Falcons Fan MVP

Do you think Matt Ryan is better than Peyton Manning, Dan Marino and Jim Kelly?

186 posts in this topic

9 hours ago, Power I said:

I've seen Matt Ryan and Peyton Manning mentioned in the same sentence, literally never seen his name mentioned with the other two.

Its only in relation to people saying he’ll never be a Hall or Famer because he hasn’t (yet) won a Super Bowl. 

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9 hours ago, Falcons Fan MVP said:

3 quarterbacks Matt Ryan has been compared to the most are Peyton Manning, Dan Marino and Jim Kelly. How good is Matt Ryan compared to these 3 quarterbacks in your opinion?  I think Matt is better than Jim Kelly and slightly better than Marino but not quite as good as Peyton Manning yet. Your thoughts?

1


Stop talking about Matt Ryan stop comparing him to superior QB  have won super bowls. 

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18 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

Its only in relation to people saying he’ll never be a Hall or Famer because he hasn’t (yet) won a Super Bowl. 

oh why do you think we will win next year

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16 minutes ago, 81KJW said:

oh why do you think we will win next year

Recite for me the part where I said we’d win next year. 

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1 hour ago, JDaveG said:

Its only in relation to people saying he’ll never be a Hall or Famer because he hasn’t (yet) won a Super Bowl. 

Sure Ryan has stats, but people need to remember they also compare candidates to their peers. It's a popularity contest and that's where Ryan will fall short. When they look back on his career, they'll say Manning, Manning, Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Roethlisberger, Rivers, and Wilson were better and now he'll have to contend with the young guys on the back end of his career like Mahomes, Luck, Goff, Mayfield, etc. The perception, right or wrong, could be that he was the 10th best or worse at his position in his era and that won't get him in. 

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9 hours ago, robertap said:

Why I think that when Ryan's career is over, he will belong in the conversation:

Matt Ryan has been Iron Man - He has missed two games in his career despite taking some serious hits.  Dude gets up, dusts himself off, and goes right back to it.  He consistently puts up around 4000 yards and 30 TD's.  If his body can continue to hold up, he's going to surpass all of these guys in NFL totals.  He probably won't break any of their single season records, but he has already been consistent for longer than most of them.

Marino's career shot out like a cannon.  5000 yards and 48 TD's in his first year as a starter.  That was, statistically, his best year.  People remember him for his first few years in the league, when he was lights out.  After that, his career was still good, but it wasn't consistent.

Kelly had a great 4 years stretch with a really fantastic team.  Outside of those 4 years, he was a top 10 QB.  If Ryan is ever given a great team to play with, perhaps we'll see a good stretch of years from him.  As it stands, Matt is simply a top 5/10 QB every year.

The big difference between Manning and Ryan is touchdowns.  Manning consistently put up 4000 yards and 30 TD's every year.  He had two seasons where he threw over 40 TD's.  (49 and 55)  Ryan hasn't thrown 40 TD's yet.  Manning's best year was his 16th in the league, with a team that gave him everything that he needed to succeed.  Perhaps, one day, Ryan will be given that deal.  Until then, he'll just be that model of consistency... 4000 yards and 30 TD's.

I don't think that Ryan is, "better," than any of these guys.  I think that when his career is over, he will be in the conversation.

Marino was doing what QBs do today, which is considered god-like today, way back when the game was completely different.

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8 hours ago, ChickenBiscuit said:

No, he should be compared to Tony Romo and Phillip Rivers. Two very good, and very comparable QBs.

This!

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7 hours ago, Falcons Fan MVP said:

People compare quarterbacks all the time. 

And it's stupid. 

Put Ryan on Bill Belichick's teams.  Boom- he's holding probably three rings at least.

Tom Brady as a Cleveland Brown for the past twenty years...he doesn't even sniff the playoffs. 

Put Archie Manning on the 1970s Steelers.  Four trophies in six years, and people would be calling him the GOAT.

Comparing individuals in football is pointless because no two qbs will ever be in identical environments. 

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Relating the QB conversation, when comparing QB’s in different eras, I do think you need to use a sliding scale of sorts.

So consider how Patrick Mahomes just burst onto the scene, very spectacularly in 2018. He threw for 5097 yards and 50 TD’s.  Marino 34 years ago went for 5084/48.  That was back in the day when 4000 yards was a big deal, heading into the 1984 season, there had only been 7 such seasons.  Quite frankly, that’s why Fouts is in the HOF...he had 2 of those seasons combining for over 9500 yards in 80/81.  But those two guys were ‘visionaries’ of sorts with regard to QB play.

