gazoo

If Matty Ice had exact game Brees did, this place would be ready to lynch him

53 posts in this topic

Matt has been money in the Playoffs the last several games.  The last time Matt threw an INT in the Playoffs was back in 2012.  That's 5 straight Playoff games without a single INT. 

You might be wondering the last time Brees had a Playoff game without throwing any INT's.  It was back in 2013.  He's thrown picks in each of his last 4 Playoff games.

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16 hours ago, Malachore said:

Said it in the game thread.

Brees is overrated. 

He's actually underrated. Routinely gets overshadowed by Rodgers.

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****, Brady only has 2 TD's compared to 2 INT's this season in the Playoffs, and he's getting all of the credit for getting them back to the Super Bowl. 

Sony Michel has been New England's MVP thus far in the Playoffs.  He leads all NFL players with 5 TD's in only 2 games along with 121 rushing yards per game, 4.6 ypc.  There are no QB's with 5 passing TD's yet.

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#1 brees has always been a dawg qb

#2 he was hit during the throw causing the ball to float resulting in the pick. He didn’t just throw a pick. 

#3 Brees isn’t and never had been captain check down. He does like EVERY great qb ever did and went where the defense wasn’t. He always found the matchup and exposed it. Same thing Matt does. Just became you hate a team doesn’t mean they don’t have great players.

 

I hate the saints but they have players that are absolutey awesome. Brees, Kamara, Jordan, Thomas, Ingram, The line. That’s something I’ve never done just because of disdain for a team. Couldn’t stand the bucs but Sapp was awesome. Wished we had him. Never liked the pats but Brady is awesome. It’s ok to admit other teams have great players. 

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LOL at the people who are some how off talking about HOF and overrated this and that. Way to fail.

The thread and the Point is, Matt Ryan would be and has been blamed for LESS in the playoffs by ATL fans and this board. The veracity cannot even be argued. It's true.

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18 hours ago, THEHEADCOACH said:

Truth! Heck Matt Ryan played better than Drew Brees ever played in a playoff game, and people were still ready to Lynch him . 

Indeed. Ryan has absolutely killed it in his playoff play, his numbers prove it.  

This nonsense about “if RyanZ had a riNg” stuff is foolish, implying Ryan do3snt have a ring becuase Ryan hasn’t played well enough. 

If Ryan’s support was good enough Ryan would have multiple rings. 

Brees and Brady have had brilliant coaching, brilliant game planning, brilliant play designs, better clock management, better support over the long term.

If Ryan had Shanny as his OC since 2008 Ryan the nonsense about him not having a ring wouldn’t exist, because he would.  If Ryan had Bellichick or Sean Peyton as head coach his entire career he’d also have rings.

Fans don’t have a clue how important it is to have a mastermind running your offense when you have a QB like Ryan. It’s an enormous difference than going from one average to above average Coordinator to another throughout your career.

Ryan had the Patriots beat. He screamed at sidelines “run the $#@ ball” when we had them beat. We instead kept passing and it let the Patriots back in the game. Shanny will never make that mistake again and I pray DQ won’t either.  Shanny had never been 8n that place before, it was an epic mistake due to lack of experience in that situation. Coaching cost Ryan that ring, not Ryan.

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18 hours ago, gazoo said:

I can’t help but recall Ryan playing close to perfect games in the playoffs, yet still being blamed exclusively for a loss.

Brees was flat out outplayed by Goff today when it mattered. Brees’ QBR was 60.1 and Goff’s was 75.1. When it was time to step up and make plays, Goff stepped up and not sure where Brees was.

I recall reading so much garbage here after a playoff loss where it was Ryan’s fault we lost, he can’t elevate the team, doesn’t step up in big games, being picked apart for missing an open receiver or throwing a pick.

Yet we see Brees blow the game today by missing an open receiver down field that would have changed the game. He’s lucky not to have been picked off on that terrible throw.  Brees also took two sacks instead of throwing it away, another nonsense criticism of Ryan, and let’s not forget that interception Brees threw.  Man, Ryan throws a pick in a playoff game, even though Brady throws pick 6s in Super Bowls, and Ryan is blamed exclusively for the loss. 

And don’t tell me about officiating. Matt Ryan has had to deal with all kinds of terrible officiating in playoff losses and wins. Roddy White was all but mugged in 2012 playoff game where we would have advanced to Super Bowl had he caught that.

