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Matt Ryan on point

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3 hours ago, Faithful Falcon said:

That was his only try. Matt Ryan's so perfect, he f*cks up on purpose. 

 

I'm gonna start talking about our QB the same as people talk about Brady, Brees, and Rodgers.

Matt Ryan does not do push-ups.  He pushes the earth back down.  

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11 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Tough call....I’ll stick with Ryan.

I firmly believe he makes the offensive players, outside Julio, better than they are. People like Ridley, Hooper, Jenkins, Douglas and the OL are made better by Ryan.  

Tyler Lockett had a perfect passer rating when targeted last year. Wilson doesn't make his guys better?

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10 hours ago, Yo_Lover said:

Good thing the poll wasn't based on his first few seasons, it's based on who he is now

He’s definitely better and a top QB, but still isn’t as good as people say.

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13 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

That’s become the norm for the future HOF’er.  

Russell Wilson beats him 70% to 30%.  What a joke.  It’s at least a pick em

It's the lingering effect from 2016. Only real difference in perception is the ring. If they both had a ring, Wilson would still be ahead, but it'd be much closer, like 53-47. 

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14 hours ago, Yo_Lover said:

Tyler Lockett had a perfect passer rating when targeted last year. Wilson doesn't make his guys better?

And Matt Ryan had  a perfect QB rating throwing to every single one of his teammates for 3.5 quarters of the SB.  What’s your point?

I don’t think Wilson makes his receivers better.  Or his OL.  His mobility buys them time, but Russ doesn’t make decisions nearly as quickly as Ryan.  He throws a better deep ball.  Ryan has superior short and intermediate accuracy.

The main thing Russ offers over Ryan is mobility.  Every other aspect outside 40+ yard balls goes to Ryan

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14 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Tough call....I’ll stick with Ryan.

I firmly believe he makes the offensive players, outside Julio, better than they are. People like Ridley, Hooper, Jenkins, Douglas and the OL are made better by Ryan.  

Agreed.  Wilson is good, but he is a situational QB at best.  Meaning, he has been groomed to make the best at the situation at hand.  Same with Rodgers.  When you have a top 3 defense and good running game you can do that.  It hides all the mistakes.  Makes for a great highlight reel, but does it translate?

Ryan was groomed to be a system QB, although he is the system.  Don't take risks and help the players around you be better.  That's boring, but it's what wins.  If Wilson didn't have that defense or a decent running game for most of his career, he would have either been hurt or failed.  I'd love to see Wilson on the '12 to '15 Falcons team.  We might have won 10 games over that span.

Ryan has learned and is now taking more risks and becoming more of a situational QB.  Wilson is just riding his team.  Just my opinion, but you give Ryan that Seahawks team and he would have won more than one Super bowl.  I mean, how do you only win one with that defense?

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19 minutes ago, schwarzenegger321 said:

Agreed.  Wilson is good, but he is a situational QB at best.  Meaning, he has been groomed to make the best at the situation at hand.  Same with Rodgers.  When you have a top 3 defense and good running game you can do that.  It hides all the mistakes.  Makes for a great highlight reel, but does it translate?

Ryan was groomed to be a system QB, although he is the system.  Don't take risks and help the players around you be better.  That's boring, but it's what wins.  If Wilson didn't have that defense or a decent running game for most of his career, he would have either been hurt or failed.  I'd love to see Wilson on the '12 to '15 Falcons team.  We might have won 10 games over that span.

Ryan has learned and is now taking more risks and becoming more of a situational QB.  Wilson is just riding his team.  Just my opinion, but you give Ryan that Seahawks team and he would have won more than one Super bowl.  I mean, how do you only win one with that defense?

I mean, Wilson & Rodgers are great QB’s.  I won’t make my case for Ryan by diminishing those two players.  

But Ryan in 2019 is every bit as good, if not better, than either Rodgers or Wilson. 

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32 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I mean, Wilson & Rodgers are great QB’s.  I won’t make my case for Ryan by diminishing those two players.  

