VTCrunkler

Wilkins vs. Lawrence

229 posts in this topic

At this point I don’t think Ed Oliver falling to 14 is a reality. The scenarios and where they were picked don’t really matter with this hypothetical question. Who ya got Christian Wilkins it Dexter Lawrence?

There are pros and cons to each. Folks are questioning if Dexter Lawrence is going to be in the field for three downs. Maybe. Does it matter? Was Haloti NGata on the field all of the time? 

Wilkins is a better pass rusher but he gets blown TF back off the ball in the run game. Dexter can hold the point of attack and split defenders.   

I prefer Lawrence because I think he translates better than Wilkins. 

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Right now I think Wilkins is a better player and would fit what we do.

Actually fit and working into a rotation I think by a nose.I’d be looking at Lawrence.If Run D and foil for our pass rushers to get off is the key for me.So it’s Lawrence by a nose.

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if the choice was boiled down between WILKINS or LAWRENCE, you take the best pass rusher - and that's not close.   Your in the nickel defense 60-65% of the time and the better nickel defender will be Wilkins.

You can draft or sign a cheap free agent to help shore up the run defense.  I know Wilkins has some ability in passrush but it's not good enough to leave him in the game when better passrushers would be on the bench like a Jack Crawford type.

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3 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

if the choice was boiled down between WILKINS or LAWRENCE, you take the best pass rusher - and that's not close.   Your in the nickel defense 60-65% of the time and the better nickel defender will be Wilkins.

You can draft or sign a cheap free agent to help shore up the run defense.  I know Wilkins has some ability in passrush but it's not good enough to leave him in the game when better passrushers would be on the bench like a Jack Crawford type.

What about if Lawrence puts guys around him in favourable positions.

Also think the Run defending role is a big one for this draft class upfront that’s where it’s all gotta start.

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With his power and length, Lawrence can be a real difference-maker even 3rd downs. Taking two guys with you on the way to collapse the pocket does wonders for keeping the QB in the range of your DEs.

To me a guy who affect multiple players like that is a better value than yet another DT with pass rush skills who may or may not be able to be his man one-on-one.

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I voted for Wilkins because there is no greater priority than improving our pass rush and he's the better of the two. Simple as that. DQ will find some way to stop the run without making it a first-round priority.

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32 minutes ago, FalconAge said:

Taking two guys with you on the way to collapse the pocket does wonders for keeping the QB in the range of your DEs.

 

49 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

Lawrence puts guys around him in favourable positions.

My thinking was that Lawrence can draw doubles which free up others.  Not sure if he gets doubled on passing downs, but he has shown ability to slice through the o line on passing downs.  

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Posted (edited)

I would call them about equal but different.  Both could work. 

Lawrence would be that anchoring force and could play the Poe role. 

Pros: 

  • Excellent against the run
  • Can eat doubles and is hard to move.
  • Rarely lets guys he gets his hands on go anywhere.
  • Can push the pocket

Cons:

  • Huge and while he moves very well for his size, he ain't fast or quick.
  • Not much pass rush on his own but does affect the pocket for others.
  • Not personally concerned but the PEDs thing should not be ignored completely.

Summary:

I think Lawrence is a good fit as a traditional 0/1 tech who is effective enough against the pass to be a 3-down player.

Wilkins is a dynamic piece that can play anywhere.

Pros:

  • Good against run or and credible pass rush skills.
  • Play anywhere on the DL
  • Sharp, hard working with a nice balance athleticism and skill.
  • Healthy and super productive.

Cons

  • Can get washed out of plays
  • Cannot hold up to double teams
  • Jack of all trades master of none.

Summary:

Wilkins is the kind of player who has the range to play all over the defense and contribute and I think is probably the most NFL-ready of any of the prospects we are looking at.  He wins with skill and effort, not by overpowering or out athleting opponents and I think that should translate well.

Edited by Monolith2001

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1 hour ago, Hurry_Up_And_Buy said:

I'd go Tillery in the 1st and Lawrence in the 2nd if it was my call..

