Jpowers

Not the new Donald Trump Presidency thread

30,295 posts in this topic

Just now, T-Falcon said:

I don't have a party I'm anti party

Yet when you first dusted this account back off and showed up in March, your first posts were a picture of a MAGA hat about how you were voting Trump 2020

Gritzblitz 2.0, AF89 and lostone like this

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6 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

Just because you say it won't doesn't it mean it won't. It will disenfranchise 80% of the country. It absolutely will.

And we're off!

mdrake34 likes this

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based upon the sheer outrage for democracy among the right, i can only imagine how long the list of industrialized countries with popular elections for their head of government/state that failed must be.

oh wait.

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6 minutes ago, The Legendary SB said:

There are 2 completely separate topics which is why it's an ad hominem attack.

Agreeing with someone on one topic doesn't automatically mean you agree with everything  they say.

Like the white supremacist and Nazi sympathizer whose picture you posted to “prove” global warming wasn’t real?

SB:  Hey guys, look at this picture.

Everyone:  That’s a white supremacist.

SB:  Well I don’t agree with everything, but you should believe this one thing that this white supremacist said.

Everyone:  Why are you posting stuff from white supremacists?

SB:  Um...err...GOTTA RUN!  :smoke cloud: 

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1 minute ago, T-Falcon said:

The dangers of having the big States dominate the smaller States will lead to war. 

Wrong, but we already see this plays out in how reps from smaller states with less population than D.C. (with an axe to grind) impose their will on the voters in D.C.  $$$$$

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6 minutes ago, The Legendary SB said:

There are 2 completely separate topics which is why it's an ad hominem attack.

Agreeing with someone on one topic doesn't automatically mean you agree with everything  they say.

Yeah, that's not an ad hominem.

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3 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

The dangers of having the big States dominate the smaller States will lead to war. 

yeah, it sure is great that the electoral college is here to maintain the political powerhouse of idaho and wyoming. 

like i said, your argument is utterly nonsensical. the electoral college doesn't even do what you believe it does. you have no idea what the **** you're talking about. 

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3 minutes ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

The EC was made because Southern states wanted their slaves to count when picking a president, which obviously couldn't happen with a popular vote. It was a half assed compromise to placate them.

Again wrong

 

The Constitutional Convention in 1787 used the Virginia Plan as the basis for discussions, as the Virginia proposal was the first. The Virginia Plan called for the Congress to elect the president.[11]Delegates from a majority of states agreed to this mode of election. After being debated, however, delegates came to oppose nomination by congress for the reason that it could violate the separation of powers. James Wilson then made motion for electors for the purpose of choosing the president.[12]

 

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Just now, T-Falcon said:

Again wrong

 

The Constitutional Convention in 1787 used the Virginia Plan as the basis for discussions, as the Virginia proposal was the first. The Virginia Plan called for the Congress to elect the president.[11]Delegates from a majority of states agreed to this mode of election. After being debated, however, delegates came to oppose nomination by congress for the reason that it could violate the separation of powers. James Wilson then made motion for electors for the purpose of choosing the president.[12]

 

 

Copy and paste what Madison said in that article next.

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The problem is not the EC per se, it’s the winner-take-all aspect of it.  I think the independent effort by states to declare their EC votes for the national winner makes a lot of sense.  Can effectively end the EC without amending the constitution.

Or all states could agree to apportion their EC proportionately, but that doesn’t seem likely to happen.

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My own crazy view is that instead of getting rid of the EC, which isn't going to happen, maybe we should consider returning the role of the presidency to what it was originally intended instead of the quasi-monarchcy that it's slowly been morphed into. 

The executive branch was never intended to wield the power it does currently. But that's been the product of years of partisanship and ruling parties shortsightedly giving their own president powers without consideration that the other party will eventually wield those powers at some point. 

 

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18 minutes ago, T-Falcon said:

Well to be fair getting rid of the electoral college will start a civil war. That's not even up for debate. 

Still obsessed with death.

 

Like clockwork, the response:

::worzone:: "No I'm not! Show me where I said that! You're putting words in my mouth again!"

::me::

tenor.gif?itemid=13955067

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1 minute ago, Gritzblitz 2.0 said:

My own crazy view is that instead of getting rid of the EC, which isn't going to happen, maybe we should consider returning the role of the presidency to what it was originally intended instead of the quasi-monarchcy that it's slowly been morphed into. 

The executive branch was never intended to wield the power it does currently. But that's been the product of years of partisanship and ruling parties shortsightedly giving their own president powers with consideration that the other party will eventually wield those powers at some point. 

 

giphy.gif

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2 minutes ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

Copy and paste what Madison said in that article next.

Alright, since you clearly aren't going to since it ruins your arguments:

Quote

Madison acknowledged that while a popular vote would be ideal, it would be difficult to get consensus on the proposal given the prevalence of slavery in the South:

There was one difficulty however of a serious nature attending an immediate choice by the people. The right of suffrage was much more diffusive in the Northern than the Southern States; and the latter could have no influence in the election on the score of Negroes. The substitution of electors obviated this difficulty and seemed on the whole to be liable to the fewest objections.[16]

 

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Just now, Gritzblitz 2.0 said:

My own crazy view is that instead of getting rid of the EC, which isn't going to happen, maybe we should consider returning the role of the presidency to what it was originally intended instead of the quasi-monarchcy that it's slowly been morphed into. 

The executive branch was never intended to wield the power it does currently. But that's been the product of years of partisanship and ruling parties shortsightedly giving their own president powers with consideration that the other party will eventually wield those powers at some point. 

 

^^^^ this and let's also get back to

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people

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Just now, The Legendary SB said:

Agreed.  The past several presidents have abused executive orders.  

And Trump has taken that to even more absurd levels, like his claim of “absolute immunity” for executive officials, his declaration of a “national emergency” to build a wall that he couldn’t get Congress to fund, and his numerous executive orders that have been smacked down by the courts.

You complain about abuses of executive orders (especially by Obama) but ignore that your guy is abusing those powers much more frequently and flagrantly.

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2 minutes ago, mdrake34 said:

Still obsessed with death.

 

Like clockwork, the response:

::worzone:: "No I'm not! Show me where I said that! You're putting words in my mouth again!"

::me::

tenor.gif?itemid=13955067

Poor fella. I'm just giving you the likeliest scenario. Those calling to deligitimize an election are the ones calling for death pretending their actions won't have consequences. Anyone who wants that is a lunatic.

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1 minute ago, eatcorn said:

Say what?

You know, we should suggest that North Korea allow opposition parties to run in the election and that the regime should stop murdering and killing those who speak out against it.  The president should be chosen by the majority of North Koreans.

T-Falcon:  Why do you want to delegitimize an election????

Gritzblitz 2.0 and falconsd56 like this

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8 minutes ago, Leon Troutsky said:

The problem is not the EC per se, it’s the winner-take-all aspect of it.  I think the independent effort by states to declare their EC votes for the national winner makes a lot of sense.  Can effectively end the EC without amending the constitution.

Or all states could agree to apportion their EC proportionately, but that doesn’t seem likely to happen.

 

3 minutes ago, eatcorn said:

Say what?

 When people seek ways to delegitimize an election by trying to manipulate around the Constitution they are going to meet resistance.

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