But Ryan in 2019 is every bit as good, if not better, than either Rodgers or Wilson. 

Yeah, I'm not knocking Wilson or Rodgers, but really tell me the difference between Rodgers and Ryan.  Go look at their combine or pro day numbers.  Ryan is a little taller.  Rodgers ran the 40 like 0.03 seconds faster, Ryan was quicker in the three cone drill.  The difference is in their teams and how they were groomed their first few years.  Rodgers was groomed by the man himself (Farve) and Ryan was groomed by a conservative OC and HC who both preached to sit in the pocket and don't take risks.  Ryan had a decent defense in '08, an okay defense in '09 and '10 and then it went into the toilet.  He had a great running game in ''08, a very good running game in '09, good in '10 and then it quickly went into the toilet.  Offensive line was good in '08 and rapidly declined from '09 with '16 being the outlier.  Wilson has had to run for his life a couple of years, but he was put into a system where that is what he had to do but he had a great defense and decent running game.  Rodgers has just been told to wing it from day 1 with combinations of great to bad defenses, Oline and running games.  Last year his support was on par with what Ryan had back in '14 and you see where that got the Packers.

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17 hours ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Not sure how much thought went into it. Baker beat out Rivers in the same round format.

Just sayin’ :tiphat:

And to me, that is WAAAAAAY more absurd than Wilson beating Ryan

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44 minutes ago, schwarzenegger321 said:

Yeah, I'm not knocking Wilson or Rodgers, but really tell me the difference between Rodgers and Ryan.  Go look at their combine or pro day numbers.  Ryan is a little taller.  Rodgers ran the 40 like 0.03 seconds faster, Ryan was quicker in the three cone drill.  The difference is in their teams and how they were groomed their first few years.  Rodgers was groomed by the man himself (Farve) and Ryan was groomed by a conservative OC and HC who both preached to sit in the pocket and don't take risks.  Ryan had a decent defense in '08, an okay defense in '09 and '10 and then it went into the toilet.  He had a great running game in ''08, a very good running game in '09, good in '10 and then it quickly went into the toilet.  Offensive line was good in '08 and rapidly declined from '09 with '16 being the outlier.  Wilson has had to run for his life a couple of years, but he was put into a system where that is what he had to do but he had a great defense and decent running game.  Rodgers has just been told to wing it from day 1 with combinations of great to bad defenses, Oline and running games.  Last year his support was on par with what Ryan had back in '14 and you see where that got the Packers.

I’d say early on A-Rod was far more mobile and accurate.  He still clearly has a better arm and throws a better deep ball.  Ryan has become just as accurate, if not more so, than Rodgers on short and intermediate throws.  I believe they are very similar players at this point.  

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Posted (edited)

Ryan is better than Wilson on 3rd downs passing the ball. I think Ryan is just a better QB than Wilson period. To me Brady, Rodgers, and Mahomes are the only QBs who are better and I still take Ryan over every other QB in the league right now.

Edited by quickzero
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20 hours ago, xSICKxWITHxITx said:

Wilson has been one of the most overrated QBs for a while. Just the last couple years he’s actually become good. He’s just now able to be accurate with his arm.

Before defense, running game and scheme carried him. Was fluky like Kap. Had to rely on read option and scrambling.

LOL

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7 hours ago, schwarzenegger321 said:

Agreed.  Wilson is good, but he is a situational QB at best.  Meaning, he has been groomed to make the best at the situation at hand.  Same with Rodgers.  When you have a top 3 defense and good running game you can do that.  It hides all the mistakes.  Makes for a great highlight reel, but does it translate?

Ryan was groomed to be a system QB, although he is the system.  Don't take risks and help the players around you be better.  That's boring, but it's what wins.  If Wilson didn't have that defense or a decent running game for most of his career, he would have either been hurt or failed.  I'd love to see Wilson on the '12 to '15 Falcons team.  We might have won 10 games over that span.

