Spts1

Sarkisian never had a chance in Atlanta

144 posts in this topic

Sark never had a chance here coming behind Shanahan and that historic season the Falcons put up.  People tend to become prisoners of the moment in the NFL thus ANYBODY who came after Shanahan was gonna be heavily criticized.  I personally think Sark was the right man for the gig and still do.  Ryan has put up historic numbers this year as proof.  There is not ONE coordinator in the league who doesn't make QUESTIONABLE calls.  Heck,  Shanahan threw the Falcons under the bus with SEVERAL horrible calls in the Superbowl.  He went away from the running game. I think Freeman only got 4 touches in the second half of the Superbowl.  In the biggest game in Falcon history Shanahan wet the bed but is still worshipped here.

Sark took that offense and in his FIRST year got similar results as Shanahan. I broke it down before how the Falcons were actually better in some areas.  The NFL adjusts to offenses so most likely even Shanahan wouldn't have had the same results as far as BIG plays in 2017.  Injuries also play a factor.  I hate to admit it because I've always been a fan of Coleman but Freeman's power running changes the Falcons run game.  Having healthy guards in there also helps the run game. 

That being said the Falcons are currently ranked  #8th in the NFL in total yards.  EIGHTH folks.  They are ranked #5th in passing yardage and passing yardage per game.  They are ranked 27th in rushing yards but you have to DIRECTLY attribute that to Freeman and the injuries on the offensive line. Last year when Freeman was healthy for the most part and the offensive line healthy the Falcons ranked 9th in total rushing yards and 12th in rushing yards per game.  Sark didn't suddenly drop to 27th because he doesn't know what he is doing...  Another stat.  The Falcons are currently ranked #11th in total points!  #11th folks.  They are ranked #8th in points per game.  With the injuries.  With the horrible defense.  With everything thats going on Sark still has the Falcons situated as one of the top offenses in the league.  If the defense had carried its weight in just two to four more games you looking at a playoff team just like last year.   Its a shame because Sark is gonna get scapegoated out of here...

" Sark must go!  Sark must go!  Sark must go! "

Image result for mob pitchfork gif

 

 

Edited by slickgadawg

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4 minutes ago, Geneaut said:

The failure of the running game is my biggest beef with him. I can't decide if that was on the OL, the loss of Freeman, or Sark.

I posted stats from last year when he had Freeman and a healthy offensive line. That leads me to believe THATS the problem...

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The only thing I feel that is out of his control is Quinn's inability to know when to be aggressive vs. play conservative. Ever since the Super Bowl, Quinn seems like he is all over the place when it comes to being aggressive or playing it safe. In today's NFL, you have to play aggressive for most of the game because teams are scoring at a record pace. I hate when we get late in the games and we run on 1st and 2nd down then expect Ryan to convert a 3rd and long. I know it is a pipe dream, but this is why I wouldn't mind someone like Kubiak being our offensive coordinator. I feel like he has been around long enough to where Quinn would listen to him when it comes to late game strategy.

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1 minute ago, Geneaut said:

The failure of the running game is my biggest beef with him. I can't decide if that was on the OL, the loss of Freeman, or Sark.

You can't put putrid O-Line play on him. O-line came in overrated. Even in Freemans 2 games he played this year he had a long of 20 yards and gained 32 on 8 carries and 36 on 6 carries yards respectively. No touchdowns. His last 4 games last year were 11 for 36 yards, 11 for 23 yards, 18 for 66 yards and 10 for 7 yards. All of last season he had only 4 games over 80 yards rushing behind a fairly heatlhy line. The rest were as mediocre as what Coleman has had this year behind a trash line. Even behind this line and fewer carries he averaged .3 more ypc than Freeman averaged last season and almost 100 fewer yards at the moment.

People are acting like Freeman is above and beyond anyone else but he's not that much better. You can give me the better vision and he's a one cut argument all day but the stat sheet shows they bring almost the same production to the table

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Sark improved this year and I would not hate him returning for continuity sake.  But to say he produced similar results to Shanny last year is simply false.  We went from 34.1 ppg on 61 offensive snaps to 21.8 ppg on 60.5 offensive snaps.  It’s a 2 touchdown drop

Edited by Falconsin2012

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14 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

I posted stats from last year when he had Freeman and a healthy offensive line. That leads me to believe THATS the problem...

Well, it failed the eye test this year I all I know. 

