Falconsfan567

Salary Cap

278 posts in this topic

13 hours ago, Duff_Man said:

The salary cap is a crutch that terrible fans use to take shots at team management. It rarely had much implications.

This simply isn’t true.  Since 1994, the best teams are the ones that best manage and manipulate their CAP on a year-to-year basis.  You saying the Bills manipulation of the CAP hasn’t had long term remificstions?

 

Individual Leaders

There are also 10 players with at least $7.5 million in dead money this year. They are in the chart below.  The Bills have 4 of the top 10 Dead Money contracts.  

 

Name

          

 

Dead Money

 

Jason Pierre-Paul

DE

 

$15,000,000

 

Marcell Dareus

DT

 

$13,564,705 

 

Cordy Glenn

OT

 

$9,600,000

 

Eric Wood

C

 

$9,591,668

 

Tyrann Mathieu

S

 

$9,300,000

 

Ndamukong Suh

DT

 

$9,100,000

 

Muhammad Wilkerson

DL

 

$9,000,000

 

Tony Romo

QB

 

$8,900,000

 

Dez Bryant 

WR

 

$8,000,000

 

Tyrod Taylor

QB

 

$7,600,000

 

It isn't a surprise that the Bills are responsible for four of the 10 biggest amounts considering their massive dead money. Bills' occupy the second, third and fourth spots. The collective dead money of those three players (Dareus, Wood and Glenn) are more than every other team's total.

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8 hours ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

This simply isn’t true.  Since 1994, the best teams are the ones that best manage and manipulate their CAP on a year-to-year basis.  You saying the Bills manipulation of the CAP hasn’t had long term remificstions?

 

Individual Leaders

There are also 10 players with at least $7.5 million in dead money this year. They are in the chart below.  The Bills have 4 of the top 10 Dead Money contracts.  

 

Name

          

 

Dead Money

 

Jason Pierre-Paul

DE

 

$15,000,000

 

Marcell Dareus

DT

 

$13,564,705 

 

Cordy Glenn

OT

 

$9,600,000

 

Eric Wood

C

 

$9,591,668

 

Tyrann Mathieu

S

 

$9,300,000

 

Ndamukong Suh

DT

 

$9,100,000

 

Muhammad Wilkerson

DL

 

$9,000,000

 

Tony Romo

QB

 

$8,900,000

 

Dez Bryant 

WR

 

$8,000,000

 

Tyrod Taylor

QB

 

$7,600,000

 

It isn't a surprise that the Bills are responsible for four of the 10 biggest amounts considering their massive dead money. Bills' occupy the second, third and fourth spots. The collective dead money of those three players (Dareus, Wood and Glenn) are more than every other team's total.

Well if you want to use a legendarily terrible organization as some big example, OK. I guess you CAN screw it up, but most teams are doing just fine navigating the ebbs and flows of paying players. The salary cap is a fan boogeyman.

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15 hours ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

This simply isn’t true.  Since 1994, the best teams are the ones that best manage and manipulate their CAP on a year-to-year basis.  You saying the Bills manipulation of the CAP hasn’t had long term remificstions?

 

Individual Leaders

There are also 10 players with at least $7.5 million in dead money this year. They are in the chart below.  The Bills have 4 of the top 10 Dead Money contracts.  

 

Name

          

 

Dead Money

 

Jason Pierre-Paul

DE

 

$15,000,000

 

Marcell Dareus

DT

 

$13,564,705 

 

Cordy Glenn

OT

 

$9,600,000

 

Eric Wood

C

 

$9,591,668

 

Tyrann Mathieu

S

 

$9,300,000

 

Ndamukong Suh

DT

 

$9,100,000

 

Muhammad Wilkerson

DL

 

$9,000,000

 

Tony Romo

QB

 

$8,900,000

 

Dez Bryant 

WR

 

$8,000,000

 

Tyrod Taylor

QB

 

$7,600,000

 

It isn't a surprise that the Bills are responsible for four of the 10 biggest amounts considering their massive dead money. Bills' occupy the second, third and fourth spots. The collective dead money of those three players (Dareus, Wood and Glenn) are more than every other team's total.

