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gazoo

Matt Ryan has played with an awful Falcons defense most of his career

114 posts in this topic

3 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Eh, Belichick kinda made Brady. For the Belichick and Brady empire, I’d say that dynasty is about 75% Belichick, 25% Brady. 

I agree with the percentage breakdown. Definitely more Bellichick. He could do most of it with another QB but Brady wouldn’t be where he is without Bellichick.

Fans don’t understand the depth of value the most brilliant game planner and in game adjustment chess player in NFL history. 

Bellichick knows exactly what kind of chess pieces he has, he needs, and what everyone else has and he knows how to put his players in a position make plays. 

For instance, Brady has to have a pocket to step up into to play at his highest level, throwing down motion like tomahawk chop to his diminutive receivers on crossing routes and quick slants. You take pocket away from Brady and he’s pedestrian at best. This, Bellichick made sure Brady’s entire career he had a strong interior OL to hold a pocket, receivers like Edelman and Welker and receiving running backs to catch short quick passes and good TEs who could block and get downfield. 

Head to head in Super Bowl Ryan flat out outplayed Brady and had game won, but coaching lost game for Ryan and coaching gave Brady that ring.

Ryan beat Brady head to head in Super Bowl , “but Ryan isn’t elite because he doesn’t have a ring”

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, ki46dinah said:

Julio >>>>>

Only elite talent in that group at any point in time was Randy.

Welker, Edelman, Hernandez were above average

Deion, Faulk, Brown were average

Amendola, Patton and Givens?

And Dillon was winding down

------------------

Gronk is awesome, but has been a relative non factor several seasons running now because of injury. Even Pats fans will say he is not the GOAT of TE's though, Tony G has almost 3 times the career receptions, same with Gates, and Witten is over 2 his catches.

100%

 

To everything you said. Gonzales hands down and it's not even close

Edited by Ghost_02
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16 hours ago, gazoo said:

Sounds like you don’t know what you are talking about bruh. Do you even know the difference between man and zone coverage? Do you know what snap counts are? If you don’t understand our defense was gassed playing that many snaps in man coverage, you don’t understand this game. People that refuse to ackowldge the obvious aren’t worth discussing football with bruh.

Understand that BUT that's not an excuse my point! your team n coach need to learn to manage the game better. Point blank. Stop that QB that you claim Ryan out played so much. 

 

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Eh, Belichick kinda made Brady. For the Belichick and Brady empire, I’d say that dynasty is about 75% Belichick, 25% Brady. 

You could also argue that the dynasty is 60% Brady and 40% Belichick, because Belichick has never or hardly made the playoffs without Brady as his starting QB with the Baltimore Browns and in 2000 and 2008 when Brady didn't start. They were 5-11 in 2000. In 2001 they started 0-2 with Bledsoe and then when Brady took over they went 11-3 the rest of the season. Brady was injured in 2008, and despite going 11-5 with Matt Cassel, they still missed the playoffs. Now in all honesty I don't believe Belichick is as successful without Brady, and Brady isn't as successful without Belichick. Boston sports has a system that has worked historically across all of their franchises. When Boston has talent like Atlanta's best talent, they will take full advantage of it. 

Edited by mqg96
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17 minutes ago, mqg96 said:

You could also argue that the dynasty is 60% Brady and 40% Belichick, because Belichick has never or hardly made the playoffs without Brady as his starting QB with the Baltimore Browns and in 2000 and 2008 when Brady didn't start. They were 5-11 in 2000. In 2001 they started 0-2 with Bledsoe and then when Brady took over they went 11-3 the rest of the season. Brady was injured in 2008, and despite going 11-5 with Matt Cassel, they still missed the playoffs. Now in all honesty I don't believe Belichick is as successful without Brady, and Brady isn't as successful without Belichick. Boston sports has a system that has worked historically across all of their franchises. When Boston has talent like Atlanta's best talent, they will take full advantage of it. 

Here’s how I see it, Belichick could easily win in this league with most starting QB’s. He won the super bowl with a game manager in Brady against the greatest show on turf in 2001. Believe me, in Brady’s first 3-4 years, he wasn’t actually an elite QB. Not even close 

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1 hour ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Here’s how I see it, Belichick could easily win in this league with most starting QB’s. He won the super bowl with a game manager in Brady against the greatest show on turf in 2001. Believe me, in Brady’s first 3-4 years, he wasn’t actually an elite QB. Not even close 

Bingo. Anytime you provide a good QB a solid OL, solid running game and excellent defenses, he is in a position to win. (Think  Flacco) Especially with Belichick game planning and making in game adjustments.

Again, the 2016 Patriots Defense that Ryan faced in Super Bowl had the NFLs #1 defense in points allowed. Ryan played virtually perfect football against it. Brady faced the NFLs #27 ranked Falcons defense in points allowed and played like garbage until defense was gasping for air late 4th quarter and overtime.