 

Truth!!!

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3 hours ago, AtlantaFanatic said:

I like Kamara as a RB myself and their Oline was bad for years and it just now started getting good. Im just saying there are better teams to want to emulate. 

Their offensive lines are one of the best in the NFL. From left tackle to right tackle you have guys who could start for any other team in the NFL.  Thats because they invested 2 first rounders, got a LT in Armstead in the draft and got Warford and Unger as FA's.  All of those guys could make a pro bowl 

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Brees has looked very mediocre the last six or seven games of the season... anytime he threw over 15 yards yesterday the ball was no where nowhere where it needed to be.

 I guess what bothers me is the fact that he and Ryan has played in pretty much the same era yet Ryan has had a superior first ten years of his career... and the thing is always "oh it's the era that He plays in".

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27 minutes ago, R_The_Great said:

Their offensive lines are one of the best in the NFL. From left tackle to right tackle you have guys who could start for any other team in the NFL.  Thats because they invested 2 first rounders, got a LT in Armstead in the draft and got Warford and Unger as FA's.  All of those guys could make a pro bowl 

... and yet they cannot run on one of the most poorest run defenses in the NFL

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 and they didn't do a very pretty good job of protecting him either... Brees was rushed quite a bit... and honestly ever since the Thanksgiving game their offensiveline has not played near to level that it was playing at earlier in the season... some of  that is injury-related but if we don't get the excuse of injuries on the offensive line neither do they

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3 hours ago, JerseyNo12 said:

He's actually underrated. Routinely gets overshadowed by Rodgers.

That doesn't mean he's underrated, Rodgers gets too much love too.

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32 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

... and yet they cannot run on one of the most poorest run defenses in the NFL

who was that?  Rams?  Rams held Elliot down for the most part if i remember correctly.  Saints offensive line is one of the best

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20 hours ago, Vandy said:

No he’s not. He didn’t play well today, but he’s one of the best all-time.

I will not go so far as to say he is overrated, but I will not agree that he is one of the best of all time. Titles aside, that's reserved for QBs like Dan Marino, Joe Montana, Peyton Manning, Otto Graham, and Tom Brady. I would place Drew Brees in the next tier along with Aaron Rodgers (if Ryan keeps it up, I'd place him here). 

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20 hours ago, NeonDeion said:

I’ve never blamed Matt Ryan ever for any of our playoff games. Not sure why anyone who actually watched the games would. If he had a Top 5 D, he’d have multiple rings by now. Some people just don’t understand the team game aspect. 

Add the Pats O-line and we'd be set. Brady didn't have to hardly move off his mark at all. And Houston basically gave him a shoulder pad tap and they throw a  FREAKIN FLAG!

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27 minutes ago, R_The_Great said:

who was that?  Rams?  Rams held Elliot down for the most part if i remember correctly.  Saints offensive line is one of the best

Do you know how many of the 10 starting offensive linemen in the Superbowl were first round picks???

Zero

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22 hours ago, gazoo said:

Roddy White was all but mugged in 2012 playoff game where we would have advanced to Super Bowl had he caught that.

That's not true. Roddy was short of the line to gain, so even if he had caught the ball it would still have been a turnover on downs. Bad decision by Ryan, who on that play didn't seem like he was looking at anyone but Roddy.

2012 is just a bad comparison, because while Ryan wasn't solely to blame for the loss in the NFCCG, he made critical errors in key moments. The defense wasn't great, but they gave the offense multiple chances to put the game away. Zero points in the second half with three turnovers (one on downs) is just a bad look. 

2016 on the other hand was definitely more the product of bad coaching than anything else. Ryan played a near flawless Super Bowl, and made what should have been the play of the game scrambling to the right and finding Julio for a heroic sideline catch. 

Ryan has come a long way. He's much better now than he was in 2012 (which is saying a lot). His decision making (particularly post snap), pocket presence and movement, and mechanics have all improved significantly and that's why we've seen a considerable jump in his numbers from 2016 onward. As @TheDirtyWordII pointed out in a thread, he's past the point of needing OCs to make all the decisions now.

Ryan has always been a smart guy, but I think early on he was given too much autonomy. Kyle Shanahan did Matt a favor by dialing that back some which allowed Matt to, in a way, reinvent himself by seeing how a creative and extremely meticulous play caller attacks a defense. With that added experience, Ryan's skills have improved significantly. 

