Tandy

Draft Opinion - Best DT against the Run

86 posts in this topic

1 minute ago, kiwifalcon said:

Yep he’s so boring to watch he’s that good.

Thats the thing with him when I watch him technically he’s sound and just does his job.

Reminds me of Jake Mathews,If J.Williams falls and proves to be as advertised it’s a home run pick for us.

yep, he is so good that it's boring.   Amazing how good he is getting to those linebackers and blocking downfield.  he would be a great pick if he fell to #14 - depending on who else is available, probably a no-brainer pick if Oliver/Simmons off the board.

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22 minutes ago, g-dawg said:

you need to watch more Jonah Wiilliams film and go back and watch the one you gave me again.    You're wrong.

Difference of opinion. I don’t think he will be an OG that can hold up agst elite DTs at the next level. With that said, that means he is a RT? Take Sambrailos last 4 games as a Falcon, whatsvthe calue prop of keeping Sambrailo vs adding Jonah? I don’t see the same value as say adding an elite DL prospect.

I personally put more value in athleticism in OTs bc edge guys at the next level are so good, you have to have good athleticism and on tape, I don’t see enough from Jonah to “love” him as a Top 15 pick...the combine could prove me wrong...

 

And all of these discussions, etc is what makes it “Tge most, wonderful time, of...the year!”

Edited by Matt_The Iceman_Ryan

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21 minutes ago, kiwifalcon said:

 

Tell you something I learnt about Allen after watching those drills the guys got no plan when rushing the passer.If he thinks he’s going to run down the middle of NFL olineman and expect to be successful yeah good luck with that.

The dude needs to formulate a strategy when rushing.

Best edge guy I saw over those 3 days was LJ Collier that dude was giving olineman fits.Inside and Out the dude could be a sneaky riser in this draft.

Jelks was best, but Collier was also killing it. That's the concern voch also had. He had literally no move outside of bullrush and no plan. If he doesn't win on bullrush he is done for.

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1 hour ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I think you may be judging Allen too harshly.  He really improved with his hand usage and disengaging from blockers last year.  Great instincts, great motor.  Dude had 100 tackles last year as a DE...lol.  Watch this highlight video

 

He's doing that vs. Weak competition.

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8 minutes ago, Matt_The Iceman_Ryan said:

Difference of opinion. I don’t think he will be an OG that can hold up agst elite DTs at the next level. With that said, that means he is a RT? Take Sambrailos last 4 games as a Falcon, whatsvthe calue prop of keeping Sambrailo vs adding Jonah? I don’t see the same value as say adding an elite DL prospect.

I personally put more value in athleticism in OTs bc edge guys at the next level are so good, you have to have good athleticism and on tape, I don’t see enough from Jonah to “love” him as a Top 15 pick...the combine could prove me wrong...

 

And all of these discussions, etc is what makes it “Tge most, wonderful time, of...the year!”

Give me a guy with good technique vs an athlete all day every day. Greg Robinson was supposed to be a superior athlete and the next Orlando Pace, dude blew chunks. Lots of elite athletes come out with horrendous technique and bust.

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3 minutes ago, osiruz said:

He's doing that vs. Weak competition.

It’s all weak compared to the NFL.  I just like his motor and instincts.  100 tackles for a DE is insane.  

We don’t need him so it’s pointless to argue...but someone like Belichick would make him an 8 sack guy who is dominant vs the run

Edited by Falconsin2012
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1 hour ago, Falcanuck said:

Huh? Soaking wet? What does that even mean? Allen is close to 300 pounds if you’re trying to knock his size. I don’t really care either, the Falcons aren’t drafting him unless he lasts until the 2nd, and he won’t. 

Your clearly infatuated and in love with him. I love no prospects, just want the best talent. What I am saying at his best soaking wet he ain't sniffing 5 sacks running at people and without any technique or pass rush plan. He is a run stuffing dend. Dude was getting stifled by the worst OL at the bowl.

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1 minute ago, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s all weak compared to the NFL.  I just like his motor and instincts.  100 tackles for a DE is insane.  

We don’t need him so it’s pointless to argue...but someone like Belichick would make him an 8 sack guy who is dominant vs the run

I disagree, bill b is no magician. What he is good at is featuring players at what they do best, and plucking gems that dumb gms wouldn't resign like Kyle Long, van noy, and ninkovitch.

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18 minutes ago, osiruz said:

I disagree, bill b is no magician. What he is good at is featuring players at what they do best, and plucking gems that dumb gms wouldn't resign like Kyle Long, van noy, and ninkovitch.

He certainly wouldn’t take him 1st round.  And Belichick’s magic was in convincing the rest of the NFL that he was in fact a magician.  Makes coaches like Carroll, Quinn & Shanny make stupid decisions they’d otherwise not make

Edited by Falconsin2012
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2 minutes ago, E. T. said:

That top frame was the good 'ol 3 man rush! He might work out?

We don’t need him, but he is a very good prospect IMO

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20 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s all weak compared to the NFL.  I just like his motor and instincts.  100 tackles for a DE is insane.  