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2 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Sark improved this year and I would not hate him returning for continuity sake.  But to say he produced similar results to Shanny last year is simply false.  We went from 34.1 ppg on 61 offensive snaps to 21.8 ppg on 60.5 offensive snaps.  It’s a 2 touchdown drop

I assumed he meant that he got similar results compared to Shanny's first year -- which was also disastrous.

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2 minutes ago, osiruz said:

Sarkosuchus took our running game and ran it into the ground. We need a more Balanced OC.

This is my primary issue with Sark.  He abandons the run game.  Just won’t win only running 35% of downs.  And let’s be clear: Coleman averaged 4.7 ypc this year

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27 minutes ago, Geneaut said:

The failure of the running game is my biggest beef with him. I can't decide if that was on the OL, the loss of Freeman, or Sark.

I believe that it honestly was losing both guards, losing Freeman and not having  a great fullback to help pick up the pieces.

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1 minute ago, Falconsin2012 said:

This is my primary issue with Sark.  He abandons the run game.  Just won’t win only running 35% of downs.  And let’s be clear: Coleman averaged 4.7 ypc this year

And its not just about the volume, the running game has no cohesion or running lanes, I just dont think Sark knows how to run a ZBS style offense.

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1 minute ago, Tandy said:

I believe that it honestly was losing both guards, losing Freeman and not having  a great fullback to help pick up the pieces.

That's sort of where I'm leaning on it in my head. We were about 13th in rushing last season so Sark can at least direct an NFL average rushing attack.

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8 minutes ago, osiruz said:

And its not just about the volume, the running game has no cohesion or running lanes, I just dont think Sark knows how to run a ZBS style offense.

He is a power gap guy.  Prefers the inside and always has.  Of course this makes his obsession with outside toss or crackback odd. 

 

“While Sarkisian will surely sprinkle in some outside zone in Atlanta, expect to see a whole lot more of those downhill runs that Shanahan rarely called.

Here’s what Sarkisian told FOXSports.com in 2014 while at USC…

“We’re similar in a lot of the different schemes that we run,” Sarkisian said when talking about John Harbaugh’s 49ers teams. “(The 49ers are) a power running team, we love to run the power play. They love to run the counter. We love to run the counter.”

This will surely have an effect on the offensive line, which was built for the zone-running style, and RB Devonta Freeman, who is most dangerous when he finds those cutback lanes zone runs are designed to create.

It should also have an effect on Matt Ryan. The Falcons’ passing and running games meshed so well under Shanahan, they could not be considered separate entities. The outside zone set up the play-action passing game, which was the best in the NFL in 2016. Per Football Outsiders’ charting data, no team used play-action more often (26% of the time) and only one team (Washington) averaged more yards-per-play.

 
 
 

Bob Donnan-USA TODAY Sports

Ryan will also be in shotgun (and the pistol) more often than he was during his MVP season. Sarkisian’s Washington and USC teams spent most of their snaps in the gun, which allowed them to feature run-pass options, a cornerstone of his offense. Those plays feature a pre- or post-snap read that tells the QB to either hand the ball off to his back or to flip the ball out to a receiver running a quick route.

Atlanta’s running game may not be nearly as effective if it does, in fact, feature more shotgun runs. In 2016, the Falcons rushing average dropped by nearly a yard when it ran out of the gun compared to when it ran from under center. And if the running game isn’t as effective, the passing game will almost certainly take a hit.

Edited by Falconsin2012
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2 minutes ago, osiruz said:

And its not just about the volume, the running game has no cohesion or running lanes, I just dont think Sark knows how to run a ZBS style offense.

Makes me wonder if we couldn't hire a consultant in the offseason to educate Sark. Maybe toss some $$$ at Shanny Sr?

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51 minutes ago, Geneaut said:

The failure of the running game is my biggest beef with him. I can't decide if that was on the OL, the loss of Freeman, or Sark.

Given that two of those things changed (Freeman out and the OL being injured/declining) and one did not (Sark), I think that's a reasonably easy call to make.

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31 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

Sark improved this year and I would not hate him returning for continuity sake.  But to say he produced similar results to Shanny last year is simply false.  We went from 34.1 ppg on 61 offensive snaps to 21.8 ppg on 60.5 offensive snaps.  It’s a 2 touchdown drop

Points were down but the efficiency was the same and better in some areas. RED ZONE has been the Falcons achilles for a long time, even before Shanahan.  