Ryan won’t ever exceed Manning IMO unless he wins 3 SB’s.  There’s too much love for him.  But I suspect he’ll wind up with more yards than Manning when all is said and done.

...and Kelly’s legacy is unique not necessarily because of his production, but those 4 straight SB’s (and he was the key driving force for each of them). Brady even hasn’t done that.

Ryan’s legacy right now feels like a guy who hit 35 HR’s every season for 17-18 seasons and had that one 55 HR season.  But right now, he’s only played 11 seasons.  He obviously has more football to be played, and I think his HOF case is strengthening.  Not there yet...

Geneaut and Halcon-1 like this

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Lol hail no , He is not on Peyton’s or Marino’s level. This board is kinda slowly starting to mix reality with dreams. 

Outta touch and foolish, like the guy said Delusional...... AF

Edited by caponine

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How many HoF QB's would let there team give up a 28-3 lead in a Superbowl? Yes its a team sport but if the QB does his job when the offense is on the field,  audible at right time, read the blitz and lead the team, no HoF QB have ever lost a Superbowl like that, and no HoF will ever lose one that way, remember its a Superbowl, and NO he is not better than those guys.

Edited by Bartholomew

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14 hours ago, octoslash said:

Stupid question.  This isn't tennis.  It's a team sport. 

Indeed. Back away from the history books, Tom Brady, you were just a mediocrity who got to feast off Belichick's genius.

Jimsmusic™ and octoslash like this

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14 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

I love Ryan, and even with SB wins in 2012 & 2016 I’d still say no to all but Kelly.  Ryan is on Kelly’s level

I think if we have won those two SB’s .....as we should have....the perception of Ryan would be entirely different. But bottom line, we didn’t. So he’s therefore not in the conversation. 

BTW, Mahomes is the QB who may end up being compared with Marino. Two best arms I’ve ever seen. 

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I like the points people already made.

#1 It's unfair to compare new generation players with older generation players. It's a completely different game with the rule changes. 

#2 The franchise a player plays for makes a difference. Like someone said above, Tom Brady on the Browns has a completely different outcome. 

I will say this. Watching Peyton Manning play at such a high level was amazing. At his best he played as well as anyone ever has. 

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1 hour ago, octoslash said:

And it's stupid. 

Put Ryan on Bill Belichick's teams.  Boom- he's holding probably three rings at least.

Tom Brady as a Cleveland Brown for the past twenty years...he doesn't even sniff the playoffs. 

Put Archie Manning on the 1970s Steelers.  Four trophies in six years, and people would be calling him the GOAT.

Comparing individuals in football is pointless because no two qbs will ever be in identical environments. 

I agree.

Hence, "TEAM" sport and why I never call players on a team sport ELITE. I don't understand why people don't see this. This is not tennis or golf. The QB can't run his own routes and catch his own passes at the same time or rush his own hand-offs. He can't block for himself or call his own plays every single play or coach his teammates or game plan every week against every team.

Plus, as you put it, a bunch of things have to fall in line in the universe. There are too many factors and variables to consider. Brady on the Browns would probably be another Marino. Ryan on the Patriots would probably be what Brady is now. The debate has always been futile to me. 

Edited by Halcon-1
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6 minutes ago, Vandy said:

I think if we have won those two SB’s .....as we should have....the perception of Ryan would be entirely different. But bottom line, we didn’t. So he’s therefore not in the conversation. 

BTW, Mahomes is the QB who may end up being compared with Marino. Two best arms I’ve ever seen. 

Marino with mobility.  Scary thought.  I don’t think Mahomes is the sharpest tool in the shed, though.  Belichick will fool him twice today.  2 INT’s will be the difference as NE advances to #6

Edited by Falconsin2012
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Joe Namath threw the most beautiful passes anyone's ever seen.  Did that make him better than Dan Marino? 

Eli Manning won two super bowls, so he must be a better quarterback than Matt Ryan?

Quarterbacks are just impossible to rank.   

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7 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Marino with mobility.  Scary thought.  I don’t think Mahomes is the sharpest tool in the shed, though.  Belichick will fool him twice today.  2 INT’s will be the difference as NE advances to #6

If true, it will be Similar reason Marino never could win the big games, which is never talked about. It’s the reason why he feel so far in that draft. 

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31 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Marino with mobility.  Scary thought.  I don’t think Mahomes is the sharpest tool in the shed, though.  Belichick will fool him twice today.  2 INT’s will be the difference as NE advances to #6

#9 . . . and I agree. 

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