Jpowors

Not the new Donald Trump Presidency thread

40,846 posts in this topic

7 minutes ago, Billy Ocean said:

One of the black lady Bernie Bros I follow on twitter referenced a recent poll showing that Warren was only at 3% with black women. Black women are the backbone of the Democratic electorate. How does Warren plan to win votes in the southern state primaries?

I'll sit this one out (answering) based on 2016......................

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9 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

Abolishing ICE is incrementalism?  Guaranteed Jobs is incrementalism? Codetermination is incrementalism?  

Supporting bad policies doesn't make you idealistic.

Medicare for America ends our reliance on ESI to cover most people. I jumped on support for a Robust unified government program after reading the article on Americare, which was found at the to lead to single payer healthcare.

americare_coverage.jpg

 

I don't support it because it is incremental, I just roasted Bidencare in the other thread. I support it because it will give us universal affordable healthcare with maximum buy in from voters.  Ro Khanna is even a cosponsor. 

Fine then, I’ll call you a radical centrist. 

BTW Hillary voted in favor of the Homeland Security Act, which included the formation of ICE. Bernie voted nay. ^_^

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A good friend of mine is a Black Angus cattle rancher. As we were out getting lunch today, we overheard these men who just happened to be local farmers. It seems they were having a meeting of sorts about their financial problems as it pertains to the Trump tariffs and how to handle their various hardships. One guy was older (looked boomer age) and was talking about how they should keep supporting Trump. Another farmer (around my age, I'm a Gen Xer) disagreed and stated how much money he was losing due to his soybean crops dying in the field and how he can't find anyone to hire due to the fear of ICE raids and deportation from the federal government.

Well, the older farmer and the younger farmer went at each other verbally with the younger one getting up and saying, "Well, that's all right for you, but I've got a family to feed!" and stormed off. The old guy stated, "Ah, we don't need him!"

Just don't be surprised when the price of food goes up.

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1 hour ago, GEORGIAfan said:

 

It may be boring but it is much more important to the American people than whether Trump is or isn't a media genius and more productive than any discussion with WFW. 

 

maybe it would spice things up if you picked a candidate and stopped lobbing anti-sanders bait from the sidelines

you fence-sitter

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Just now, achilles return said:

maybe it would spice things up if you picked a candidate and stopped lobbing anti-sanders bait from the sidelines

you fence-sitter

I’ve been waiting for the pivot from Booker to Warren, given his fondness for older female technocrats.

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3 minutes ago, Billy Ocean said:

Fine then, I’ll call you a radical centrist. 

BTW Hillary voted in favor of the Homeland Security Act, which included the formation of ICE. Bernie voted nay. ^_^

You could go with SuccDem, which is what AR refers to my types.

HRC also supported deporting unaccompanied minors as a deterrent. :(

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4 minutes ago, Statick said:

A good friend of mine is a Black Angus cattle rancher. As we were out getting lunch today, we overheard these men who just happened to be local farmers. It seems they were having a meeting of sorts about their financial problems as it pertains to the Trump tariffs and how to handle their various hardships. One guy was older (looked boomer age) and was talking about how they should keep supporting Trump. Another farmer (around my age, I'm a Gen Xer) disagreed and stated how much money he was losing due to his soybean crops dying in the field and how he can't find anyone to hire due to the fear of ICE raids and deportation from the federal government.

Well, the older farmer and the younger farmer went at each other verbally with the younger one getting up and saying, "Well, that's all right for you, but I've got a family to feed!" and stormed off. The old guy stated, "Ah, we don't need him!"

Just don't be surprised when the price of food goes up.

Considering Brazil is trying to lock up China as a long term soybean supplier, both of them are equally ****** AND the price of food IS going up!!!

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It got really real for me when I realized all the Russiagate people thought Trump fired Comey because he genuinely thought doing so would end the investigation. Doesn't make any sense whatsoever unless he's been watching Fox News for years because he's never figured out how to change the channel.

Then there was that famously described scene where he finds out about special council being appointed and sinks back in his chair to announce "Oh my God, this is terrible. This is the end of my presidency. I'm ******." It sounds theatrical, and it didn't really make sense that he'd be so worried about it since he personally avoided anything that would lead to him being charged with crimes related to cooperating with Russian spies, especially after years of watching Benghazi **** not take down Obama or Hillary.