Ryan has learned and is now taking more risks and becoming more of a situational QB.  Wilson is just riding his team.  Just my opinion, but you give Ryan that Seahawks team and he would have won more than one Super bowl.  I mean, how do you only win one with that defense?

Not sure I follow you on calling Wilson a “situational QB”. He’s been all Seattle’s Had on offense for several years now. Bad OL, no running game, middle-of-road receivers....much like Ryan had in 2013-14. 

Seattle would have one of worst offenses in NFL with most starting QBs surrounded by that kind of bad talent. 

Wilson has been best QB in football for several years now in my book. And that’s no diss on Ryan, he’s been right behind him, ahead of Arod, Brady, and Brees IMO.

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1 hour ago, Vandy said:

 

Seattle would have one of worst offenses in NFL with most starting QBs surrounded by that kind of bad talent. 

Wilson has been best QB in football for several years now in my book. And that’s no diss on Ryan, he’s been right behind him, ahead of Arod, Brady, and Brees. 

Seattle has maintained above average  talent for most of Wilson’s career.  Baldwin, Harvin, Kearse, Lynch, Rawls, Graham, Lockett are all solid weapons.  He always has an elite run game to support him...and the defense always wins field position for Wilson.  Always.

Jimmy Graham was an All Pro when Seattle traded for him.  Still young and capable yet he had more yards receiving his final 2 years in NO than he has the last 4 in Seattle.  Wilson has helped just one receiver in his career break 1,000 yards.  Baldwin.  Ryan has helped at least 5.

Do I love Wilson?  Yup.  Top-7?  Yup.  Slam dunk better than Ryan?  No sir.  

Only twice has Wilson thrown for more than 4,000 yards.  To me, he has enough pieces around him to put up more consistent numbers.  And I do watch a lot of his games so it’s not just Stats I am basing this off.

Again, I love Russ.  He brings mobility and better touch on his 40+ balls.  Ryan is more decisive, quicker in his reads, has much better short and intermediate accuracy and is IMO a better on the field general at this point.  And Russ takes way too many sacks...just holds onto the ball too long.  Like 55 sacks last year

So there is my homer case for Ryan, a guy we’d crucify for putting up Wilson’s 2018 stats. Yes, we have more offensive pieces, but still...

Last year, Wilson was very similar to 2010 Ryan.  Leaned on a running game, field position and a solid defense

3,700 yards, 29 TD’s, 9 INT’s - Ryan 2010

3,400 yards, 35 TD’s, 7 INT’s - Wilson 2018

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Ask yourself this question:  Would I  trade Ryan for Wilson straight up right now?

I would not, but if it happened, I wouldn't be devastated to have Wilson as my quarterback;  but the 70 to 30% BS polling we're talking about is just that...BS.

They both could easily be headed for the Hall of Fame, and most likely both are.

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2 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Seattle has maintained above average  talent for most of Wilson’s career.  Baldwin, Harvin, Kearse, Lynch, Rawls, Graham, Lockett are all solid weapons.  He always has an elite run game to support him...and the defense always wins field position for Wilson.  Always.

Jimmy Graham was an All Pro when Seattle traded for him.  Still young and capable yet he had more yards receiving his final 2 years in NO than he has the last 4 in Seattle.  Wilson has helped just one receiver in his career break 1,000 yards.  Baldwin.  Ryan has helped at least 5.

Do I love Wilson?  Yup.  Top-7?  Yup.  Slam dunk better than Ryan?  No sir.  

Only twice has Wilson thrown for more than 4,000 yards.  To me, he has enough pieces around him to put up more consistent numbers.  And I do watch a lot of his games so it’s not just Stats I am basing this off.

Again, I love Russ.  He brings mobility and better touch on his 40+ balls.  Ryan is more decisive, quicker in his reads, has much better short and intermediate accuracy and is IMO a better on the field general at this point.  And Russ takes way too many sacks...just holds onto the ball too long.  Like 55 sacks last year

So there is my homer case for Ryan, a guy we’d crucify for putting up Wilson’s 2018 stats. Yes, we have more offensive pieces, but still...