 

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14 hours ago, ki46dinah said:

Julio >>>>>

Gronk is awesome, but has been a relative non factor several seasons running now because of injury. Even Pats fans will say he is not the GOAT of TE's though, Tony G has almost 3 times the career receptions, same with Gates, and Witten is over 2 his catches.

 

*SMH*

Julio Jones has 51 TDs his first 8 seasons, Gronk had 76 TDs his first 8 seasons. Gronk helps Brady just as much as Julio helps Ryan, if not more. They are both HOF players.

Tony G in his 13-17 seasons?

We signed Tony G well after his prime, in his 13th season, after he’d lost any speed and quite frankly, Taylor Gabriel was a better blocker than Tony G while he was here.  

While Gronk was having seasons like 1300+ yards, 17 TDs and awesome blocking for Brady, Tony G never broke 1000 yards or 10 TDs in Atlanta. Gronk broke these numbers many seasons for Brady.

Gronk is the total package. He can get deep downfield, split the seams, he can not just do things WRs can, he can also block like an OL in both pass protection and running game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddT8gozJnic

Brain Baldinger showing how Gronk is best blocking TE in NFL, in pass protection for Brady blocking  Khalil Mack 1-1, in running game springing tons of lanes for running backs, in Super Bowl against Chiefs Brady said they won the game becuase of Gronk phenomenal blocking all game.

It looks like to you blocking is irrelevant for a TE and Tong Gs last few twilight years playing in Atlanta before retiring were just as good as Gronks prime years! You missed telling me Brady never had a running back as good as Stephen Jackson like Ryan had!

*smh*

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10 hours ago, gazoo said:

 

*SMH*

Julio Jones has 51 TDs his first 8 seasons, Gronk had 76 TDs his first 8 seasons. Gronk helps Brady just as much as Julio helps Ryan, if not more. They are both HOF players.

Tony G in his 13-17 seasons?

We signed Tony G well after his prime, in his 13th season, after he’d lost any speed and quite frankly, Taylor Gabriel was a better blocker than Tony G while he was here.  

While Gronk was having seasons like 1300+ yards, 17 TDs and awesome blocking for Brady, Tony G never broke 1000 yards or 10 TDs in Atlanta. Gronk broke these numbers many seasons for Brady.

Gronk is the total package. He can get deep downfield, split the seams, he can not just do things WRs can, he can also block like an OL in both pass protection and running game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddT8gozJnic

Brain Baldinger showing how Gronk is best blocking TE in NFL, in pass protection for Brady blocking  Khalil Mack 1-1, in running game springing tons of lanes for running backs, in Super Bowl against Chiefs Brady said they won the game becuase of Gronk phenomenal blocking all game.

It looks like to you blocking is irrelevant for a TE and Tong Gs last few twilight years playing in Atlanta before retiring were just as good as Gronks prime years! You missed telling me Brady never had a running back as good as Stephen Jackson like Ryan had!

*smh*

No hate anywhere....never said Gronk wasnt very good....just that he hasnt been on the field a whole season since 2011. Thats a direct result of his rough and tumble ways and crappy back.

Even in 2017, Gronk had a great season(over 1000 yards). Tony in his same age, in a relatively different era of football (2004), with Trent Green(not a HoF but a good QB at any rate) put up 1200 yards.

-------------------

Like Bo Jackson, you can be a great talent and be very skilled, and put together some good years....but longetivity to go with talent makes you a HoF.

The only way Gronk sniffs a HoF bid is because of the Patriots SB wins.

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It's sort of crazy.  It'd be one thing if we had a 13th ranked defense on average while he's been here.  That would be a team that was offense oriented but had a passable defense.

The fact that they're nearly dead last the majority of years is crazy.

I'm always on board for more DL, more OL and good enough skill players (Good enough skill players is actually what we have aside from Julio).  It's not like we have 4 great receivers.  We should be able to put together a better OL and defense given that.

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20 hours ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

Here’s how I see it, Belichick could easily win in this league with most starting QB’s. He won the super bowl with a game manager in Brady against the greatest show on turf in 2001. Believe me, in Brady’s first 3-4 years, he wasn’t actually an elite QB. Not even close 

1:00 left, pinned down inside their own end.  John Madden says to take a knee and play for OT.

Instead, Brady completes 6/6 passes and sets up the game winner.  In clutch moments, Brady has always been the GOAT.

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13 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

1:00 left, pinned down inside their own end.  John Madden says to take a knee and play for OT.

Instead, Brady completes 6/6 passes and sets up the game winner.  In clutch moments, Brady has always been the GOAT.

You can’t let one drive define the legacy though. What if Vinatieri missed the kick in both the 2001 and 2003 Super Bowls? Is Brady a “choker” instead?