I’d take Tillery too.....he’s underrated by many

but Wilkins is my favorite 

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3 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

What about if Lawrence puts guys around him in favourable positions.

Also think the Run defending role is a big one for this draft class upfront that’s where it’s all gotta start.

I feel you draft role players after round one. Any great player should garner attention, allowing others around him to play better.

would love a big body defender, but not at the expense of a penetrator. 

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Well if it was my choice I would take Lawrence. I really think he can be a C.Campbell type of player for this team.

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42 minutes ago, 1989Fan said:

I feel you draft role players after round one. Any great player should garner attention, allowing others around him to play better.

would love a big body defender, but not at the expense of a penetrator. 

I hear you I been conflicted on Lawrence for months.The only thing I have what you speak is if the above is a Neal type pick.Our guy of soughts if the coaches an TD have said he’s OUR guy all bets are off.

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Lawrence if I'm choosing. 
Lawrence is almost as good a pass rusher and a better run stuffer. Also fits a need we don't have.

The thing about Lawrence is he HAS to be double teamed. He's going to over-power just about any O-Lineman one on one. But with Grady's emergence, he needs to be doubled often as well. This could create a deadly cocktail on the inside of our D-Line. 

Wilkins doesn't have any outstanding characteristic that I am positive will translate to the NFL. There's a chance he could be a Grady clone with a mix of his strength, size and speed. But he'd still be sort of redundant. 

Gimme Lawrence. 

NeonDeion, VTCrunkler and jas82487 like this

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43 minutes ago, MD-FalconFan13 said:

Lawrence if I'm choosing. 
Lawrence is almost as good a pass rusher and a better run stuffer. Also fits a need we don't have.

The thing about Lawrence is he HAS to be double teamed. He's going to over-power just about any O-Lineman one on one. But with Grady's emergence, he needs to be doubled often as well. This could create a deadly cocktail on the inside of our D-Line. 

Wilkins doesn't have any outstanding characteristic that I am positive will translate to the NFL. There's a chance he could be a Grady clone with a mix of his strength, size and speed. But he'd still be sort of redundant. 

Gimme Lawrence. 

Perfectly stated.                        Give me Dexter as well. If we could trade back in the first and pick up an extra pick and still get Lawrence it would be icing on the cake !!

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5 hours ago, Monolith2001 said:

I would call them about equal but different.  Both could work. 

Lawrence would be that anchoring force and could play the Poe role. 

Pros: 

  • Excellent against the run
  • Can eat doubles and is hard to move.
  • Rarely lets guys he gets his hands on go anywhere.
  • Can push the pocket

Cons:

  • Huge and while he moves very well for his size, he ain't fast or quick.
  • Not much pass rush on his own but does affect the pocket for others.
  • Not personally concerned but the PEDs thing should not be ignored completely.

Summary:

I think Lawrence is a good fit as a traditional 0/1 tech who is effective enough against the pass to be a 3-down player.

Wilkins is a dynamic piece that can play anywhere.

Pros:

  • Good against run or and credible pass rush skills.
  • Play anywhere on the DL
  • Sharp, hard working with a nice balance athleticism and skill.
  • Healthy and super productive.

Cons

  • Can get washed out of plays
  • Cannot hold up to double teams
  • Jack of all trades master of none.

Summary:

Wilkins is the kind of player who has the range to play all over the defense and contribute and I think is probably the most NFL-ready of any of the prospects we are looking at.  He wins with skill and effort, not by overpowering or out athleting opponents and I think that should translate well.

Good synopses of the two. 

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Out of 34 voters the poll is 65/35% in favor of Lawrence. 

Mid be ok with either.  Preference is Lawrence. But with proper coaching both would excel. I wonder if we found a gem with Grady, or is his success more a function of coaching. 

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56 minutes ago, Knight of God said:

Oliver played NT far more than Lawrence. Lawrence was 3 tech and even 5tech. 

Thinking about this if they lined Lawrence up at 3T outside shoulder he can’t get doubled and you’d think he’d force the run back inside ?

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