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TD on our CB position

75 posts in this topic

58 minutes ago, Monolith2001 said:

Ha.  No.  He was a bit rough early on trying to make plays as opposed to being the safety but got better and graded out well (I'm not a hardcore PFF but I accept their ballpark).  I've explained it as I think Rico is the better FS (he should be, he's been doing it longer) but Kazee is the better football player.

Sure he got fancy interceptions and some insta gratification for board members / hood ornament turnovers. But he was Horrid / Atrocious in coverage and almost allowed wr to get behind him a few times each game. I want Kazee at FS as much as I would like to have my teeth pulled.

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41 minutes ago, ⚡Slumerican⚡ said:

Kazee shined in a group of rocks.. Until I see him play with decent guys around him my verdict is still open.. Duke, Alford, and the bum from New England would make me look good 

He tied for the league lead in INTs. You don't do that by accident.

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41 minutes ago, ⚡Slumerican⚡ said:

Kazee shined in a group of rocks.. Until I see him play with decent guys around him my verdict is still open.. Duke, Alford, and the bum from New England would make me look good 

He got interceptions but his coverage was god aweful.

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0 picks by our top 2 corners. That in itself is a reason to go after someone. If you get a shot at a top flight playmaking corner, you take it. Look at the Saints turnaround on defense with Lattimore. The teams that slowed down the Saints had a talented top corner which allowed them to roll coverage to help the other corners. Teams are not afraid to attack our corners in 50-50 balls because they know that the worst case scenario is an incompletion.

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Lets be clear here.  Kazee was drafted as a CB but was drafted to be a Safety.  He does not have the long speed or agility to play man in the slot regularly. He is a safety in the NFL.  The place where CBs who cant cut it go.  I say that to make the point that when we play Nickel or Big Nickel, he will likely be in a position to play zone where he thrives.  He is a read and react S with great ball skills and incredible acceleration.  That's what he does best.  Asking him to guard C. Beasley, Julian Edelman types from the slot is not his thing.  Alford would be more equipped to do that with his speed, agility and quickness. We still need an upgrade at NB.  Poole is physical and better in zone,  Kazee the same.  Alford and Trufant can cover slot guys better but one of them is likely gone and Oliver isn't ready to step up outside.  Id be ok with CB in 3rd but not before.

Edited by Stryka
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54 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Trufant was the 90th (not exact) ranked corner mid year and made drastic improvements.  Finished the year #35 and top-10 the last quarter of the year.  12 pass deflections, 66 tackles.  All good signs heading into 2019.

Would love to restructure his contract, though

I honestly don't trust pff or any of those grading sources. The eye test vs the grades they hand out do not go hand in hand.

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Psychology.  Could it be you are being more subjective than objective?  Rose colored glasses?  Im glad that you aren't just a stat monger but our eyes are so biased once we make up our minds.  Trufant played better 2nd half of the year.  Quinn, Manuel, all would state that.

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2 hours ago, FalconFanSince1969 said:

People STILL not understanding what the loss of both starting safeties can do to the CBS.... They play as a unit. Not individuals. Take half the unit away and last year is what you get. Trufant isn't as good as he was made out to be, but both Tru and Alford aren't as bad as they're made out to be either. Bet we don't draft a cb til the mid rounds. 

Add to that legitimately needing a pass rush and improved DL. I'm not wild about our CBs, but it's hard to know how good or bad they are based on injuries in the secondary and LB corps and a down year for the DL.

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3 hours ago, FentayeJones said:

Here is TD's actual quote from the interview:

On need to add cornerbacks: ‘You can never have too many corners’

Dimitroff was asked if there was a need to add more cornerbacks and, in short, the Falcons general manager said, “it’s another strong consideration for us” and “you can never have too many corners.”

“I think last year we came in thinking very highly of our secondary,” Dimitroff said. “We know that (Damontae) Kazee has done a really good job for us as well. Where he situates on the field will depend on what we do in the draft and/or in free agency at that position. Again, depth at that position is vital.”

https://www.atlantafalcons.com/news/thomas-dimitroff-on-the-sense-of-urgency-to-win-now-we-know-that-it-is-about-thi

Boom goes the dynamite!!!

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2 hours ago, Monolith2001 said:

Not opposed but my priority is as follows:

OL > DL > CB > LB > S > TE > RB > QB2 > WR > ST

I’m agreed except for S being behind TE and RB. And RB being up in the air based on my lack of knowing Freeman’s prognosis & (the off chance TeCo wants to come back cheaper than max FA deal but unlikely)

Benkert probably isn’t (yet?) ready but studying behind Matt and Matt for a year already can’t have hurt his chances at being a backup this coming year. I like his prospects more than the Grayson kid we had before.

Can’t wait to see how FA unfolds.

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1 hour ago, osiruz said:

He got interceptions but his coverage was god aweful.

Not so much his coverage but not being in Rico’s level as a FS helping the secondary be set presnap. Remember how often our dudes were scrambling and not communicating? Team D matters more than skill alone. Facts.

Also:

Tackling, blown coverages just below that as he did improve and make those game changing INTs. Doesn’t erase his mistakes. Not as bad as some think or as good as people spamming his turnovers. Wound up with an average season in his overall play with great ball hawk skills helping create turnovers.