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34 minutes ago, Falconsin2012 said:

He is a power gap guy.  Prefers the inside and always has.  Of course this makes his obsession with outside toss or crackback odd. 

 

“While Sarkisian will surely sprinkle in some outside zone in Atlanta, expect to see a whole lot more of those downhill runs that Shanahan rarely called.

Here’s what Sarkisian told FOXSports.com in 2014 while at USC…

“We’re similar in a lot of the different schemes that we run,” Sarkisian said when talking about John Harbaugh’s 49ers teams. “(The 49ers are) a power running team, we love to run the power play. They love to run the counter. We love to run the counter.”

This will surely have an effect on the offensive line, which was built for the zone-running style, and RB Devonta Freeman, who is most dangerous when he finds those cutback lanes zone runs are designed to create.

It should also have an effect on Matt Ryan. The Falcons’ passing and running games meshed so well under Shanahan, they could not be considered separate entities. The outside zone set up the play-action passing game, which was the best in the NFL in 2016. Per Football Outsiders’ charting data, no team used play-action more often (26% of the time) and only one team (Washington) averaged more yards-per-play.

 
 
 

Bob Donnan-USA TODAY Sports

Ryan will also be in shotgun (and the pistol) more often than he was during his MVP season. Sarkisian’s Washington and USC teams spent most of their snaps in the gun, which allowed them to feature run-pass options, a cornerstone of his offense. Those plays feature a pre- or post-snap read that tells the QB to either hand the ball off to his back or to flip the ball out to a receiver running a quick route.

Atlanta’s running game may not be nearly as effective if it does, in fact, feature more shotgun runs. In 2016, the Falcons rushing average dropped by nearly a yard when it ran out of the gun compared to when it ran from under center. And if the running game isn’t as effective, the passing game will almost certainly take a hit.

Thats true.  Sark is a inside the tackle run game coordinator. He WILL mix zone in there but his primary philosophy is between the tackles.  Now, its odd that the Falcons would hire a coordinator that has primarily a different scheme in run blocking than the personnel you have on hand.  THATS on Quinn and Dimitroff.  Now, I say this,  Sark did a pretty good job last year regardless.

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4 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Thats true.  Sark is a inside the tackle run game coordinator. He WILL mix zone in there but his primary philosophy is between the tackles.  Now, its odd that the Falcons would hire a coordinator that has primarily a different scheme in run blocking than the personnel you have on hand.  THATS on Quinn and Dimitroff.  Now, I say this,  Sark did a pretty good job last year regardless.

You can run inside zone though, and we frequently do.  Zone versus man/power is not as simple as going outside the tackle versus running inside.  

Frankly, I prefer the zone blocking scheme for both.  Some don't, which is fine -- everyone has different opinions.  But I did want to point out that inside zone is a thing and Sark runs it a lot.

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2 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

You can run inside zone though, and we frequently do.  Zone versus man/power is not as simple as going outside the tackle versus running inside.  

Frankly, I prefer the zone blocking scheme for both.  Some don't, which is fine -- everyone has different opinions.  But I did want to point out that inside zone is a thing and Sark runs it a lot.

I would prefer that you do one or the other.  Keep it simple for the line so that they can concentrate on bettering their technique...  Good info, thanx...

Edited by slickgadawg
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33 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

Points were down but the efficiency was the same and better in some areas. RED ZONE has been the Falcons achilles for a long time, even before Shanahan.  

Yeah how many wins we have this year?  Oh ok.  I am tired of these false stats.  EXPLOSIVE plays 0 with Sark.  Run game 0 with Sark.  Predictability 100 with Sark.  There was a time when Kyle was here in 2016, that EVERY player was a threat at any time.  Even Patrick Dimarco would get looks in the passing game and did very well with it.  Joshua Perkins, DJ TEALIVIA, Aldrick Robinson, just to name a few players that looked real good and NO one ever heard of them

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2 minutes ago, R_The_Great said:

Yeah how many wins we have this year?  Oh ok.  I am tired of these false stats.  EXPLOSIVE plays 0 with Sark.  Run game 0 with Sark.  Predictability 100 with Sark.  There was a time when Kyle was here in 2016, that EVERY player was a threat at any time.  Even Patrick Dimarco would get looks in the passing game and did very well with it.  Joshua Perkins, DJ TEALIVIA, Aldrick Robinson, just to name a few players that looked real good and NO one ever heard of them

Then bring back Shanahan...:lol:   Look. You gotta go with what you got.  Shanahan is gone...

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