Jpowers

Not the new Donald Trump Presidency thread

31,385 posts in this topic

To whoever was posting the Thomas Friedman thing, Thomas Friedman is a jackass. I am listening to him on Brian Williams right now and he sounds like a Never Trumper trying to curtail the Democratic platform.

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16 minutes ago, JayOzOne said:

 

CT scans and blood test results in the same day? Unlikely in a Universal Healthcare system.

Also, she was being treated already, has nothing to do with insurance, or payment. The Hospital should be investigated for negligence.

I was also waiting to hear the cause of the 243% statistic. Left us hanging there.

The ad is basically: Bad things happened. Here are some random statistics. Now support this massive government program that has nothing to do with what you just saw.

 

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8 minutes ago, Doozer said:

I blame her parents.

Also, were there actually ads telling people HOW to sign up for Obamacare?

 

Cool either way left behind with no way to pay for medical necessity, can't afford it at her current job, and not eligible to sign up until October. That's not acceptable

Leon Troutsky and lostone like this

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1 minute ago, Doozer said:

CT scans and blood test results in the same day? Unlikely in a Universal Healthcare system.

Also, she was being treated already, has nothing to do with insurance, or payment. The Hospital should be investigated for negligence.

I was also waiting to hear the cause of the 243% statistic. Left us hanging there.

The ad is basically: Bad things happened. Here are some random statistics. Now support this massive government program that has nothing to do with what you just saw.

 

We don't have to copy Canadas model to have universal healthcare for all citizens. 

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19 minutes ago, Doozer said:

So he's trying to get insurance AFTER he found out he needed to pay for healthcare?

It's pretty ******* dumb that you hear someone needs healthcare services and this is your reaction.

Wokezone, lostone, mdrake34 and 2 others like this

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52 minutes ago, Carter said:

Put the crayons down, Marine.

I think I may have met one of the Force Recon Marines from Generation Kill.  We started talking about his MARS red dot sight when none of us  had them (ok but heavy) and his sweet M249 Para that made me consider the pig in a whole new light.  But the HMMWV was amazing.  Chunks of rubber were missing out of the tires, the A-pillar was heavily deformed, holes covered the front end and hood including the windshield, and the clamshell rear was burned down.  How was it still rolling lol?

Also met two of the Marines who were prominently featured in Time magazine photos.

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16 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

Cool either way left behind with no way to pay for medical necessity, can't afford it at her current job, and not eligible to sign up until October. That's not acceptable

You should watch these videos.  It’s a guy who goes to five advanced industrial democracies to examine their health care systems.  He covers both the benefits AND the drawbacks/tradeoffs each country makes.  It’s very insightful.  I’m personally a huge fan of the Japanese system, which is almost exactly like the US system except for two very important differences.  And it’s a very different system from Canada and UK.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

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10 minutes ago, Leon Troutsky said:

You should watch these videos.  It’s a guy who goes to five advanced industrial democracies to examine their health care systems.  He covers both the benefits AND the drawbacks/tradeoffs each country makes.  It’s very insightful.  I’m personally a huge fan of the Japanese system, which is almost exactly like the US system except for two very important differences.  And it’s a very different system from Canada and UK.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

A swiss/Japanese hybrid might be where it's at.

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@Leon Troutsky

You're in academia.  Whats up with databases including the archived print magazine, but no pictures?  That's telling only half the story:happened:.  Do all you guys sit around and wink wink, nudge nudge, "only peer reviewed journals are acceptable as valid sources, chortle."  You might want to tell the twitter crowd that!

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Posted (edited)

21 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

A swiss/Japanese hybrid might be where it's at.

The key to those systems is the price fixing. They will have to balance the costs vs prices to keep the system running, before it becomes Venezuela.

I'm not sure we should trust THIS government to be able to do that. Although, we do have the Post Office as an example of how to run a business close to bankruptcy without going under.

 

 

Edited by Doozer

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Just now, Doozer said:

The key to those systems is the price fixing. The key will be to balance the prices to keep the system running, before it becomes Venezuela.

