Sidecar Falcon

Todd McShay Draft 1.0

73 posts in this topic

Flip the script: What if we moved up for Williams instead of trading down; presuming we have to (5th pick overall in this mock)?

We’d only be going up a couple spots at most. I guess if we don’t have to pay as much. Not much else worth moving up for if the cost is too high. Staff better believe a guy trading up for is legit year 1 stud either way. Even if cost isn’t bad.

I’d rather trade down and move back up if possible. Rounds 1, 2, and 3 picks from the team wanting our highest pick that we got a haul from. Use a few of those to be back into the teens( if the trade partner is a lower 1st)

Edited by Ergo Proxy
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22 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Flip the script: What if we moved up for Williams instead of trading down; presuming we have to (5th pick overall in this mock)?

We’d only be going up a couple spots at most. I guess if we don’t have to pay as much. Not much else worth moving up for if the cost is too high. Staff better believe a guy trading up for is legit year 1 stud either way. Even if cost isn’t bad.

I’d rather trade down and move back up if possible. Rounds 1, 2, and 3 picks from the team wanting our highest pick that we got a haul from. Use a few of those to be back into the teens( if the trade partner is a lower 1st)

Moving up even 2-3 spots in top 5 is going to cost a lot. Ask redskins and others who traded 3-4 spots.

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1 hour ago, PriMeTiiMe said:

Cleveland getting Oliver at 12 would be a huge steal.

Baker at 16 is also a big one.

There's going to be a good player in that 8-12 range. I think that's where we end up, tankers be ****ed.

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47 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Flip the script: What if we moved up for Williams instead of trading down; presuming we have to (5th pick overall in this mock)?

We’d only be going up a couple spots at most. I guess if we don’t have to pay as much. Not much else worth moving up for if the cost is too high.

 

It would cost our second rounder on the value chart and for all the talks people will have that diminish or dismiss the value chart, it's still held up on something like 90% of NFL trades over the past 20 years.

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4 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

Grady would like to have a word with you. Lol

Yeah, it's the yin and yang of our current situation. Grady's played like a top 10 draft pick, while Beasley did one year and has seemed like a fifth rounder the rest of the time. 

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1 minute ago, jidady said:

It would cost our second rounder on the value chart and for all the talks people will have that diminish or dismiss the value chart, it's still held up on something like 90% of NFL trades over the past 20 years.

Wouldn’t be willing to give up a second this year. Too much defensive talent on the board. This draft could be a gold mine if our FO can pull off some moves.

Judging by how the season has been going, I expect us to be drafting at best 3rd overall. Bosa should be the first pick. Raiders are the real story here. Based on how Gruden has been acting this season, he could go a few different ways. This is all based on me believing he’ll release Carr.

First option is he stays put and drafts Williams. His SB winning team had Sapp, so it stands to reason that he knows that a game changing DT could be an important cog for a SB winning team. Complement that with him getting negative press for trading Mack and this seems probable. 

Second option, after releasing Carr, he dangles whomever the top QB in the draft is (Shanahan move) and feigns that he’s going to draft him. A QB needy team will pay a King’s ransom to move up and select “their guy” and Gruden walks away with even more picks in a heavy and deep defensive draft. 

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9 minutes ago, jidady said:

Yeah, it's the yin and yang of our current situation. Grady's played like a top 10 draft pick, while Beasley did one year and has seemed like a fifth rounder the rest of the time. 

Right, I guess I wasn't clear enough for some, I meant going with a Clemson guy in 1st round like we did with Beasley.

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2 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

Wouldn’t be willing to give up a second this year. Too much defensive talent on the board. This draft could be a gold mine if our FO can pull off some moves.

Judging by how the season has been going, I expect us to be drafting at best 3rd overall. Bosa should be the first pick. Raiders are the real story here. Based on how Gruden has been acting this season, he could go a few different ways. This is all based on me believing he’ll release Carr.

First option is he stays put and drafts Williams. His SB winning team had Sapp, so it stands to reason that he knows that a game changing DT could be an important cog for a SB winning team. Complement that with him getting negative press for trading Mack and this seems probable. 

Second option, after releasing Carr, he dangles whomever the top QB in the draft is (Shanahan move) and feigns that he’s going to draft him. A QB needy team will pay a King’s ransom to move up and select “their guy” and Gruden walks away with even more picks in a heavy and deep defensive draft. 

I think you're absolutely right that Gruden will do everything he can to acquire a lot of picks. He's basically married to the Raiders until they've put down roots in Vegas. So, he's thinking longer term than most NFL personnel people do. He's almost treating them like an expansion team.

But I suspect that the Falcons will beat Arizona this week and wind up 5-11 and picking around 6-8.

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Just now, Sidecar Falcon said:

He has the tools. If Herbert declares he’s going to draw a lot of interest. 

If they play in their bowl games...there was talk again of some draftees sitting out.

