Falcons In 2012

OTA’s: Why They Are Important or Not

101 posts in this topic

I guess it boils down to the one overriding aspect ~ it's voluntary. If it really meant anything, NFL teams would make them mandatory. No exceptions to the rule.

The fact they aren't means they just aren't that important, even though they can certainly be helpful if players are of a mind to avail themselves of the opportunity to participate, like Matt Ryan and Ridley, Sanu, Freeman, et al, etc., etc.

In view of the above fact and resulting conclusion, I'm laying down my sword in the OTA attendance battle and will never pick it up again. To the rest of you still in the fray, god speed.

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Posted (edited)

54 minutes ago, PokerSteve said:

I guess it boils to the one overriding aspect ~ it's voluntary. If it really meant anything, NFL teams would make them mandatory. No exceptions to the rule.

It's the CBA with the player's union that makes them technically voluntary, not the NFL.  NFL teams would love to make them mandatory and they treat it that way unofficially.

If a developmental or depth guy decided to the skip OTAs without the coaching staff's blessing, they'd have an uphill battle making the team.

Edited by JeffAtl
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5 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

It’s like that for me as well. I’ve stepped back as of late because of threads like this. OP says it’s not about Julio but this thread isn’t even created if Julio was at OTA’s. Another example is the thread he created about Shanahan and Julio the other day as well. 

Anyone who knows me on here knows I love me some Julio.  My contention is value vs no value regarding OTA’s.  People are saying the value for vets is minimal to non-existent.

if true, why would any team have these, especially considering the injury risk.  If they accomplish little, why does Belichick,, Carroll, Peyton, Johnson & Walsh all have them.?  They are not mandated by the league.  

If you can answer that question, I’ll drop it.  

And the Shanny/Julio thread was on defense of the board murdering another poster.  So I made a point with that thread.  If you read the entire thread you’d have seen the purpose and my opinion on the subject.

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2 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Anyone who knows me on here knows I love me some Julio.  My contention is value vs no value regarding OTA’s.  People are saying the value for vets is minimal to non-existent.

if true, why would any team have these, especially considering the injury risk.  If they accomplish little, why does Belichick,, Carroll, Peyton, Johnson & Walsh all have them.?  They are not mandated by the league.  

If you can answer that question, I’ll drop it.  

And the Shanny/Julio thread was on defense of the board murdering another poster.  So I made a point with that thread.  If you read the entire thread you’d have seen the purpose and my opinion on the subject.

Do OTA’s provide value? To some degree, yes they do. But not to veterans like Julio who are masters of their craft. And this is what @athell, @Yo_Lover, @TheFatboi, and a few others have been trying to tell you. Fatboi mentioned in one of the several OTA threads that all they are are essentially check ins to ensure players have kept up with conditioning. He knows this due to his relationships with current/former NFL players. I really think you are looking WAY too much into this subject man. You are buying into what the media is trying to stir up a little bit. Tony Gonzalez, a first ballot HOF has publicly said that Preseason absolutely does NOT matter to veteran players at all. And I believe him. And so should you.

As for the Shanny/Julio thread, I did read the entire thread and my personal take on it was...it was an absolutely pointless topic and not interesting. You doubled down because you agreed with the OP, not because you felt bad for him.

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2 hours ago, A Pimp Named Slickback™ said:

It's all good until someone important is lost all season for nothing.

 

NFL coaches want more offseason time with players. Here’s why that’s a good thing

  • By Dr. David Geier Special to The Post and Courier
  • Apr 12, 2019

At the recent NFL owner meetings, New England Patriots head coach Bill Belichick pushed for a change. During a session promoting the many successes of the NFL as the league enters its 100th season, Belichick passionately argued that the offseason was an area where the NFL could get even better.

 

Belichick then passionately chimed in, and essentially said something along the lines of: While it is nice to hear good things, the focus should be on how it can be even better. One of the ways to do that, he said, was giving coaches more time with players.

The 2011 collective bargaining agreement between the league and the NFL Players' Association shaved a full five weeks off the NFL offseason program while eliminating two-a-days and forbidding coaches to talk football with their players until mid-April.

The deal was struck in the interest of player safety, but Belichick believes there can be positive impacts of expanded offseason communication between teams and players. It sounds like several other NFL coaches agree.

"I'm in total support of his position," Seattle Seahawks coach Pete Carroll told Reiss. "There's so much down time for these guys. I think there was a time when older players were bargaining for these breaks when they thought less was better. But these guys [today] love the game and want to be part of it. And we love coaching and helping them."

