KCartledge85

Having a hard time feeling good about this draft

184 posts in this topic

These are the overall rankings for Lindstrom and McGary from some sites:

Nfldraftcoundown: Lindstrom=26, McGary=37

Nfldraftscout: Lindstrom=54, McGary=37

CBSsports: Lindstrom=32, McGary=28

Draftnetwork: Lindstrom=20, McGary=132

Draftek: Lindstrom=32, McGary=37

 

So just going by this sample it's easy to see that draft rankings are not worth the paper they are written on. TD said that they thought about taking Lindstrom lower but weren't confident that they could and didn't want to risk it. Also, these rankings from pundits that always check each other are so variable, let alone among managers and scouts who keep things secret. All it would have taken was one team to like Lindstrom. It's really ridiculous to put more weight into what pundits say; if those were reliable then teams wouldn't spend millions and millions on scouting. 

 

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1 hour ago, KCartledge85 said:

So I have been thinking about how the 1st round turned out ever since last Thursday night. Coming into the draft, I figured there was no way trader Thomas wouldn't make a splash. With the way the Falcons were signing veterans just before draft day, all signs pointed to TD using the draft capital of 9 selection to create impact. 

It's been reported that TD tried to move to #10. I tend to think this was for Jonah Williams and not Wilkins, but we may never know. The entire offseason has been about protecting Matt Ryan, so it just seems logical. Unable to move up from #14, ill be honest, im not sure anyone was left the fan base would be happy with. Montez Sweat was probably the only player available "experts" could have viewed as a "value". The guy has off the field and medical issues. I wouldn't be shocked if he wasn't off TD's board all together. With that said, moving BACK was the obvious play here. For months everyone was talking about how much value was in the top 3 rounds of the 2019 draft. Move out of no value spot, get more draft capital, seems like an easy decision. TD was already quoted saying they discussed moving back, but ultimately decided to make a selection. When they announced Lindstrom, I wasn't mad, I just didn't see ANY value in the pick. You're drafting the #14 overall pick and the first guard in the entire draft. That player is suppose to be a DOMINATING PLAYER. Everything you read about Lindstrom suggests he should be a "solid pro". He "doesn't do anything great, but also doesn't have a major weakness". It is so underwhelming.

Here is where it gets UGLY for me ....

Pre-Draft Analysis

McGary is a tall, well-built right tackle prospect with short arms, especially for his height. He is a very good run-blocker who gets into position and moves defenders off the ball when he keeps his pads down. He has a quick set and a lot of shock in his hands, but he lunges at times, and his arm length is a concern.

Post-Draft Analysis

Atlanta isn't messing around when it comes to protecting quarterback Matt Ryan. They trade back into Round 1 here to further bolster a run offense that ranked 25th in rushing yards per game last season. McGary has the skill set to push Ty Sambrailo for the starting job at right tackle as a rookie. -- Steve Muench
 

Folks ..... We gave up our 2nd and 3rd round pick for someone that "has the skill set to push Ty Sambrailo for the starting job". If I am giving up extra picks in the top 3 rounds, the guy WITHOUT A DOUBT is better than Ty Sambrilo. How in the earth do we move back into the 1st round for this guy? You have Taylor, Ford, Risner and Little all available to you for less draft capital in early round 2. 

This draft literally could have been Andre Dillard, Greedy Williams and Jaylon Ferguson.

I'm not ready to move on from TD and DQ, but if we don't have a dominate offensive line or continue to have a TERRIBLE pass rush in 2019, sign me up. 

 

I have a dead horse you can beat

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5 minutes ago, falcons007 said:

If you know the value. Sure. Or make a case with players who could have been there in 3rd round. This over drafting is recent media creation.

I firmly believe the following combinations made more sense for a SB run in 2019

1st Round: Lawrence 

2nd Round: McGary/Adderly

3rd Round: Crosby/Ferguson

 

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33 minutes ago, Mescalito said:

and you had it again?!?  WTF!  You must really love that ****.

Lol it's easy, close to my office, and consistent. I'm a very lazy eater during lunch. 

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6 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I firmly believe the following combinations made more sense for a SB run in 2019

1st Round: Lawrence 

2nd Round: McGary/Adderly

3rd Round: Crosby/Ferguson

 

Scratch McGary, he was gone in 30s. Kiss goodbye to SB with out Offensive line and mid tier talent. When it comes to OL, you are only as strong as your weakest link. Falcons have to replace 3 offensive starters and 3 back ups.

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26 minutes ago, RubberDucky said:

Potentially. 

Though I initially felt we reached on Lindstrom, I realized that the mocks have no bearing on how NFL GM's view players and where they truly project to go. I also recognize he has all the skill and traits to be a corner-stone OL. I think there is a high likelihood that he will go on to be a 10 year starter at OG for us.

McGary, I'm not sold on yet. I like the demeanor and toughness, but you gotta know how to pass pro. He appears weak in that area. He can develop, but I cant confidently say that he will be our starting RT this year or even next. On top of that, I cant confidently say he will ever be a great RT. 

