Monolith2001

Brian Hill...doubters beware!

340 posts in this topic

On 8/1/2019 at 11:17 PM, Monolith2001 said:

If you have counters in your home, try to lower your shoulder to it and tell me what your head does.  Now imagine if you were also bracing for impact.  Some people act like humans have necks like geese.

All good points. All ignoring the obvious fact that on this clip, Hill was going after the dude with his helmet.

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26 minutes ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

I like Hill as the #3 but no way he overtakes Ito at #2.

Ito made people miss consistently last year despite awful run blocking. I have yet to see Brian Hill create something out of nothing.

I'd really prefer we not go too far down this Hill vs Ito thing.  I personally think Ito proved himself last year enough that he's going nowhere (and don't want him to).  They are different backs with different skillsets.  Not every back can be 5-8, 200lbs and stop and start on a dime just as Ito isn't going to run over to many guys.

That said, this create-something-from-nothing is kind of a straw man.  He's getting the yards and making plays.  You're almost saying "he doesn't do it the way I want it to be done".   The man has just 31 career rushes in actual NFL action with a 6.3 avg.  He's had to spend most of his time running behind patchwork 2nd and 3rd string lines.  Certainly can't tell me he had a better line to run behind Thursdsay night than any other back.  He's made the most of his opps.

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HOF Game...just Hill

Refresher for those who don't know what Hill is capable of.  The first few highlights look like what I've seen of him late.

 

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36 minutes ago, falcndave said:

All good points. All ignoring the obvious fact that on this clip, Hill was going after the dude with his helmet.

Hehe.  I'm pretty certain neither guy was literally "head hunting".   Hill was not going to get speared out of bounds so he got low to meet the defender and squared up to absorb the hit and then used his leverage to launch the guy (truck).  The helmet contact was incidental to both guys trying to going low.   If you go back and watch the broadcast, there is a replay angle that's from the front looking back at the play (you can DQ in the background looking happy).   In that you can see that Hill never turned into the defender with his head.  You can also clearly see the defender lower his head for the big hit on Hill

I just think this is hard concept for a lot of guys to get because they've never been in that situation. I have been and you got three choices...get out of bounds earlier (lose extra yards), take an uncontested lick from the defender (not recommended) or bow up and take it on and let the chips fall where they may.

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1 hour ago, Monolith2001 said:

I'd really prefer we not go too far down this Hill vs Ito thing.  I personally think Ito proved himself last year enough that he's going nowhere (and don't want him to).  They are different backs with different skillsets.  Not every back can be 5-8, 200lbs and stop and start on a dime just as Ito isn't going to run over to many guys.

That said, this create-something-from-nothing is kind of a straw man.  He's getting the yards and making plays.  You're almost saying "he doesn't do it the way I want it to be done".   The man has just 31 career rushes in actual NFL action with a 6.3 avg.  He's had to spend most of his time running behind patchwork 2nd and 3rd string lines.  Certainly can't tell me he had a better line to run behind Thursdsay night than any other back.  He's made the most of his opps.

This is the best and most logical post in the thread.  Very well said

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1 hour ago, Monolith2001 said:

I'd really prefer we not go too far down this Hill vs Ito thing.  I personally think Ito proved himself last year enough that he's going nowhere (and don't want him to).  They are different backs with different skillsets.  Not every back can be 5-8, 200lbs and stop and start on a dime just as Ito isn't going to run over to many guys.

That said, this create-something-from-nothing is kind of a straw man.  He's getting the yards and making plays.  You're almost saying "he doesn't do it the way I want it to be done".   The man has just 31 career rushes in actual NFL action with a 6.3 avg.  He's had to spend most of his time running behind patchwork 2nd and 3rd string lines.  Certainly can't tell me he had a better line to run behind Thursdsay night than any other back.  He's made the most of his opps.

Before the HOF game, I was on the Ito is locked into the #2 RB spot, but after watching Hill and hearing DQ's comments on the RB's after Freeman, we're going to get exactly what I was hoping: RBBC. 

Freeman can do everything. After him, you have specialists. Ito is a mini-Free. I love his game, his vision, agility, ability to make guys miss, pass catching out of the backfield. He's like James White for us. But Hill has shown he can play. He's a tough runner, has some moves, has some speed, and is more pure running back but if his pass catching has truly improved, it's going to be dam hard to keep him off the field. Throw in Ollison once he gets adjusted and you have your power back. It's a glut of riches at the position and there should be no reason we don't have a consistent rushing attack if all four are healthy. 

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4 hours ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

I like Hill as the #3 but no way he overtakes Ito at #2.

Ito made people miss consistently last year despite awful run blocking. I have yet to see Brian Hill create something out of nothing. I like Hill's physical side and think he can be our punishing back for goalline style situations but don't think he has what it takes to pass Ito. This is the type of stuff I want to see from Hill before he is sniffing the #2 spot.

I tend to agree with you... but to play devil's advocate: Ito Smith is coming back from a significant knee injury, has he lost half a step? Because Ito isn't really the type of back that can afford to lose any explosiveness. I just saw parts of the preseason game so I don't know how Ito looked out there but he had just 6 yards in 3 carries.