Last year, Wilson was very similar to 2010 Ryan.  Leaned on a running game, field position and a solid defense

3,700 yards, 29 TD’s, 9 INT’s - Ryan 2010

3,400 yards, 35 TD’s, 7 INT’s - Wilson 2018

And you failed to quote my entire post. As I said, last several years. And if you believe seattle’s RB, OL, and receivers have been “above average talent” during that timeframe then there’s nothing left to discuss. And certainly not on par with Atlanta’s RBs, receivers, or offensive line. 

Also my friend, I said “QBs” not just passing QB’s. Wilson is also a threat to run the ball, which you keep ignoring in your homer stat comparisons between the two in this thread and in others. 

Love Matt, he’s my QB, but he’s had more talent to work with over the course of his career than Russell has offensively. He’s had Roddy & Julio in their primes, Gonzales at high level, Turner/Free/Coleman also in their primes. I don’t see how you can say otherwise with a straight face. 

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Hey man, Matt is a beast dual-threat QB. He is elite. And ALL elite QBs are dual-threat.

Stats don’t lie. Matt be catching TDs and running them last year. Facts! HA!! Haha!

:troll:

In all seriousness, sure the Seahawks D regularly takes much of the weight and pressure off Wilson and the offense. Helps when you get more opportunities instead of having to play perfect on offense. Lynch in his prime with SEA was every bit as good as Turner for the Falcons.

In terms of receiving weapons, yeah you gonna want to have them if you aren’t building Legion of Boom for a defense. You'll need to score more after all! :lol:

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15 hours ago, Schwarzwald said:

Hey man, Matt is a beast dual-threat QB. He is elite. And ALL elite QBs are dual-threat.

Stats don’t lie. Matt be catching TDs and running them last year. Facts! HA!! Haha!

:troll:

In all seriousness, sure the Seahawks D regularly takes much of the weight and pressure off Wilson and the offense. Helps when you get more opportunities instead of having to play perfect on offense. Lynch in his prime with SEA was every bit as good as Turner for the Falcons.

In terms of receiving weapons, yeah you gonna want to have them if you aren’t building Legion of Boom for a defense. You'll need to score more after all! :lol:

Seriously?! Lynch in his prime was better than Turner in his prime, IMO.

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On 6/13/2019 at 5:59 PM, DawnOfThemBirds said:

 

I do

 

I'm saying that a good bit of that 70% don't really watch Seahawk games either, but highlights of Wilson. I really like Wilson and think that he is the most dangerous QB not named Pat Mahomes.

 

 

.......but he isn't 70% better than Ryan.

He also has no oline, no running game, and no WRs.

Not saying he’s better but those 3 things come into the equation when it comes to national perception.

Since 2009 Ryan has had a HOFer to throw to and people know that.

 

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On 6/13/2019 at 7:02 PM, Faithful Falcon said:

That was his only try. Matt Ryan's so perfect, he f*cks up on purpose. 

 

I'm gonna start talking about our QB the same as people talk about Brady, Brees, and Rodgers.

:munch:

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37 minutes ago, Sun Tzu 7 said:

He also has no oline, no running game, and no WRs.

Not saying he’s better but those 3 things come into the equation when it comes to national perception.

Since 2009 Ryan has had a HOFer to throw to and people know that.

 

 

Wilson is the more recognizable player amongst NFL fans who aren't Seahawks or Falcons fans.

 

Wilson has been very impressive and a playmaker, but these votes always comes down to popularity contests regardless of circumstances.

 

That explains the 70% slash towards Wilson.

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On 6/13/2019 at 8:33 PM, Falconsin2012 said:

I mean, I like Wilson a bunch.  But that number is a joke.  Both are great.  

Wilson got a ring that's why. When and if Ryan gets a ring he will get the respect he deserves. Especially if he gets a Super Bowl MVP against a team like the Patriots or a team with a dangerous defense like the 2017 Jaguars were.

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