We don’t need him so it’s pointless to argue...but someone like Belichick would make him an 8 sack guy who is dominant vs the run

https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/scout-s-eye-wrs-dts-shine-at-senior-bowl

 

Two pass rushers, Oregon’s Jalen Jelks and Boston College’s Zach Allen ran a nice twist stunt to get home on Chris Lindstrom and Dalton Risner. Allen got such a push up the field that it forced Lindstrom and Risner to account for him. Jelks then took advantage of the situation by quickly working around the double-team to attack the pocket. Allen might not be much of an edge rusher, but when you put him at defensive tackle he tends to make things happen.

Would not mind Zach Allen at all. Dude is a beast.

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1 minute ago, Falconsin2012 said:

We don’t need him, but he is a very good prospect IMO

I agree. He has potential, but gotta bring more than a bullrush to the next level.

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3 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/scout-s-eye-wrs-dts-shine-at-senior-bowl

 

Two pass rushers, Oregon’s Jalen Jelks and Boston College’s Zach Allen ran a nice twist stunt to get home on Chris Lindstrom and Dalton Risner. Allen got such a push up the field that it forced Lindstrom and Risner to account for him. Jelks then took advantage of the situation by quickly working around the double-team to attack the pocket. Allen might not be much of an edge rusher, but when you put him at defensive tackle he tends to make things happen.

Would not mind Zach Allen at all. Dude is a beast.

Nice...but they do say he is looking stiff on the edge.  He does lack bend...strong as an ox though and elite run defender

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1 minute ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Nice...but they do say he is looking stiff on the edge.  He does lack bend...strong as an ox though and elite run defender

He’s not the most graceful guy out there, but he may be one of the strongest. He’s probably guy the safest floor, at the very worst we have a very good run defender. I think Quinn could do wonders with him. Plus his versatility would be an amazing tool to have for our defense. 

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10 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

He’s not the most graceful guy out there, but he may be one of the strongest. He’s probably guy the safest floor, at the very worst we have a very good run defender. I think Quinn could do wonders with him. Plus his versatility would be an amazing tool to have for our defense. 

Bottom line, nobody has a clue about any of these prospects. It’s all calculated gambling.  Allen is just as likely to be a Pro Bowler as he is to bust.  

It makes for healthy debate and conversation though

Edited by Falconsin2012
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3 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Bottom line, nobody has a clue about any of these prospects. It’s all calculated gambling.  Allen is just as likely to be a Pro Bowler as he is to bust.  Good for healthy debate and conversation though

I agree, no player is a guaranteed home run pick. There’s some tape of Allen against T. Lawrence. 

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1 minute ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

I agree, no player is a guaranteed home run pick. There’s some tape of Allen against T. Lawrence. 

Yeah, he was dominant against Clemson.  Swatted TL pass right back into his hands and proceeded to sack him once Lawrence foolishly caught it

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If Allen struggled against so so lineman in the drills I’m struggling to see it translate at the next level.

If you do decide to look at a guy like this 2nd round down.

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2 hours ago, Artys Arryn said:

I think 1T is probably a good position to chase in FA. The market simply doesn't value them and we can pick up a space heater for cheap since we do need that for obvious running downs. But if the thought of Grady and Ed Oliver in base D doesn't get you excited, I don't know what will.

Me too. Here are a few DTs that could make it to free agency:

  • Malcom Brown, Johnathan Hankins, Danny Shelton, Jordan Phillips, Bennie Logan, Ndamukong Suh, Sheldon Richardson, Kyle Williams

I would go hard for Malcom Brown. Billy Check won't match. Young run stopper that could play here for years.

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6 hours ago, g-dawg said:

We aren't taking Dexter Lawrence at #14 - I will almost guarantee that.  The DTackle needs to be a good run stopper but you don't burn a #14 pick on a run-stopping specialist that will only be on the field 30-40% of the time.

Especially since.we.drafted one last year

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4 hours ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Me too. Here are a few DTs that could make it to free agency:

  • Malcom Brown, Johnathan Hankins, Danny Shelton, Jordan Phillips, Bennie Logan, Ndamukong Suh, Sheldon Richardson, Kyle Williams

I would go hard for Malcom Brown. Billy Check won't match. Young run stopper that could play here for years.

DQ passed on Hankins, Logan & Richardson twice already.

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8 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Ed Oliver vs Oklahoma’s vaunted OL in his first game as a collegiate player.  7 tackles, 3 TFL & 2 sacks.  All that despite double and triple teams

 

Yea I'm a Sooners fan and he killed is that. In fairness that was 2016 and our Oline was vaunted but still good.  

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8 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

It’s a fact.  A study was done between 2010-2015.  It found that outside of round 1 & 2, the most likely spot to find an All Pro is UDFA.  It was 11% of the All Pro selections were UDFA’s

If you think about why that is, it’s often guys with bad character/attitude/arrests who turn their lives around and small guys from no-name schools that go to great teams. 

Wes Welker was a nobody before he got Brady. 

Tbh these sample sizes are also way too small. How many all-pros are there in the history of football? Like 500-1000 That’s tiny. 

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9 hours ago, RLD said:

The Falcons need to draft an OT with the 14th/ pick. Williams or Little or the Wisconsin tackle. Best one available, anyway. Falcons 1st. pick should be a offensive tackle. If Alford is the Falcons starter on defense next season, they are in trouble.

I won't be unhappy with RT, G or a run stuffing DT or DE.    We need to address all of these things in the offseason

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