Supporters of Belichick’s idea include Seattle Seahawks coach Pete Carroll and Kansas City Chiefs head coach Andy Reid. They believe that everyone would benefit if players spent more time with their teams in the offseason.

“There’s so many positive things that could come out of it in terms of development of young players, helping to really make sure these guys are learning the game and getting them ready for their opportunity,” Carolina Panthers head coach Ron Rivera told ESPN.com.

As the salaries for top quarterbacks and star players continue to rise, teams are opting to keep more players still on their rookie contracts. These players with little or no NFL experience are being increasingly pushed into starting roles as teams fight to stay under the salary cap. As a result, many coaches feel their teams suffer, with players less familiar with the blocking, passing, and defensive schemes they run.

I support teams having more time with players in the offseason, but I would structure it in a way that still allows players to fully recover and prepare for the upcoming season and doesn’t endanger their health.

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11 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Do OTA’s provide value? To some degree, yes they do. But not to veterans like Julio who are masters of their craft. And this is what @athell, @Yo_Lover, @TheFatboi, and a few others have been trying to tell you. Fatboi mentioned in one of the several OTA threads that all they are are essentially check ins to ensure players have kept up with conditioning. He knows this due to his relationships with current/former NFL players. I really think you are looking WAY too much into this subject man. You are buying into what the media is trying to stir up a little bit. Tony Gonzalez, a first ballot HOF has publicly said that Preseason absolutely does NOT matter to veteran players at all. And I believe him. And so should you.

As for the Shanny/Julio thread, I did read the entire thread and my personal take on it was...it was an absolutely pointless topic and not interesting. You doubled down because you agreed with the OP, not because you felt bad for him.

It’s not just a check in.  They have team meetings, break down film, work on technique & install offense and defensive scheme.  Why else would the best NFL coaches be pushing for more time with players during the offseason?

I think you are drastically underselling what happens at OTA’s

And I was the OP of that thread.  

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Just now, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s not just a check in.  They have team meetings, break down film, work on technique & install offense and defensive scheme.  Why are coaches pushing for more time during the offseason,  

I think you are drastically underselling what happens at OTA’s

Eh, I’ll take the word of guys I know are involved with players rather than fans that are 100% speculating.

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6 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s not just a check in.  They have team meetings, break down film, work on technique & install offense and defensive scheme.  Why else would the best NFL coaches be pushing for more time with players during the offseason?

I think you are drastically underselling what happens at OTA’s

And I was the OP of that thread.  

And no, you weren’t the OP of that thread. Falcons Fan MVP was. You doubled down on his thread and made another.

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5 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Eh, I’ll take the word of guys I know are involved with players rather than fans that are 100% speculating.

Dude, I’ve literally cited Pete Carroll and Belichick on the importance of OTA’s.  I’ve posted several articles by former players stating what happens at OTA’s.  I’m intentionally not giving my opinion in any of this

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1 minute ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

And no, you weren’t the OP of that thread. Falcons Fan MVP was. You doubled down on his thread and made another.

We are talking about different threads.  I am talking about best the “OC-WR-QB combo” thread.

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1 minute ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Dude, I’ve literally cited Pete Carroll and Belichick on the importance of OTA’s.  I’ve posted several articles by former players stating what happens at OTA’s.  I’m intentionally not giving my opinion in any of this

You’re also going off of what they’ve said to the media. You have to take that for what it is

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Just now, Falconsin2012 said:

We are talking about different threads.  I am talking about best the “OC-WR-QB combo” thread.

Yea, I’m not talking about that thread. I’m talking about the silly thread that MVP made about Shanahan and Julio and the “trade scenario.” You made another thread a day or two later essentially defending the idea of trading Julio for Shanahan. 

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57 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s not just a check in.  They have team meetings, break down film, work on technique & install offense and defensive scheme.  Why else would the best NFL coaches be pushing for more time with players during the offseason?

I think you are drastically underselling what happens at OTA’s

And I was the OP of that thread.  

Because teams are ******* stupid dude. Simms even talked about this when he had a spleen removed or burst and team doctors told him to come into workouts because he needed to get his core stronger to fix it.

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13 minutes ago, Yo_Lover said:

Because teams are ******* stupid dude. Simms even talked about this when he had a spleen removed or burst and team doctors told him to come into workouts because he needed to get his core stronger to fix it.

I simply don’t accept that Belichick, Reid, Payton & Carroll are all being stupid when they are saying they want  more time with players in the offseason.  

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3 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I simply don’t accept that Belichick, Reid, Payton & Carroll are all being stupid when they are saying they want  more time with players in the offseason.  