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1 hour ago, Dr Long Shot said:

I tend to agree with you... but to play devil's advocate: Ito Smith is coming back from a significant knee injury, has he lost half a step? Because Ito isn't really the type of back that can afford to lose any explosiveness. I just saw parts of the preseason game so I don't know how Ito looked out there but he had just 6 yards in 3 carries.

I was just trying to find a post that I made a couple months ago,, Where I stated,, I'm Hill and Beasley's biggest fan on these boards.. I think most on here now are seeing why after his HOP Game Sat.  I'm looking forward to how the Board is going to act when My underrated Beasley balls out when ever he hits the field.. Something for me to look forward too.  If these guys stay healthy,, gonna be a lot of fans on this board trying to cover up their negative post about Beasley also... They are now in the process of getting onto the Hill fan Wagon.....  

Welcome aboard Fan Friends !! ..... :mmmhmm:

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9 hours ago, falcndave said:

All good points. All ignoring the obvious fact that on this clip, Hill was going after the dude with his helmet.

Have you ever played football my guy? If you haha you know it moves really fast and the strike point changes in an instant. He leaned in for contact and the angle the tackler came in from placed his head where hills was. Maybe the tackler should’ve lowered his strike zone and got his head out the way. Bottom line is that it was a bang bang play. There was no head intention. I played running and I can assure you I had my share of unintentional head hits. I hated banging my head but I ran a 4.3 so in an instant where I lower my shoulder to strike won’t be the impact point when I meat the defender and he’s running as fast as he can to stop me. The only reason it was called on hill was because the defender was on the losing end. Had it been hill get run over they would’ve called it on the defender. 

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37 minutes ago, ShmevinShmarris said:

Obviously that’s a penalty now.. BUT the defender clearly lowers his own head to initiate contact with as well.

That's the one reason that one shouldn't have been called but that doesn't mean Hill can do it because the defender isn't going to always do that to bail him out. Stop using that as an excuse.

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2 minutes ago, TheFatboi said:

Have you ever played football my guy? If you haha you know it moves really fast and the strike point changes in an instant. He leaned in for contact and the angle the tackler came in from placed his head where hills was. Maybe the tackler should’ve lowered his strike zone and got his head out the way. Bottom line is that it was a bang bang play. There was no head intention. I played running and I can assure you I had my share of unintentional head hits. I hated banging my head but I ran a 4.3 so in an instant where I lower my shoulder to strike won’t be the impact point when I meat the defender and he’s running as fast as he can to stop me. The only reason it was called on hill was because the defender was on the losing end. Had it been hill get run over they would’ve called it on the defender. 

Hill lead with the crown man, that has nothing to do with how fast the game is. It's how he went for the attack, with his crown. Think Quizz vs Earl. That's a penalty now. That's why it was called.

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8 hours ago, Monolith2001 said:

Hehe.  I'm pretty certain neither guy was literally "head hunting".   Hill was not going to get speared out of bounds so he got low to meet the defender and squared up to absorb the hit and then used his leverage to launch the guy (truck).  The helmet contact was incidental to both guys trying to going low.   If you go back and watch the broadcast, there is a replay angle that's from the front looking back at the play (you can DQ in the background looking happy).   In that you can see that Hill never turned into the defender with his head.  You can also clearly see the defender lower his head for the big hit on Hill

I just think this is hard concept for a lot of guys to get because they've never been in that situation. I have been and you got three choices...get out of bounds earlier (lose extra yards), take an uncontested lick from the defender (not recommended) or bow up and take it on and let the chips fall where they may.

Exactly. I ran a 4.3 so where I intended to meet the defender changes by the time we make contact. Guys act like you can lower your shoulders without your head. Wherever your shoulders go your head is going with it. They’re attached lol. 

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4 minutes ago, TheFatboi said:

Exactly. I ran a 4.3 so where I intended to meet the defender changes by the time we make contact. Guys act like you can lower your shoulders without your head. Wherever your shoulders go your head is going with it. They’re attached lol. 

The penalty is leading with the crown though, that's what Hill did. Just like Quizz against Earl. You can hit with your head but you gotta keep it up, you can't be staring at your feet like he was.

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2 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

Hill lead with the crown man, that has nothing to do with how fast the game is. It's how he went for the attack, with his crown. Think Quizz vs Earl. That's a penalty now. That's why it was called.

It absolutely has something to do with the speed. And it always will. There’s nothing you or anyone can say to make me change my mind about this because the speed of the game is too fast. You can go in with your shoulders and still end up hitting the crown of your helmet because the strike area changed. There’s nothing you can say to change my mind about it. I’ve done it too many times. I got hit in the end when I shouldn’t have but guys angle themselves differently. Some guys see a bigger target and change angles and end up banging heads. The guy could’ve chopped hills legs. Whenever I made a tackle when I played corner I took out the runners legs. I NEVR tried to hit a bigger runner above his waist like the guy hill hit did. That’s why you will never get me to see it you’r way. I’ve done it too much. On offense, defense, and special teams. Just don’t even bother me about this subject little brother. I’m immovable on this one. And I have the scars to back me up. Especially when it’s at an angle. If it’s a head on collision I agree with your stance. But those angle hits???!!!!  F*ck outta here!!!  That hit cane from an angle. And like I said the game moves too fast. You think you’re going im with your shoulder but your head meats the defender. 