Using the Bills as example of what not to do is like using Trump as an example of what not to say. There's a reason that the Bills have only made the playoffs once since 1999 and have had how many head coaches in that time span? The only NFL franchise that more poorly ran than the Bills is the Browns, and even now the Browns appear to have finally gotten the right people in charge that know what they're doing. If you had the rank the NFL teams 1-32 in terms of ownership and front office stability and how to properly run an organization the Bills would be 31st or 32nd. Flip a coin between them and the Raiders.

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38 minutes ago, Falconsfan567 said:

Using the Bills as example of what not to do is like using Trump as an example of what not to say. There's a reason that the Bills have only made the playoffs once since 1999 and have had how many head coaches in that time span? The only NFL franchise that more poorly ran than the Bills is the Browns, and even now the Browns appear to have finally gotten the right people in charge that know what they're doing. If you had the rank the NFL teams 1-32 in terms of ownership and front office stability and how to properly run an organization the Bills would be 31st or 32nd. Flip a coin between them and the Raiders.

This is simply an example showing that the CAP is real, mismanaging it has ramifications and signing everyone to elite FA contracts isn’t advisable.

If you tell me I have 20 million to spend, I will take 3-4 B level starting players over 1 A superstar (unless it’s QB).  Every. Single.  Time.  

Would I rather keep Neal, Hooper & Dre over Grady?  Yes.  If it came down to that choice, in a vacuum, absolutely I would

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On 20/07/2019 at 1:29 PM, Duff_Man said:

The salary cap is a crutch that terrible fans use to take shots at team management. It rarely had much implications.

The salary cap has real implications, just ask Alford, Bryant, Schroeder, Coleman etc. Ask Sanu and Devondre Campbell next year. 

I'm not sure where this narrative comes from that the cap isn't real (I've only seen it peddled on here tbh). Sure it can be manipulated with clever accounting but only to a degree - there is still a finite amount of money to go round. Under the next bargaining agreement I suspect the players will push for fully guaranteed contracts and that will go away.

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8 minutes ago, Smiler11 said:

The salary cap has real implications, just ask Alford, Bryant, Schroeder, Coleman etc. Ask Sanu and Devondre Campbell next year. 

I'm not sure where this narrative comes from that the cap isn't real (I've only seen it peddled on here tbh). Sure it can be manipulated with clever accounting but only to a degree - there is still a finite amount of money to go round. Under the next bargaining agreement I suspect the players will push for fully guaranteed contracts and that will go away.

Great post.  I don’t get the narrative either.  Yes, you can manipulate this year at the expense of next year.  But at some point, those bills come due.  No accounting practice can avoid that.  

Stealing from Peter to feed Paul 

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5 minutes ago, Smiler11 said:

The salary cap has real implications, just ask Alford, Bryant, Schroeder, Coleman etc. Ask Sanu and Devondre Campbell next year. 

I'm not sure where this narrative comes from that the cap isn't real (I've only seen it peddled on here tbh). Sure it can be manipulated with clever accounting but only to a degree - there is still a finite amount of money to go round. Under the next bargaining agreement I suspect the players will push for fully guaranteed contracts and that will go away.

No one ever said the salary cap wasn't real. Just trying to point out that it's not this hard number and under no circumstances ever can you go over that number. You can actually spend more than what the salary cap number is in a given year depending on how you structure contracts, as shown in the Eagles thread about fake contract years. Folks are so worried about us not being able to afford this player or that player, but a couple of the guys you listed, Falcons got rid of them because their play dropped. If they were still good enough to justify their contracts they would still be here. Falcons aren't going to let Neal walk. He'll still be here.

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1 minute ago, Falconsfan567 said:

No one ever said the salary cap wasn't real. Just trying to point out that it's not this hard number and under no circumstances ever can you go over that number. You can actually spend more than what the salary cap number is in a given year depending on how you structure contracts, as shown in the Eagles thread about fake contract years. Folks are so worried about us not being able to afford this player or that player, but a couple of the guys you listed, Falcons got rid of them because their play dropped. If they were still good enough to justify their contracts they would still be here. Falcons aren't going to let Neal walk. He'll still be here.

If Alford, Coleman & Schaeder had no drop in production they would all still be gone.  If our intention was to keep Grady & The Jones’s, we had to cut CAP.  And more cutting will happen next year for those 3 contracts

 

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8 hours ago, Duff_Man said:

Well if you want to use a legendarily terrible organization as some big example, OK. I guess you CAN screw it up, but most teams are doing just fine navigating the ebbs and flows of paying players. The salary cap is a fan boogeyman.

the lions borrowed 10s of millions of dollars of future cap for 2012 and 2013, and with that produced a 4-12 record, and a 7-9 record.