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Just now, jidady said:

I think you're absolutely right that Gruden will do everything he can to acquire a lot of picks. He's basically married to the Raiders until they've put down roots in Vegas. So, he's thinking longer term than most NFL personnel people do. He's almost treating them like an expansion team.

But I suspect that the Falcons will beat Arizona this week and wind up 5-11 and picking around 6-8.

That would be unfortunate if we wind up just out of reach of the elite talent but too far up to trade back. That puts us in a bind if we do decide to try and make some moves. 

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4 minutes ago, VTCrunkler said:

If they play in their bowl games...there was talk again of some draftees sitting out.

That’s what Bosa is doing. He’s getting a lot of $hit from pundits for doing so. Can’t say I blame him for doing so. His future is on the line. One more injury and he can lose millions. 

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7 minutes ago, VTCrunkler said:

If they play in their bowl games...there was talk again of some draftees sitting out.

Yeah, Bosa just stopped being a college athlete after his injury, and Ed Oliver's skipping the bowl game, too. He's going to have some questions about how he handled his last month of school. He clearly had a falling out with the coaching staff, which generally causes personnel people to wonder if he's gotten too cocky.

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Just now, jidady said:

Yeah, Bosa just stopped being a college athlete after his injury, and Ed Oliver's skipping the bowl game, too. He's going to have some questions about how he handled his last month of school. He clearly had a falling out with the coaching staff, which generally causes personnel people to wonder if he's gotten too cocky.

Whos getting cocky?  Oliver?  cause i can see bosa getting cocky too.  Is Bosa really worth the #1 overall pick?

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

That would be unfortunate if we wind up just out of reach of the elite talent but too far up to trade back. That puts us in a bind if we do decide to try and make some moves. 

Yeah, I hate thinking about the draft in mid-December, and it's that much worse knowing that if we lose out, we'd have a real shot at the top pick but knowing that we're about to play an Arizona team that is horrendous.

I don't ever root against the Falcons, so I'm looking at this weekend's game as a strange form of gambler's insurance. Either I'm happy and we've won, or we've gotten that much closer to a top three pick.

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Just now, VTCrunkler said:

Whos getting cocky?  Oliver?  cause i can see bosa getting cocky too.  Is Bosa really worth the #1 overall pick?

 

 

Oliver, yeah. He had this weird thing with his head coach last month:

https://abcnews.go.com/Sports/houston-star-dt-ed-oliver-heated-incident-coach/story?id=59233580

Bosa seems to have a close relationship with OSU's coaching staff, so while he may be cocky, I doubt they'd say anything against him. The Bosas have been huge for that program.

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Just now, jidady said:

Yeah, I hate thinking about the draft in mid-December, and it's that much worse knowing that if we lose out, we'd have a real shot at the top pick but knowing that we're about to play an Arizona team that is horrendous.

I don't ever root against the Falcons, so I'm looking at this weekend's game as a strange form of gambler's insurance. Either I'm happy and we've won, or we've gotten that much closer to a top three pick.

Same. I honestly feel that this is the year we should trade back, perhaps multiple times. Pick up multiple dlineman, possibly the best FS in the draft. 

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2 minutes ago, jidady said:

Oliver, yeah. He had this weird thing with his head coach last month:

https://abcnews.go.com/Sports/houston-star-dt-ed-oliver-heated-incident-coach/story?id=59233580

Bosa seems to have a close relationship with OSU's coaching staff, so while he may be cocky, I doubt they'd say anything against him. The Bosas have been huge for that program.

The argument was over a jacket he wore on the sideline?  

i recall M. Applewhite was a player not long ago..

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8 minutes ago, jidady said:

Yeah, Bosa just stopped being a college athlete after his injury, and Ed Oliver's skipping the bowl game, too. He's going to have some questions about how he handled his last month of school. He clearly had a falling out with the coaching staff, which generally causes personnel people to wonder if he's gotten too cocky.

That could be why he falls in the draft. Character issues are a HUGE concern come draft time. (See Randy Gregory)

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6 minutes ago, Sidecar Falcon said:

Same. I honestly feel that this is the year we should trade back, perhaps multiple times. Pick up multiple dlineman, possibly the best FS in the draft. 

With the depth of quality defensive linemen this season, I'm right there with you.

People talk about the benefit of losing out to get a better draft pick. My comment is that if the Falcons had done one game worse, we could have picked #2 overall. That would have been a disaster, as we were talking an OL. We might have ended up with total bust Greg Robinson instead. 

What could have been great is if we'd dealt that #2 pick, moved back to #6, and wound up with Jake anyway. THAT is the type of move that's possible with a top three draft pick. So, that's the outcome I favor. We need high-quality linemen. One player isn't going to be the magic bullet that solves everything. Picking up more second and third round picks is the way we fix an issue I didn't realize was so significant until the season started. 

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