For the record:

If Kazee improves enough and doesn’t stick at CB, it’ll be hard for Rico to hold the job without more turnovers. Rico may then become a slot guy instead. But for base D I like Rico. Our CBs suffered from this and were not comfortable all year; except for Tru mostly down the stretch. He came around. Rocky was still being a bit rocky. ;)

Edited by Ergo Proxy

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55 minutes ago, Jpg428gggg said:

0 picks by our top 2 corners. That in itself is a reason to go after someone. If you get a shot at a top flight playmaking corner, you take it. Look at the Saints turnaround on defense with Lattimore. The teams that slowed down the Saints had a talented top corner which allowed them to roll coverage to help the other corners. Teams are not afraid to attack our corners in 50-50 balls because they know that the worst case scenario is an incompletion.

They led the league with 13 dropped INT’s if I remember right

Edited by Falconsin2012

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2 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

13* but who is counting anyway?:ninja: They sure weren’t!!:lol:

Congratulations Alford/Trufant, while you earned no season ending bonuses, you aren’t walking away empty handed.  Quite the opposite.  This is your new best friend.  You’re welcome

f5.jpg

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2 hours ago, Monolith2001 said:

Not opposed but my priority is as follows:

OL > DL > CB > LB > S > TE > RB > QB2 > WR > ST

Same for me. Heavily invest draft/FA on Guards, RT, DT, and DE. As for CB, find a replacement for Alford (stuck with Trufant because of his contract), see what Oliver can do, flexible with Kazee as he can also play nickel.

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46 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Not so much his coverage but not being in Rico’s level as a FS helping the secondary be set presnap. Remember how often our dudes were scrambling and not communicating? Team D matters more than skill alone. Facts.

Also:

Tackling, blown coverages just below that as he did improve and make those game changing INTs. Doesn’t erase his mistakes. Not as bad as some think or as good as people spamming his turnovers. Wound up with an average season in his overall play with great ball hawk skills helping create turnovers.

For the record:

If Kazee improves enough and doesn’t stick at CB, it’ll be hard for Rico to hold the job without more turnovers. Rico may then become a slot guy instead. But for base D I like Rico. Our CBs suffered from this and were not comfortable all year; except for Tru mostly down the stretch. He came around. Rocky was still being a bit rocky. ;)

all the above, he always got beat over the top, missed tackles, and was beat when in coverage. He is not nearly as good as people think, and Rico's job is not even remotely threatened. I am willing to bet Allen will be the starter for the foreseeable future.

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1 hour ago, MilleniumFalcon said:

Same for me. Heavily invest draft/FA on Guards, RT, DT, and DE. As for CB, find a replacement for Alford (stuck with Trufant because of his contract), see what Oliver can do, flexible with Kazee as he can also play nickel.

I will say that Alford doesn't bother me as much as some others.  If we draft a corner, I think Rocky stays.  If we get one in FA, he's done.  I think the former is more likely as I am not aware of a corner we'd chase in FA  (money v. talent).

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59 minutes ago, Monolith2001 said:

I will say that Alford doesn't bother me as much as some others.  If we draft a corner, I think Rocky stays.  If we get one in FA, he's done.  I think the former is more likely as I am not aware of a corner we'd chase in FA  (money v. talent).

To me it's about cap space we need for fixing the LOS; after the Grady/Julio moves which may collectively take up $15M more towards the cap. Between Grady's first year on his major contract and a reduction in cap hit on Julio in 2019.

If Rocky does not restructure he probably isn't remaining. Fix the DL and I agree, but the longer he has to play in coverage he breaks down because he relies on athleticism more than technique (Tru).

So for clarity:

We keep Alford unless it costs us from fixing the LOS.

Cutting him immediately before FA allows for $7.9M off the cap with only $1.2M dead money for 2019 and nothing beyond. And he is a higher cap casualty risk due to having most to gain among cuts not named Vic Beasley.

RS being only viable as post-6/1 and Reed being $4.5M can be whenever, IIRC.

Edited by Ergo Proxy

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5 hours ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Don’t tell @FalconFanSince1970 His heart can’t handle not drafting BPA...and I pretty much agree

If TD takes a CB in the first round or two we'll have about 700 hindsight mock drafts from him over the next couple of years.

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4 minutes ago, Pacific_Falcon said:

If TD takes a CB in the first round or two we'll have about 700 hindsight mock drafts from him over the next couple of years.

And if the CB we could take in theory became an All-Pro?

Fact is we don't know jack. Right now. Today. FA is first. Draft day is unpredictable; you just go in with a good idea and scenarios of how it unfolds. Said the same thing last year and I'm glad we took CR in round 1. Our draft was pretty good. It's a shame Levitre/Fusco/Free got hurt and it took longer than it should have to fix the OL. We need a firey "I want results" OC. That's why Sark is gone because Quinn needs to take over D and trust the OC completely.

Kind've like he was calling the D in SB51 and Shanny screwed us over.

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Just now, Ergo Proxy said:

And if the CB we could take in theory became an All-Pro?

Fact is we don't know jack. Right now. Today. FA is first. Draft day is unpredictable; you just go in with a good idea and scenarios of how it unfolds. Said the same thing last year and I'm glad we took CR in round 1. Our draft was pretty good. It's a shame Levitre/Fusco/Free got hurt and it took longer than it should have to fix the OL. We need a firey "I want results" OC. That's why Sark is gone because Quinn needs to take over D and trust the OC completely.

Kind've like he was calling the D in SB51 and Shanny screwed us over.

I actually hope we take one in the 2nd or 3rd as long as it makes sense and we don't reach. I was specifically referring to what his reaction will be, not what the right draft strategy is.

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