And that borrowed money meant they couldn’t  franchise suh (among other things). 

in addition they were #1 in the nfl sitting on 17 million of dead money for 2015 before the season began.

There are severe and marginal examples of CAP management negatively impacting a franchise.

Ask yourself this: can great CAP management make your team better?

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And it’s back to making tough decisions about who stays and who goes.

Foundation players stay the others unfortunately go.

Simple really and those that go we reload with in the draft.

The CAP isn’t as important if your drafting well that’s the key not the CAP.

You as above lock up your key pieces draft well and losing Schraeders Alford’s Sanu’s and alike aren’t as much of an issue everyone makes them out to be.

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1 hour ago, Falconsfan567 said:

No one ever said the salary cap wasn't real. Just trying to point out that it's not this hard number and under no circumstances ever can you go over that number. You can actually spend more than what the salary cap number is in a given year depending on how you structure contracts, as shown in the Eagles thread about fake contract years. Folks are so worried about us not being able to afford this player or that player, but a couple of the guys you listed, Falcons got rid of them because their play dropped. If they were still good enough to justify their contracts they would still be here. Falcons aren't going to let Neal walk. He'll still be here.

It is a hard number though. What you spend in year and what is charged against the cap are two different things. You can't go over the cap but how contracts are structured (bonus vs salary, likely to be earned incentives vs not likely to be earned) impacts the cap in any given year.

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1 hour ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

Great post.  I don’t get the narrative either.  Yes, you can manipulate this year at the expense of next year.  But at some point, those bills come due.  No accounting practice can avoid that.  

Stealing from Peter to feed Paul 

Bro. The NFLPA cap is imaginary. Only on TATF. We've been a bottom rung cap team for at least four years. Had to jettison plenty cap casualties. Replaced them with C Level wannabees. Will have to drop a few more next year. Headed for cap hail. Cap window is closing quickly. Roster shift coming. Better win a Bowl soon.

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I’ll start worrying about the cap when we stop drafting talent like the jones Neal’s jarretts Ridleys and co.

We keep drafting like that screw the cap.

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2 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

And it’s back to making tough decisions about who stays and who goes.

Foundation players stay the others unfortunately go.

Simple really and those that go we reload with in the draft.

The CAP isn’t as important if your drafting well that’s the key not the CAP.

You as above lock up your key pieces draft well and losing Schraeders Alford’s Sanu’s and alike aren’t as much of an issue everyone makes them out to be.

Can great CAP management make a team better on Sundays?

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4 hours ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

This is simply an example showing that the CAP is real, mismanaging it has ramifications and signing everyone to elite FA contracts isn’t advisable.

If you tell me I have 20 million to spend, I will take 3-4 B level starting players over 1 A superstar (unless it’s QB).  Every. Single.  Time.  

Would I rather keep Neal, Hooper & Dre over Grady?  Yes.  If it came down to that choice, in a vacuum, absolutely I would

In today's NFL you aren't getting 3-4 B guys for 20mil. And either way you should take the game changer. Not all superstars are 20mil either.

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50 minutes ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

Can great CAP management make a team better on Sundays?

Yep much like getting more good players through the door.I don’t think we have had a cap management problem though that’s the thing.Why worry about something we are good at.With salaries we have to pay it’s more important that we draft well.

If we weren’t good at the mentioned no way in **** we resign these guys at the salaries that they are getting.

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When have the Falcons had a cap management problem under this regime.Outside of being screwed by the mess left by McKay and co.

If anything this regime have more than proven to the masses they have a competent handle on this.

If anything all this is to me is a devoted few trying to sling mud at a problem that supposedly exists.

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54 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

Yep much like getting more good players through the door.I don’t think we have had a cap management problem though that’s the thing.Why worry about something we are good at.With salaries we have to pay it’s more important that we draft well.

If we weren’t good at the mentioned no way in **** we resign these guys at the salaries that they are getting.

Exactly my point.  It’s why you shouldn’t be critical of people voicing CAP concerns.  It’s the single biggest part of TD’s job description next to the draft.  It is real.  It is complex.  It is the difference between bad teams and good teams, good teams and great teams.

