie_Lover 29,582]

Just now, vel said:

Yea that's why they couldn't hunker down and play physical football when they needed to. But their pass defense was legit. So fun to watch. 

Really was. They had S's playing LB and got steam rolled. 

[Ergo Proxy 25,926]

1 hour ago, TheFatboi said:

We’ve been running some 52 as well but it’s been 5 down linemen. I’m familiar with 52 or 50 defense because that’s what we ran in high school my freshman year in San Francisco. We called it eagle d and they called me eagle meat cause I used to slice it up and I had the defense chasing me like dogs chasing some meat lol. D@mn that brought back some memories. So I’m very familiar with the 52 defense.  

Is there a variation of 52 without them being in a hands down stance?

I’ll pay more attention to our starting unit tonight or when personnel matches their formation.

[TheFatboi 28,987]

19 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Is there a variation of 52 without them being in a hands down stance?

I’ll pay more attention to our starting unit tonight or when personnel matches their formation.

That 1st number represents down linemen. 5, 4, 3. So however many guys have their hand in the dirt that’s how the qb is gonna read it. If 5 guys have their hand in the dirt and there’s only 2 LB’s it’s a 5-2. If it’s 4 DL then it’s either gonna be 3 or 4 LB’s. However the front seven is determines what the look is. Just like 21 personnel is 2 backs and 1 TE. 13 is 1 back and 3 TE’s. The 1st number on defense represents the linemen that have their hand in the dirt. The second number represents LB’s. Now you try to disguise what you’re doing by having guys hands in the dirt and then 2 guys stand up and confuse the qb

[Ergo Proxy 25,926]

2 minutes ago, TheFatboi said:

That 1st number represents down linemen. 5, 4, 3. So however many guys have their hand in the dirt that’s how the qb is gonna read it. If 5 guys have their hand in the dirt and there’s only 2 LB’s it’s a 5-2. If it’s 4 DL then it’s either gonna be 3 or 4 LB’s. However the front seven is determines what the look is. Just like 21 personnel is 2 backs and 1 TE. 13 is 1 back and 3 TE’s. The 1st number on defense represents the linemen that have their hand in the dirt. The second number represents LB’s. Now you try to disguise what you’re doing by having guys hands in the dirt and then 2 guys stand up and confuse the qb

Yeah, I understood that much. Got it.

I guess I was concluding we started the plays more with 3-4 than 52 last time.

But it sorta doesn’t matter since you can do either or even “4-3” out of our personnel if the matchup is good.

Edited August 8, 2019 by Ergo Proxy

[Vandy 39,408]

6 hours ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

@Vandy takes serious exception to the male form when it’s not fully covered.   I suspect male cheerleaders are in peril if V9 is in the building.  

But if you really want to disrupt his lunch, post a Sugar Ray Edwards picture from his modeling days.  Taking your life in your hands

 

[vel 32,056]

I think we're overdue for a thread from myself or @PeytonMannings Forehead. I don't have the computer I used to have to break down film as easily, but I may try and bust one out before the season...

[Vandy 39,408]

2 hours ago, slickgadawg said:

Quinn was happy with his linebackers and safety play ( outside of Riley).  He was happy with his base 4-3 with the EXCEPTION of the edge rushing.  In other words I believe the ONLY reason he is toying with the 3-4 is for that reason.  He can scheme and show different looks from his base 4-3 like has been pointed out...

Gotcha. 

I personally believe his seat got warmer after last season’s disaster on defense. Yeah, we had injuries, but anyone watching that defense continually trotting Richards/Riley out there game after game could see things were way out of synch.

So nothing held back in 2019.....different alignments (4-3/3-4/5-2/4-4), blitzes, 3-safety sets....all with an aggressive attacking defense. 

I like it. 

[FalconsIn2012 35,691]

31 minutes ago, vel said:

I think we're overdue for a thread from myself or @PeytonMannings Forehead. I don't have the computer I used to have to break down film as easily, but I may try and bust one out before the season...

PMF is MIA.  Only seen him 2-3 times since around week 12 of last year

[Spts1 6,615]

Against the Dolphins, Quinn added a little more to his base 3-4 scheme.  Here is another version of his nickel.  He brings Kazee in on this 3rd down play.  The Falcons are in their 3-4 with cover 1 man  with the strong safety up covering the x receiver.  You have 1 OLB rushing from the weak side. Both Mikes are up at their gaps.  They both fake the blitz and drop back to cover the hook and slant area.  The fake blitz took away any hot routes allowing the outside linebacker to get the sack:

 

[Spts1 6,615]

Here is a weird one.  Nothing vanilla about this. Quinn does FOUR things here.  Up front he is playing two guys in the dirt. ( he did this numerous times through out the game).  One of the ends stands up and replaces the OLB on the weakside and nearly gets the sack.  The strong safety is up covering the slot. The Mikes Blitz.  Kazee is down covering the hook area and the free safety is deep.  Its man in the secondary. THIS is a wild one.  I have to look into what the call was here:

Edited August 9, 2019 by slickgadawg

[Spts1 6,615]

My favorite play of the game for the wrong reason.  Remember I said the outside linebackers have contain on running plays in my very first post?  Quinn is playing 3-4 cover 1 nickel with the strong safety playing one outside linebacker and Ishmael playing the other.  The Falcons blitz Ishamel and one of the Mikes from the weakside. The Dolphins hand off the ball to the strong side and the strong safety gets demolished on this play.  I bet Quinn is gonna rewind this over and over.  The safety had very good recognition of the play, the problem is he let the tight end get into his pads and it was OVER:

 

Edited August 9, 2019 by slickgadawg

[vel 32,056]

31 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Here is a weird one.  Nothing vanilla about this. Quinn does FOUR things here.  Up front he is playing two guys in the dirt. ( he did this numerous times through out the game).  One of the ends stands up and replaces the OLB on the weakside.  The strong safety is up covering the slot. The Mikes Blitz.  Kazee is down covering the hook area and the free safety is deep.  Its man in the secondary. THIS is a wild one.  I have to look into what the call was here:

Q

This is one of my favorite coverages. Force the offense to win with three men out in routes and the QB with pressure in his lap. If not for a heIl of a play by both Rosen and Williams, this is a sack or third down stop. 

[vel 32,056]

21 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

My favorite play of the game for the wrong reason.  Remember I said the outside linebackers have contain on running plays in my very first post?  Quinn is playing 3-4 cover 1 nickel with the strong safety playing one outside linebacker and Ishmael playing the other.  The Falcons blitz Ishamel and one of the Mikes from the weakside. The Dolphins hand off the ball off strong and the strong safety gets demolished on this play.

 

This is a prime example of understanding what pre-season is. Parker Baldwin is not Keanu Neal. He's not making the roster. Yet, he's blown off the ball 9 yards and is the reason for the massive gain.