Of course they do. They are head coaches, under intense pressure to win. What are they supposed to say to the media? “Nah, this is a waste of time...vets absolutely don’t need to be here.” 

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5 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Of course they do. They are head coaches, under intense pressure to win. What are they supposed to say to the media? “Nah, this is a waste of time...vets absolutely don’t need to be here.” 

They don’t want to waste their own time, though.  If it wasn’t helping the players & team, they wouldn’t want more time.

And I guarantee Ryan is benefiting by being with the coaches while the wrinkles to the new scheme are introduced.

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Just now, Falconsin2012 said:

They don’t want to waste their own time, though.  If it wasn’t helping the players & team, they wouldn’t want more time.

And I guarantee Ryan is benefiting by being with the coaches while the wrinkles to the new scheme are introduced.

If Quinn was truly angry with Julio and Beasley being absent, I’m sure the outcome would be different. And don’t tell me that Julio has leverage. Brown and Beckham both just got traded. 

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20 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I simply don’t accept that Belichick, Reid, Payton & Carroll are all being stupid when they are saying they want  more time with players in the offseason.  

That's because they are full of themselves dude. They all think they can make a player an all pro if you give them those three days. They're control freaks. Why do you think they've gotten this far?

You'll never find a coach who says "OTA's aren't a big deal. I'm not worried about someone skipping" because he'll be fired.

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Lol the insistance of 2012 while cherry picking articles from the net, which also contradict his argument, is almost admirable.

In the NFL, the age old cliche is follow the money.  Once players start getting paid for OTAs, I will think about saying it provides any value to veterans or any kind of import.  If OTAs were so important, the players would be paid to be there.  They aren't.  They aren't even paid the pittance they make in per diem during training camp.  We can't follow the money because there is no money...oh wait...except for the franchises as their guys running around in shells and nothing else, while going against air or coaches, get to wear that fancy sponsor patch on their jersey that the sponsor paid so much for.

Players no money.

Franchises money.

Hrmmmmm...I wonder why we have OTAs...and more importantly why it's becoming more and more commonplace to miss...

And don't give me **** about coaches.  These dudes work 20 hour days.  They would rather spend time in the office watching tape than being with their own families.  They don't sleep.  They are literally obsessed.  If they had their way, there would be  no offseason.  Maybe coaches aren't the best moral or practical gauge here...

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9 minutes ago, athell said:

Lol the insistance of 2012 while cherry picking articles from the net, which also contradict his argument, is almost admirable.

In the NFL, the age old cliche is follow the money.  Once players start getting paid for OTAs, I will think about saying it provides any value to veterans or any kind of import.  If OTAs were so important, the players would be paid to be there.  They aren't.  They aren't even paid the pittance they make in per diem during training camp.  We can't follow the money because there is no money...oh wait...except for the franchises as their guys running around in shells and nothing else, while going against air or coaches, get to wear that fancy sponsor patch on their jersey that the sponsor paid so much for.

Players no money.

Franchises money.

Hrmmmmm...I wonder why we have OTAs...and more importantly why it's becoming more and more commonplace to miss...

 

We have OTA’s because they determine the chemistry that a WR has with his QB. They determine if the players know the playbook or not. They determine that the rookies have successful careers or not. Julio is really being an arrogant moron. If he were at OTA’s, the falcons would be a lock to win the next 3 Super Bowls. Minimum 

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13 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

We have OTA’s because they determine the chemistry that a WR has with his QB. They determine if the players know the playbook or not. They determine that the rookies have successful careers or not. Julio is really being an arrogant moron. If he were at OTA’s, the falcons would be a lock to win the next 3 Super Bowls. Minimum 

:lol:

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2 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I simply don’t accept that Belichick, Reid, Payton & Carroll are all being stupid when they are saying they want  more time with players in the offseason.  

It says right in the article you posted

"There’s so many positive things that could come out of it in terms of development of young players, helping to really make sure these guys are learning the game and getting them ready for their opportunity,”

This is great for most players. But it doesn't help much when you're too 3 in your position. You KNOW Julio is working on himself SOMEWHERE

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42 minutes ago, UnrealfalcoN said:

It says right in the article you posted

"There’s so many positive things that could come out of it in terms of development of young players, helping to really make sure these guys are learning the game and getting them ready for their opportunity,”

This is great for most players. But it doesn't help much when you're too 3 in your position. You KNOW Julio is working on himself SOMEWHERE

This isn’t a Julio thread.  It’s about the overall merits of OTA’s.  Some here are saying they have no value to the team as a whole

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Yeah as O.T.A.'s usually are mandatory. But those that do not show up. You can't do nothing about it.

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