Now I've done all that rambling to really make the point that Brees will always be given the benefit of the doubt because he's a Super Bowl MVP. Up until last Sunday, Brees was undefeated in that dome in January. Ryan has been on the wrong end of too many historic playoff losses to be given that same consideration--unfair as it may be, that's just how it is. 

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  @JerseyNo12, it seems to be lacking any proportion of norms is my issue with it.

Where you say “Ryan played a near flawless Super Bowl, and made what should have been the play of the game scrambling to the right and finding Julio for a heroic sideline catch”, I would like for you to show me a QB who played perfectly every single snap in a Super Bowl. It never happens. You make it sound like playing anything less than perfect makes Ryan a lesser QB than the great ones who apparently you feel do play perfectly. 

Ryan absolutely crushed it in the 2012 playoffs, he went up against the two best defenses in the NFL, on the road, and scored way more points than they had been giving up on average that year, yet he was raked over the coals here and blamed for the loss simply because he didn’t play perfectly. You are wrong about the Roddy play.

The best QBs in NFL history win Super Bowls without playing perfectly.  

Brady throws on average over 1 interception per playoff game in his history. He threw a pick 6 in the Super Bowl we played him. Just curious if you believe throwing a pick 6 in a Super Bowl is a mistake? Peyton Manning also threw a pick 6 in a Super Bowl. 

Drew Brees and Peyton Manning are tied for #3 in NFL history for the most pick 6s thrown at 27. Mistake? 

Your last paragraph above is riddled with rationalization and double standards.

People who single out Ryan for imperfect play during a playoff loss blaming him for the loss, despite him playing just as good as the very best of the best play in the playoffs is my issue.

 

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2 hours ago, falconsd56 said:

Do you know how many of the 10 starting offensive linemen in the Superbowl were first round picks???

Zero

What's your point? Don't invest in offensive line ?

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21 minutes ago, R_The_Great said:

What's your point? Don't invest in offensive line ?

My point is the teams that all the fans fawn over like the Saints and the Cowboys they are sitting at home... we don't need to spend a high draft pick on a lineman to have a good offense one

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This is very true. Brees did nothing the 2nd half and threw it up for the game losing INT. Ryan would be crucified 

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3 hours ago, JerseyNo12 said:

That's not true. Roddy was short of the line to gain, so even if he had caught the ball it would still have been a turnover on downs. Bad decision by Ryan, who on that play didn't seem like he was looking at anyone but Roddy.

2012 is just a bad comparison, because while Ryan wasn't solely to blame for the loss in the NFCCG, he made critical errors in key moments. The defense wasn't great, but they gave the offense multiple chances to put the game away. Zero points in the second half with three turnovers (one on downs) is just a bad look. 

2016 on the other hand was definitely more the product of bad coaching than anything else. Ryan played a near flawless Super Bowl, and made what should have been the play of the game scrambling to the right and finding Julio for a heroic sideline catch. 

Ryan has come a long way. He's much better now than he was in 2012 (which is saying a lot). His decision making (particularly post snap), pocket presence and movement, and mechanics have all improved significantly and that's why we've seen a considerable jump in his numbers from 2016 onward. As @TheDirtyWordII pointed out in a thread, he's past the point of needing OCs to make all the decisions now.

Ryan has always been a smart guy, but I think early on he was given too much autonomy. Kyle Shanahan did Matt a favor by dialing that back some which allowed Matt to, in a way, reinvent himself by seeing how a creative and extremely meticulous play caller attacks a defense. With that added experience, Ryan's skills have improved significantly. 

Now I've done all that rambling to really make the point that Brees will always be given the benefit of the doubt because he's a Super Bowl MVP. Up until last Sunday, Brees was undefeated in that dome in January. Ryan has been on the wrong end of too many historic playoff losses to be given that same consideration--unfair as it may be, that's just how it is. 

Wrong. Roddy ran beyond the line to gain and was mugged,held, then push forward pass the first down line before the ball arrived. If he had not been interfered with, he would have ran across the field from the LBer and beyond the line to gain. That's why the LBer grabbed and knocked him forward. He knew Roddy would pull away from him. So he grabbed. The flag should have been thrown, it was Matt's only option, he made the right read. Dirk koetter even did a film review by of that play and showed Matt made the right read, because everyone said Tony G was wide open and he wasn't. He came open after the ball was released, before that he was bracketed, and Matt had to get rid of it. The inference knocking Roddy off his route is why it didn't work.