Do I think TD is top 5 GM with regards to  CAP management?  I do.   But I’ve said it before: we drafted so well that a painful cut was needed to maintain roster balance & integrity.   The options were Grady, Matthews, Debo or Julio. A year ago I thought Matthews made sense (great year BTW, Matthews).  This year I thought Grady.  

Since we will retain all 4, there are some hiccups coming down the pipeline in 2020 & 2021 that are not probable, but absolute.  

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5 minutes ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

Exactly my point.  It’s why you shouldn’t be critical of people voicing CAP concerns.  It’s the single biggest part of TD’s job description next to the draft.  It is real.  It is complex.  It is the difference between bad teams and good teams, good teams and great teams.

Do I think TD is top 5 GM in CAP management.  I do.  But I think there are some hiccups coming down the pipeline in 2020 & 2021 that are not not probable, but absolute.  

Why and what proof do you have of that with the track record he and those responsible for that have.

Its almost as though you implying that there going into these years blind.

Every signing and move will be structured and planned to the dollar.I have no doubt about that. They’ll have had a financially planned this years in advance knowing what’s involved.They understand the NFL environment and what it takes to get deals done.

The biggest issue I have when alot talk about this is because they don’t have the information 1 and can’t see the plan in its entirety paranoia sets in and opinions for the most part are so far off it’s not funny.

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4 hours ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

Exactly my point.  It’s why you shouldn’t be critical of people voicing CAP concerns.  It’s the single biggest part of TD’s job description next to the draft.  It is real.  It is complex.  It is the difference between bad teams and good teams, good teams and great teams.

Do I think TD is top 5 GM with regards to  CAP management?  I do.   But I’ve said it before: we drafted so well that a painful cut was needed to maintain roster balance & integrity.   The options were Grady, Matthews, Debo or Julio. A year ago I thought Matthews made sense (great year BTW, Matthews).  This year I thought Grady.  

Since we will retain all 4, there are some hiccups coming down the pipeline in 2020 & 2021 that are not probable, but absolute.  

 

4 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

Why and what proof do you have of that with the track record he and those responsible for that have.

Its almost as though you implying that there going into these years blind.

Every signing and move will be structured and planned to the dollar.I have no doubt about that. They’ll have had a financially planned this years in advance knowing what’s involved.They understand the NFL environment and what it takes to get deals done.

The biggest issue I have when alot talk about this is because they don’t have the information 1 and can’t see the plan in its entirety paranoia sets in and opinions for the most part are so far off it’s not funny.

Here's the other thing, why does it matter to folks how much cap space the Falcons have during the season? Seems like folks want the Falcons to have an X amount of cap space during the season. Do they get extra wins for it or something? I'd much rather spend every dime that is needed this year to put the best possible product on the field so that I give myself the best chance at winning the Super Bowl. This ain't baseball where you save money in the offseason for the possibly of midseason trades. Midseason trades in the NFL are like a unicorn.

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1 hour ago, Falconsfan567 said:

 

Here's the other thing, why does it matter to folks how much cap space the Falcons have during the season? Seems like folks want the Falcons to have an X amount of cap space during the season. Do they get extra wins for it or something? I'd much rather spend every dime that is needed this year to put the best possible product on the field so that I give myself the best chance at winning the Super Bowl. This ain't baseball where you save money in the offseason for the possibly of midseason trades. Midseason trades in the NFL are like a unicorn.

I don’t really care about having FA money.  My concern is signing our own guys.  

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15 hours ago, Yo_Lover said:

In today's NFL you aren't getting 3-4 B guys for 20mil. And either way you should take the game changer. Not all superstars are 20mil either.

Clayborn: 2 mill

Rico: 5 mill

Davison:  $700,000

Crawford: 3 mill

Freeman: 6 mill

Ty: 3 mill

That is 6 quality players, 2 of them possible Pro Bowlers, for 20 mill CAP hit this year.  You can get a ton with 20 million

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4 minutes ago, FalconsIn2020 said:

Clayborn: 2 mill

Rico: 5 mill

Davison:  $700,000

Crawford: 3 mill

Freeman: 6 mill

Ty: 3 mill

That is 6 quality players, 2 of them possible Pro Bowlers, for 20 mill CAP hit this year.  You can get a ton with 20 million

Clay, Crawford, and Ty aren't B guys. Davison is a super situational player too.

And 1 is a pro bowler, Rico would never make it. He doesn't get the turnovers to.

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