But most of the left I had contact with just bought that that played out exactly the way it that it looked, and Trump was going down for Russia because he didn't know how to hide anything. So he acted the way he did with Putin because he's the dumbest idiot in the whole world, and his only plan for distracting people from the investigation was to act like he had some kind of weird, undefinable attraction to Putin. And if that didn't make sense, it could be made to make sense, because Trump also palled around with other dictators, so what he was doing with Putin fit in with that. Guy just loves dictators. Especially Russian ones that might be blackmailing him.

It makes perfect sense if you look at it as a long-time media figure using the media to create the impression that he's vulnerable to an investigation he'll never actually go down for. It doesn't really make any sense at all if you just accepted the narrative Trump was practically foisting upon the media at the time. But if you can't allow for Trump to be smart enough to deceive the left, then you're stuck with the narrative that doesn't make sense for anyone except CNN and MSNBC, that was actually killed by the Mueller report itself. And people are still holding out hope for that, because they want to believe. It's frustrating in a way I've never really had to deal with in arguing about politics before.

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3 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

You could go with SuccDem, which is what AR refers to my types.

HRC also supported deporting unaccompanied minors as a deterrent. :(

What’s a SuccDem? I honestly don’t know.

Ro Khanna voted in favor of the anti-BDS resolution yesterday :(

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3 minutes ago, achilles return said:

maybe it would spice things up if you picked a candidate and stopped lobbing anti-sanders bait from the sidelines

you fence-sitter

tenor.gif?itemid=5384362

 

 

Just now, Billy Ocean said:

I’ve been waiting for the pivot from Booker to Warren, given his fondness for older female technocrats.

I don't support Booker. He is just my dark horse pick. Warren's policies do speak to me, but I'd rather fence sit. 

 

Also as a TulsiBro, can you explain this

 

Tulsi got a secret VP deal I don't know about? 

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10 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

tenor.gif?itemid=5384362

 

 

I don't support Booker. He is just my dark horse pick. Warren's policies do speak to me, but I'd rather fence sit. 

 

Also as a TulsiBro, can you explain this

 

Tulsi got a secret VP deal I don't know about? 

I applauded Tulsi’s actions during the 2016 election cycle, but I don’t think I’ve said much about her beyond that. I would welcome her voice on foreign policy at the debates, though. And I do have a definite dislike for a lot of the Democrats who criticize Tulsi. Not so much for their criticisms of her, but rather because they are people whose politics in general suck. So we have common enemies at least.

Why didn’t Warren run in 2016? Didn’t wanna get in Her way?

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Just now, Billy Ocean said:

What’s a SuccDem? I honestly don’t know.

Ro Khanna voted in favor of the anti-BDS resolution yesterday :(

An insult toward Social Democrats for supporting large welfare states, but wanting to fix capitalism instead of replacing it. 

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4 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

An insult toward Social Democrats for supporting large welfare states, but wanting to fix capitalism instead of replacing it. 

I’m still confused because I consider Bernie to be a social democrat and find his current policies to be within that framework.

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13 minutes ago, Billy Ocean said:

What’s a SuccDem? I honestly don’t know.

Ro Khanna voted in favor of the anti-BDS resolution yesterday :(

social democrats -> socdems -> succdems

but "the succ" has gone on to describe the democratic party in general in some left circles

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Just now, Billy Ocean said:

I’m still confused because I consider Bernie to be a social democrat and find his policies to be within that framework.

this is true, but i think there's some "he's actually further left than he lets on" feeling there given his history of radicalism. 

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while sanders may be pushing mostly social democratic policies within his campaign for president, there's definitely an ideological difference between him and say, warren, in how they criticize current economic structures. both recognize that the status quo is broken, but you don't get the feeling that sanders believes capitalism can just be "fixed" with the right technocratic controls from the federal government. 

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Just now, Billy Ocean said:

I applauded Tulsi’s actions during the 2016 election cycle, but I don’t think I’ve said much about her beyond that. I would welcome her voice on foreign policy at the debates, though. And I do have a definite dislike for a lot of the Democrats who criticize Tulsi. Not so much for their criticisms of her, but rather because they are people whose politics in general suck.