I'm not sure we should trust THIS government to be able to do that. Although, we do have the Post Office as an example of how to run a business close to bankruptcy without going under.

 

 

Is Japan Venezuela? Is Switzerland Venezuela?  Is Canada Venezuela? Or maybe wait for it..... Something besides healthcare crashed Venezuela.

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2 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

Is Japan Venezuela? Is Switzerland Venezuela?  Is Canada Venezuela? Or maybe wait for it..... Something besides healthcare crashed Venezuela.

You do realize that Japan and Switzerland's systems are having issues with their price fixing models precisely because the government response can stall. And those are relatively small systems.

And it only takes one corrupt, stubborn, crazy politician (Venezuela) to bring the entire central planning system down.

Now remember how long it took to provide funding for the border crisis. How long did it take to even call it a crisis? And we're still trying to address the issues with the VA.

Like I said before, do people actually believe that if they hand over 75% of their income to the government, that only Democrats will be allowed to spend it?

 

 

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We should try implementing versions of Universal Healthcare in several states and see which system adapts to what the average American needs; and which state everyone flees.

 

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24 minutes ago, Red&Black said:

I think I may have met one of the Force Recon Marines from Generation Kill.  We started talking about his MARS red dot sight when none of us  had them (ok but heavy) and his sweet M249 Para that made me consider the pig in a whole new light.  But the HMMWV was amazing.  Chunks of rubber were missing out of the tires, the A-pillar was heavily deformed, holes covered the front end and hood including the windshield, and the clamshell rear was burned down.  How was it still rolling lol?

Also met two of the Marines who were prominently featured in Time magazine photos.

I was assigned a 249 my entire time in the Army, to include a year in the sandbox. I got so freaking strong over there. :lol: 

I ended up doing a ton of missions as a convoy escort crew gunner with each different crew served weapon system we had (M2, M240B, MK19). The other gunners always wanted the M240Bs because it was the lightest, easiest to use and the most reliable... easiest to clean as well, although the **** thing would work no matter what. Same 7.62 round we'd get shot at with though. I wanted that M2 .50 cal. They were scared ****less of that gun over there. They couldn't hide from it. There was not a place they could go after starting some **** that a .50 cal would not reach out and touch them. In the mountains maybe, but I wasn't in the mountains. You could hear a ma deuce echo across the desert for literally miles.

I got so good with that thing that I could adjust on the fly if my headspace or timing were even a little off. I couldn't stand a sluggish sounding M2.

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Also I just want to insert an LOL here now @ the "moderate" Trump lovers in the room who keep talking about how horrible every other country's health care system is while the US health care system is objectively a complete embarrassment. 

Trump said it would be so easy to fix and Republicans campaigned for 6+ years on replacing ACA with something better... and none of them had any plan. Now they are just doing what conservatives always do and stripping funding away from programs that are in place.

AF89, lostone, falconsd56 and 4 others like this

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5 minutes ago, Carter said:

Also I just want to insert an LOL here now @ the "moderate" Trump lovers in the room who keep talking about how horrible every other country's health care system is while the US health care system is objectively a complete embarrassment. 

Trump said it would be so easy to fix and Republicans campaigned for 6+ years on replacing ACA with something better... and none of them had any plan. Now they are just doing what conservatives always do and stripping funding away from programs that are in place.

I mean first off who attacks CHIP and Wic-???? Why in all the programs and useless garbage we could cut would you cut funding for children??? 

And the ACa... Why would you only have 2 open enrollments? Why isn't always open enrollment into the government mandated healthcare especially when there was a penalty at one point for not having it?

You wanna make America great again?

How about let's make America healthy again

Or make America affordable again

Or make America pay great wages again

Or make America not waste trillions starting wars again

Or make Epi pens affordable again

I mean Maga should mean more than border security, deportation, and a high stock market.

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We have spent 5.9 trillion dollars in wars in the middle East and Asia since 2001. And the only war we needed to be involved in was Afghanistan which we spent 1 trillion. 