That no call ended the game and decided the winner.

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Yep. Ive always said, if we had traded our 1st pick for Brady and Ryan had been drafted by the Patriots, our history to this point is probably the same. Only difference, it would have been even more embarrassing, when we got beat in the 2016 super bowl. Because of then it would be the guy ,we passed on drafting ,coming back and beating us. Matt Ryan is the best quarterback, this franchise has had ,and probably will have for a long time. If he has spent his whole career with Sean Payton, everyone would be drooling over him now. Matt's always had a garbage  oline and I'm the defenses were embarrassing. Having a good system for your players and keeping them in it for a long time, that's how you build a winner.

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1 hour ago, falconsd56 said:

My point is the teams that all the fans fawn over like the Saints and the Cowboys they are sitting at home... we don't need to spend a high draft pick on a lineman to have a good offense one

So stay with Wes Schweitzer and Ben Garland?  Get guys like Ty Sambrilo and Beadles?  Your completely wrong in the idea that you don't need to invest in your offensive line

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2 hours ago, gazoo said:

  @JerseyNo12, it seems to be lacking any proportion of norms is my issue with it.

Where you say “Ryan played a near flawless Super Bowl, and made what should have been the play of the game scrambling to the right and finding Julio for a heroic sideline catch”, I would like for you to show me a QB who played perfectly every single snap in a Super Bowl. It never happens. You make it sound like playing anything less than perfect makes Ryan a lesser QB than the great ones who apparently you feel do play perfectly. 

Ryan absolutely crushed it in the 2012 playoffs, he went up against the two best defenses in the NFL, on the road, and scored way more points than they had been giving up on average that year, yet he was raked over the coals here and blamed for the loss simply because he didn’t play perfectly. You are wrong about the Roddy play.

The best QBs in NFL history win Super Bowls without playing perfectly.  

Brady throws on average over 1 interception per playoff game in his history. He threw a pick 6 in the Super Bowl we played him. Just curious if you believe throwing a pick 6 in a Super Bowl is a mistake? Peyton Manning also threw a pick 6 in a Super Bowl. 

Drew Brees and Peyton Manning are tied for #3 in NFL history for the most pick 6s thrown at 27. Mistake? 

Your last paragraph above is riddled with rationalization and double standards.

People who single out Ryan for imperfect play during a playoff loss blaming him for the loss, despite him playing just as good as the very best of the best play in the playoffs is my issue.

 

I'm not really sure how you got the idea that I believe that Ryan is a lesser QB because he wasn't perfect. I merely stated that he played a near flawless Super Bowl to reinforce the point that bad coaching ultimately lost that game. That Ryan to Julio connection put them in prime position to win the game and the coaches inexplicably refused to keep running the ball to burn clock and stay in FG range. I mean dude, he finished with a 146+ passer rating and for much of the game he had a perfect passer rating, so it's not even just an opinion, it's a statistical fact. 

In 2012, Ryan played great in the NFCCG, in the first half. Then it was three turnovers in the second half, and Ryan absolutely had to own the fumbled snap. That's an unforced error that showed a lack of focus. It's not just about how you start, but more importantly how you finish. The reason Brady is widely considered the GOAT is because the guy is a closer. Most teams have to play almost flawlessly against the Patriots (especially in the playoffs) because this guy just refuses to stay down. He can play like trash in the first half, but when the game is on the line the guy just gets in the zone and the team feeds off of that. Falcons fans remember the pick-6 he threw in the Super Bowl. Everyone else remembers how Brady led the offense to 31 unanswered points to win the game in OT (the irony of that number being had we kicked the FG, we likely win 31-28).

Most people's criticism of Ryan, and Romo, Rivers, and Peyton Manning for that matter have little to do with their ability to put up numbers. It has more to do with the question of what did they do in crunch time when your team had to score to win the game. Playoffs are where legacies are made.

Ryan to me proved in the Super Bowl that he could win the big game with that throw to Julio to put them at the 22 yard line. If we won that game, people wouldn't be talking about how Ryan's stats for the game. No, they would be talking about how Ryan stepped up in the clutch and fired a laser on the run to Julio to set up the game winning FG.

What's Joe "Cool" Montana mostly known for? The games in which the 9ers demolished their opposition or the games in which he delivered in the clutch?

 

 

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