Why didn’t Warren run in 2016? Didn’t wanna get in Her way?

I figured in the 2nd debate she would act as a stand in for Gravel, but she has been attacking Kamala and been quiet on Biden. 

Warren is a party loyalist and most people didn't see a path to win, because HRC is popular and was polling above 60%.

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for me, this is really simple. there is a single candidate that our oligarchs essentially all despise. that they can bring themselves to accept warren but not sanders is more than enough to tell me who working people should be voting for. 

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Posted (edited)

52 minutes ago, Serge said:

It got really real for me when I realized all the Russiagate people thought Trump fired Comey because he genuinely thought doing so would end the investigation. Doesn't make any sense whatsoever unless he's been watching Fox News for years because he's never figured out how to change the channel.

Then there was that famously described scene where he finds out about special council being appointed and sinks back in his chair to announce "Oh my God, this is terrible. This is the end of my presidency. I'm ******." It sounds theatrical, and it didn't really make sense that he'd be so worried about it since he personally avoided anything that would lead to him being charged with crimes related to cooperating with Russian spies, especially after years of watching Benghazi **** not take down Obama or Hillary.

But most of the left I had contact with just bought that that played out exactly the way it that it looked, and Trump was going down for Russia because he didn't know how to hide anything. So he acted the way he did with Putin because he's the dumbest idiot in the whole world, and his only plan for distracting people from the investigation was to act like he had some kind of weird, undefinable attraction to Putin. And if that didn't make sense, it could be made to make sense, because Trump also palled around with other dictators, so what he was doing with Putin fit in with that. Guy just loves dictators. Especially Russian ones that might be blackmailing him.

It makes perfect sense if you look at it as a long-time media figure using the media to create the impression that he's vulnerable to an investigation he'll never actually go down for. It doesn't really make any sense at all if you just accepted the narrative Trump was practically foisting upon the media at the time. But if you can't allow for Trump to be smart enough to deceive the left, then you're stuck with the narrative that doesn't make sense for anyone except CNN and MSNBC, that was actually killed by the Mueller report itself. And people are still holding out hope for that, because they want to believe. It's frustrating in a way I've never really had to deal with in arguing about politics before.

Or Trump saying "I'm ******" (when in fact he *has so far not *been) is further evidence that he has poor near-to-long-term judgement. He is not the strategist you make him out to be.

Edited by Sn4tteRBoxXeR

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24 minutes ago, GEORGIAfan said:

I figured in the 2nd debate she would act as a stand in for Gravel, but she has been attacking Kamala and been quiet on Biden. 

Warren is a party loyalist and most people didn't see a path to win, because HRC is popular and was polling above 60%.

I actually want to see Booker do better mainly because I believe he’s the most genuinely committed to criminal justice reform of any the candidates, but from the beginning he’s come off as exuding this desperate energy that’s all encompassing. I guess maybe that’s just who he is but it’s off putting. Obama made it look easy; it makes me uncomfortable watching how hard Booker tries. I’d still rather see him doing better than the cop and Mayo Pete, though.

Weren’t there rumors Bernie delayed announcing for 2016 because he was waiting to see if Warren would run or am I having false memories? I don’t wanna read about 2016 stuff to find out.

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10 minutes ago, Billy Ocean said:

I actually want to see Booker do better mainly because I believe he’s the most genuinely committed to criminal justice reform of any the candidates, but from the beginning he’s come off as exuding this desperate energy that’s all encompassing. I guess maybe that’s just who he is but it’s off putting. Obama made it look easy; it makes me uncomfortable watching how hard Booker tries. I’d still rather see him doing better than the cop and Mayo Pete, though.

Weren’t there rumors Bernie delayed announcing for 2016 because he was waiting to see if Warren would run or am I having false memories? I don’t wanna read about 2016 stuff to find out.

 

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1 hour ago, Sn4tteRBoxXeR said:

It's discussions like these where I'm skeptical Serge is not engaged in some sophisticated trolling scheme

He's not. he's always been like this

Serge likes this

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