So we have wasted essentially 5 trillion dollars in unnecessary wars.

$5,000,000,000,000.00

All student loan debt in the US -1.5 trillion

 

Which would have been America first? 

Helping it's citizens get out of massive debt or going to war with a bunch of countries that led to other wars?

 

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4 hours ago, T-Falcon said:

We have spent 5.9 trillion dollars in wars in the middle East and Asia since 2001. And the only war we needed to be involved in was Afghanistan which we spent 1 trillion. 

So we have wasted essentially 5 trillion dollars in unnecessary wars.

$5,000,000,000,000.00

All student loan debt in the US -1.5 trillion

 

Which would have been America first? 

Helping it's citizens get out of massive debt or going to war with a bunch of countries that led to other wars?

 

This is interesting, because I thought it might actually be possible, but the math seemed off.

1.5 trillion isn't a correct number. It's just outstanding debt, not the actual cost of education since many students don't take out loans, or are paying it off. You need to use the cost of attending per year.

Plus, if college is free, that means that more students will attend.

Let's do the math.

About 4,000,000 students graduate high school per year.

Since it's free, we can assume that everyone will want to go to their dream school. Private, out of state costs per student is $50,900 (total) per year. But if we force kids to go cheap, that can be as low as  $25,290 for in state, public college.

Multiply that by 4 if we want to provide 4 year degrees

So that range is around $814 Billion to $405 Billion per year.

Multiply that by 18x since we want to compare it to Military spending since 2001...

The total cost is between $14.7 and $7.3 Trillion

While the $5.9 Trillion also includes 1 trillion in future obligatory payments, we can only transfer 4.9 trillion that was already spent, half of which we can't even use, because it includes costs that would have been spent anyway.... but lets take it all regardless.

We are left with between $9.8 to $2.4 trillion in new debt. Not counting Washington DC's administrative cut. 

I guess we can cut into the Military's total $650Billion dollar budget completely...

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5 minutes ago, mdrake34 said:

 

Eagerly looking forward to when they start relabeling all subsequent years as "after Q"or AQ for short

We are currently living in 2nd AQ blessed patriot

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7 hours ago, Doozer said:

The key to those systems is the price fixing. They will have to balance the costs vs prices to keep the system running, before it becomes Venezuela.

I'm not sure we should trust THIS government to be able to do that. Although, we do have the Post Office as an example of how to run a business close to bankruptcy without going under.

 

 

You can’t trust Trump’s administration to control prices?

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10 hours ago, WhenFalconsWin said:

‘Trump’s Going to Get Re-elected, Isn’t He?’

Voters have reason to worry.

Thomas L. Friedman

By Thomas L. Friedman

Opinion Columnist

He basically asks the squad to stop, says they will be a big reason why Trump will get reelected. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/16/opinion/trump-2020.html

I disagree with a lot of that for a lot of reasons, but what I disagree with most is the idea that Democrats can nominate someone "normal" and beat Trump. The only way a Democrat beats Trump is either the economy takes a major downturn or we nominate a Democrat that knows how to fight Trump, which is so much more complicated than it has to be for all the reasons I've described. Trump's going to keep on keeping on, going after the squad, having them respond to his racism, and centrists are going to look weak as **** for agreeing that he's acting racist and then backing down from saying he's so irredeemably racist that Democrats can't work with him.

There's a lot of candidates and I don't think any of them are going to figure out the right way to play offense and defense against Trump. Certainly not Biden. Almost certainly not Harris. I like Sanders and Warren but I don't think either of them know how to counter the **** Trump's doing now. Maybe Buttigieg but he's less likable the more you hear about him and he'd have to rise from where he's at in the race right now to have a shot at winning the nomination.

I don't know how the Democrats can do it if they can't explain what Trump's doing in a way that voters would receive it without rejecting it and shooting the messenger. Pretty much all of the candidates would be committing political suicide if they just explained it the way I did.

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