We’ll stick with the 2001 super bowl. You’re right, Brady played well in the final drive. But here’s the reality, the Patriots defense won that game. That Rams offense, at the time, was the best offense ever. The Patriots defense held them to 17 points, forced 3 turnovers, and Ty Law had a pick 6. But the narrative is “Brady is Mr. Clutch!” The narrative and the reality are 2 completely different things. Brady threw for a whopping 145 yards. He’s not the reason they won. And this has been the truth about most of Brady’s career. 

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16 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Falcons built outside in with skill players during Ryan's tenure. Should have gone inside out. Now that we've finally figured out we need to build the interior we have no cap space and will have to rely on rookies to save us. Shame, shame, shame. Troffed.

Truest statement you’ve ever made

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On 3/8/2019 at 9:12 PM, ⚡Slumerican⚡ said:

Only thing Ryan is missing is a coach and GM that knows how to build a team correctly 

if by this point in his career it hasn't happened, it's looking less and less likely it's EVER going to happen

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1 hour ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

You can’t let one drive define the legacy though. What if Vinatieri missed the kick in both the 2001 and 2003 Super Bowls? Is Brady a “choker” instead?

We’ll stick with the 2001 super bowl. You’re right, Brady played well in the final drive. But here’s the reality, the Patriots defense won that game. That Rams offense, at the time, was the best offense ever. The Patriots defense held them to 17 points, forced 3 turnovers, and Ty Law had a pick 6. But the narrative is “Brady is Mr. Clutch!” The narrative and the reality are 2 completely different things. Brady threw for a whopping 145 yards. He’s not the reason they won. And this has been the truth about most of Brady’s career. 

I understand what you’re saying...but it’s hardly one drive.

Consider this:  Brett Favre is 3rd all time for post season passing yards.  He has 5,100.  Not bad at all.  

Brady has 11,200 passing yards

Manning is 2nd at 7,500.  The 3,800 yard gap between Mannning & Brady is the same gap Jim Kelly has over me.  And I’ve never played a single down in my life.

 

Brady has 2,900 yards in just the SB.  That’s good for 19th all time in terms of career playoff passing yards.  

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45 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I understand what you’re saying...but it’s hardly one drive.

Consider this:  Brett Favre is 3rd all time for post season passing yards.  He has 5,100.  Not bad at all.  

Brady has 11,200 passing yards

Manning is 2nd at 7,500

 

Brady has 2,900 yards in just the SB.  That’s good for 19th all time in terms of career playoff passing yards.  

I’m not disputing that Brady is excellent. But I also don’t believe he became “great” until 2007 and he already had 3 rings at that point. He became great over time with hard work, drive, and mastering the system. And I’ll credit him for that. But I just don’t believe he ever becomes the player that he became in 2007 and beyond if not for Belichick. And that’s why I believe Belichick deserves more credit than Brady

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3 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

I’m not disputing that Brady is excellent. But I also don’t believe he became “great” until 2007 and he already had 3 rings at that point. He became great over time with hard work, drive, and mastering the system. And I’ll credit him for that. But I just don’t believe he ever becomes the player that he became in 2007 and beyond if not for Belichick. And that’s why I believe Belichick deserves more credit than Brady

Fair enough

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On 3/8/2019 at 8:59 PM, ⚡Slumerican⚡ said:

Matt Ryan has also played with a loaded stack of skilled position players.. So dont make it out that he hasnt got what he probably asked for.. Look at the names of RB's and WR's this organization has stacked for Ryan.. Plus Ryan has always been compensated on the highest levels.. Imo, Ryan is the player that probably has the most pull in the locker room on how money is allocated.. So hes got what hes probably asked for 

I believe Tom Brady is the only QB that has worked with pretty much basic receivers and RB's for a lot of his career. He's had Gronk and Moss. I can't think of any above average to elite QB that didn't have talent dripping around him.

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58 minutes ago, ltstorm2 said:

I believe Tom Brady is the only QB that has worked with pretty much basic receivers and RB's for a lot of his career. He's had Gronk and Moss. I can't think of any above average to elite QB that didn't have talent dripping around him.

It’s because the system Belichick created doesn’t require it. It requires an excellent defense that Keeps game close and creates lots of turnovers, special teams units that give Brady a short field, diminutive, speedy WRs who can catch short passes and keep sticks moving, a versitily running back who can block and catch a lot of underneath stuff, and most of all a solid interior OL that can hold a pocket for Brady to step up into. 

Anyone that refuses to recognize having very good defense, pro bowl interior OL and Bill Belichicks game planning and inngame adjustemtns is part what makes Brady great is missing the big picture.

Fact is, Brady has had WAY more, MONUMENTALLY more support from his defenses, STs, coaching staff, offensive lines and running games than Ryan has had over his career.  

In 2016 Super Bowl, Ryan faced the Patriots #1 ranked defense, had a good OL but only the 27th ranked defense supporting him and still had Brady beat in Super Bowl. Ryan’s coaching choked and lost the game.

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