 

You right tho. I'm glad TD finally decided to do whatever it takes to build an OL we can count on. 

Yea it's all potential, but that's the upside. 

Also, the comments about McGary's lack of pass pro ability are blown out of proportion. Especially once you look at that article from the thread I posted. Yes, he has trouble with electric edge guys. Jawaan Taylor got beat repeatedly by Brian Burns. Bigger guys will have that issue. But he was taught to pass block an unconventional method, which is muddying the waters for people (no pun intended). It did for me. I watched one game of McGary's and was over it. Thought his feet were entirely too slow to make it in the league. Then that article broke it down and I watched it from a different lenses and understood he was coached to block in a more aggressive style compared to how Jake blocks: catching the rush versus attacking the rush. It makes his losses look a lot worse, which scares the **** out of people. I get it.

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31 minutes ago, vel said:

"May or may not beat out Ty" is somebody else's feelings towards the pick. That's my point. You have a valid point in your reservation towards Ty because it's based on what you see and the opinion you've formulated on your own. I don't really care for people using other people's opinions to feel a type of way about the pick. How do you determine they "wasted" a top 100 pick without a single snap being played? 

But it’s true.  I think we both agree it’s possible Ty is the starter Game 1.  I don’t see it as a sensational statement by KC.

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17 minutes ago, falcons007 said:

I wasn’t interpreting that way, the reason I mentioned Duke Riley is Falcons probably would have gone Defense in 3rd round. With a thin draft this year, it’s more possible to land a Duke Riley. I didn’t even care to do mock draft this year, very underwhelming. I wish they did more in FA on defense. At this point it is what it is.

I agree with that much. Then again, I like the 5 guys we got from the 4th on, so who knows

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3 minutes ago, falcons007 said:

Scratch McGary, he was gone in 30s. Kiss goodbye to SB with out Offensive line and mid tier talent. When it comes to OL, you are only as strong as your weakest link. 

You have no way of knowing that.  But you’ll notice I put two options in RD 2 and RD 3 for just such an argument

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2 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

But it’s true.  I think we both agree it’s possible Ty is the starter Game 1.  I don’t see it as a sensational statement by KC.

I'm not against that stance. It's that it's solely based on somebody else's report. If that report said "McGary is going to come in day one and be an All Pro RT and borderline HOF" how would the OP feel? 

It's a herd mentality thought, not a unique one. 

Take KoG back when we picked Konz. He hated the pick and was solo on that and explained why. He didn't need somebody else's assessment of the pick. I have no problem with deferring views, so long as their yours, not somebody else's. You have been vocal and firm on your reservation. We discussed, debated, and agreed to disagree. No problem, because that's how YOU see it. 

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43 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

And I can’t believe how many fans misconstrue healthy debate for whining.

Why are different POV’s so terrifying?

Quote of the day!  It's a crime unless you are following the "group think" around here.  

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4 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

You have no way of knowing that.  But you’ll notice I put two options in RD 2 and RD 3 for just such an argument

There was run on tackles, so McGary was off. Anyways like I said Falcons had to replace 3 starters and 3 back ups on OL. It’s moot point even debating it. 

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1 minute ago, falcons007 said:

There was run on tackles, so McGary was off. Anyways like I said Falcons had to replace 3 starters and 3 back ups on OL. It’s moot point even debating it. 

Fair point and I suspect you are right.

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10 minutes ago, Francis York Morgan said:

I agree with that much. Then again, I like the 5 guys we got from the 4th on, so who knows

I do like the ceiling of the 5 guys we picked. I think Sheffield, Ollison and Green can contribute immediately at the least on ST. Cominsky is probably the guy with highest ceiling but a project. This draft will most likely judged by first two picks though.

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11 minutes ago, vel said:

I'm not against that stance. It's that it's solely based on somebody else's report. If that report said "McGary is going to come in day one and be an All Pro RT and borderline HOF" how would the OP feel? 

It's a herd mentality thought, not a unique one. 

Take KoG back when we picked Konz. He hated the pick and was solo on that and explained why. He didn't need somebody else's assessment of the pick. I have no problem with deferring views, so long as their yours, not somebody else's. You have been vocal and firm on your reservation. We discussed, debated, and agreed to disagree. No problem, because that's how YOU see it. 

Vel, he is upset about the 3rd round pick.  The rest of the OP is filler.

If we went Linstrom at 14, we all agreed the defense gets the next two picks.  I’d bet only 2-3 people thought otherwise when the trade up was announced.  

Gotta credit my man for calling it.  Where u at @FalconFanSince1970

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14 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

The forum would be more effective if username’s were not visible.  2 or 3 popular people say something and the herd follows in mass.  

This I agree with - it'd be an interesting sight for sure.

17 minutes ago, Boise Falcon Fan said:

Quote of the day!  It's a crime unless you are following the "group think" around here.  

I do think it's getting to be a bit mob mentality lately, but the draft is crazy...should settle soon hopefully.

Then again, TATF loves to bicker, as do most forums. Hard to do that without opposing views. Just don't demonize each other, mkay?