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8 minutes ago, TheFatboi said:

It absolutely has something to do with the speed. And it always will. There’s nothing you or anyone can say to make me change my mind about this because the speed of the game is too fast. You can go in with your shoulders and still end up hitting the crown of your helmet because the strike area changed. There’s nothing you can say to change my mind about it. I’ve done it too many times. I got hit in the end when I shouldn’t have but guys angle themselves differently. Some guys see a bigger target and change angles and end up banging heads. The guy could’ve chopped hills legs. Whenever I made a tackle when I played corner I took out the runners legs. I NEVR tried to hit a bigger runner above his waist like the guy hill hit did. That’s why you will never get me to see it you’r way. I’ve done it too much. On offense, defense, and special teams. Just don’t even bother me about this subject little brother. I’m immovable on this one. And I have the scars to back me up. Especially when it’s at an angle. If it’s a head on collision I agree with your stance. But those angle hits???!!!!  F*ck outta here!!!  That hit cane from an angle. And like I said the game moves too fast. You think you’re going im with your shoulder but your head meats the defender. 

The entire point of the rule is to keep your head up and protect yourself. Of course you can't change angle if you're staring at your feet while charging someone. But again that's his own decision and one that will continue to get penalties. It can't be something he keeps in his arsenal.

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5 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

The penalty is leading with the crown though, that's what Hill did. Just like Quizz against Earl. You can hit with your head but you gotta keep it up, you can't be staring at your feet like he was.

The earl play I agree with. Because they were head up. But hills play was at an angle. He meant to shoulder that dude but he ran into the head. Change your hit zone if you’re the tackler. Why are you trying to hit a bigger guy up high??? I get mad at our own players for trying to hit big guys above the waist. Better cut his legs like I used to when you have the angle on him. IDGAF if he gets hurt. It’s me it him. I have a real gladiator mentality lil bro. Leave me alone when it comes to the actual battle field lol. I’m violent and I used to try to punish whoever I hit and sometimes their head hit mine even tho that wasn’t my intention. I understand the rule. But you’re gonna get somebody hurt trying to think if he’s leading with the crown instead of just finishing the play. And like I said it’s moving so fast you THINK you’re dropping your shoulder but it ends up being the crown of your helmet. A punishing runner is trying to run you over with his shoulders but the d@mn tackler won’t stay in one spot so he can be punished lol. I know the rule. I don’t like it because the game is too fast and bang bang plays will now Be Called as oenalties. I guarantee if it was hill that got blasted it would’ve been the defender that got the flag. Even Collinsworth said it after the play. And THATS what I don’t like. It was bang bang. Both guys helmet was was in the play. But the loser got the call. 

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3 minutes ago, TheFatboi said:

The earl play I agree with. Because they were head up. But hills play was at an angle. He meant to shoulder that dude but he ran into the head. Change your hit zone if you’re the tackler. Why are you trying to hit a bigger guy up high??? I get mad at our own players for trying to hit big guys above the waist. Better cut his legs like I used to when you have the angle on him. IDGAF if he gets hurt. It’s me it him. I have a real gladiator mentality lil bro. Leave me alone when it comes to the actual battle field lol. I’m violent and I used to try to punish whoever I hit and sometimes their head hit mine even tho that wasn’t my intention. I understand the rule. But you’re gonna get somebody hurt trying to think if he’s leading with the crown instead of just finishing the play. And like I said it’s moving so fast you THINK you’re dropping your shoulder but it ends up being the crown of your helmet. A punishing runner is trying to run you over with his shoulders but the d@mn tackler won’t stay in one spot so he can be punished lol. I know the rule. I don’t like it because the game is too fast and bang bang plays will now Be Called as oenalties. I guarantee if it was hill that got blasted it would’ve been the defender that got the flag. Even Collinsworth said it after the play. And THATS what I don’t like. It was bang bang. Both guys helmet was was in the play. But the loser got the call. 

I can agree with that i get it but as a runner I always tried to keep my eyes up, to me Hill didnt do that. **** free is guilty of it at times.

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2 minutes ago, NWFALCON said:

Hill should’ve hit the stick back for the back juke. That’s what I do in madden. 

Doubt he knows how.

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11 hours ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

I like Hill as the #3 but no way he overtakes Ito at #2.

Ito made people miss consistently last year despite awful run blocking. I have yet to see Brian Hill create something out of nothing. I like Hill's physical side and think he can be our punishing back for goalline style situations but don't think he has what it takes to pass Ito. This is the type of stuff I want to see from Hill before he is sniffing the #2 spot.

OK so you like little, short, shifty runners that average 3.5 ypc. Give me a big back that averages 6.3 ypc.

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1 minute ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

OK so you like little, short, shifty runners that average 3.5 ypc. Give me a big back that averages 6.3 ypc.

Lol at Hill being a "big back"

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