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4 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Vel, he is upset about the 3rd round pick.  The rest of the OP is filler.

If we went Linstrom at 14, we all agreed the defense gets the next two picks.  I’d bet only 2-3 people thought otherwise when the trade up was announced.  

Gotta credit my man for calling it.  Where u at @FalconFanSince1970

Here is from OP:

"Folks ..... We gave up our 2nd and 3rd round pick for someone that "has the skill set to push Ty Sambrailo for the starting job". If I am giving up extra picks in the top 3 rounds, the guy WITHOUT A DOUBT is better than Ty Sambrilo. How in the earth do we move back into the 1st round for this guy? You have Taylor, Ford, Risner and Little all available to you for less draft capital in early round 2."

The OP didn't make clear if HE thinks Ty is good or if he thinks McGary isn't good enough to beat Ty. He's solely complaining about trading up for a guy somebody else thinks can push Ty. He's not complaining about what we gave up. He's complaining about giving up the pick for a player somebody else doesn't think is good enough to beat out Ty. That is my point and why I call it whining. 

Also, the "You have Taylor, Ford, Risner and Little all available to you for less draft capital in early round 2." part is just plain wrong, given we literally have factual evidence to prove it's false. Carolina traded up from #47 to #37 and gave up pick #77, their third round pick. They literally made the exact same trade the Falcons made to move up into the first round, but we got a fifth year option and they don't. So where does the "for less draft capital" point stand valid? Nowhere. So if they sat at #45, all of those guys were gone and the only way to get one was to give up the third. 

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14 minutes ago, vel said:

Here is from OP:

"Folks ..... We gave up our 2nd and 3rd round pick for someone that "has the skill set to push Ty Sambrailo for the starting job". If I am giving up extra picks in the top 3 rounds, the guy WITHOUT A DOUBT is better than Ty Sambrilo. How in the earth do we move back into the 1st round for this guy? You have Taylor, Ford, Risner and Little all available to you for less draft capital in early round 2."

The OP didn't make clear if HE thinks Ty is good or if he thinks McGary isn't good enough to beat Ty. He's solely complaining about trading up for a guy somebody else thinks can push Ty. He's not complaining about what we gave up. He's complaining about giving up the pick for a player somebody else doesn't think is good enough to beat out Ty. That is my point and why I call it whining. 

Also, the "You have Taylor, Ford, Risner and Little all available to you for less draft capital in early round 2." part is just plain wrong, given we literally have factual evidence to prove it's false. Carolina traded up from #47 to #37 and gave up pick #77, their third round pick. They literally made the exact same trade the Falcons made to move up into the first round, but we got a fifth year option and they don't. So where does the "for less draft capital" point stand valid? Nowhere. So if they sat at #45, all of those guys were gone and the only way to get one was to give up the third. 

Alright, that’s it.

@KCartledge85 You suck for getting Vel & I into an argument on the semantics of your post...lol

Give us your original thoughts on McGary

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2 hours ago, Osiruz said:

Ford never played in a zbs and doesn't even fit our scheme. Taylor and little are overrated. We made the right choices. Funny how pre draft when Ryan gets mauled for 42 sacks and our Oline malfunctions in run blocking everyone is screaming "DRAFT SOME OLINEMEN," yet when it comes time to do it everyone gets upset at TD lol. 

Everyone is not upset. 

The overwhelming majority on this board supports the moves we made. Some don't, but they are severely outnumbered 

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7 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Alright, that’s it.

@KCartledge85 You suck for getting Vel & I into an argument on the semantics of your post...lol

Give us your original thoughts on McGary

Lol it's all love. I'll call you on your shlt. I just think this thread was pointless, as it was no different than the ones we've heard since Thursday. I'm all for differing views. I mean just look at our discussions about Bradbury all offseason. If it's a bs argument, I'm calling it out. 

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1 minute ago, vel said:

Lol it's all love. I'll call you on your shlt. I just think this thread was pointless, as it was no different than the ones we've heard since Thursday. I'm all for differing views. I mean just look at our discussions about Bradbury all offseason. If it's a bs argument, I'm calling it out. 

Fair enough, Vel

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2 hours ago, Francis York Morgan said:

Or a Pro Bowler like Austin Hooper, if we're being fair. Don't see anyone we missed out on that I think would be on that level - Justin Layne and Khalen Saunders are good but idk about that - so I'm fine with it.

Lindstrom handle Saunders in Oline vs Dline drills at the senior bowl.

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4 hours ago, cyofish said:

People get so enamored with draft picks and draft positions.  At the end of the day what matters is how well the draftees perform.  Go back and review the past draft.  NFL scouts, pundits, and analyst are the wrong 60%-70% of the time.  

 

Same goes for GM’s.

Thats why keeping your 3rd round pick is a wise course of action.  Your drafts will be better with more bites at the apple

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15 minutes ago, GATXBOI said:

Lindstrom handle Saunders in Oline vs Dline drills at the senior bowl.

I agree. Still think Saunders can play. I'm happy with McGary. Dude is mean.

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