Heisman Thoughts

[BamaBirdLady 506]

Yes I am biased, lets get that out there.

Kyler Murray has awesome stats, better than Tua, but plays in a conference that doesn't play defense and played in the 4th quarter.

The fact that Tua was able to do what he did against SEC defense's should carry some weight.  Up until Saturday,  he was 2 for 2 in the 4th quarter, both for TDs. GA was the only defense that was able to slow him down.

I don't think 1 game is the sum of his year's accomplishments,  but again I am biased. 

I would love to know what you guys think!

[Carter 16,725]

Both deserving but I think I’d give Murray the edge due to being an all around baller. Tua is a great QB. Murray is one of those electric players though that is just exciting to watch. 

[UAB_DAWG 935]

I give the edge to Murray because he had to do it in crunch time due to that defense. He played well vs Texas despite the loss. Tua didn't have to perform under pressure and the one real time he did he looked pedestrian. 

Not a huge deciding factor for me but the fact that Jalen played the way he did vs UGA in basically the same situation could point to the fact that it wasn't all Tua. 

[frankly88 587]

I think all eyes were on the SEC championship game in which Tua looked human for the first time this season.  Its just one game but I think its enough that Murray gets it. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, UAB_DAWG said:

I give the edge to Murray because he had to do it in crunch time due to that defense. He played well vs Texas despite the loss. Tua didn't have to perform under pressure and the one real time he did he looked pedestrian. 

Not a huge deciding factor for me but the fact that Jalen played the way he did vs UGA in basically the same situation could point to the fact that it wasn't all Tua. 

Exactly Tua has been carried by the Alabama team up until that point. Compared to Murray that defense is terrible he basically is carrying them all the way to the playoffs(possible beyond?)

[tl;dr 7,497]

Alabama alum here. I was all on Tua and I think he could win the Heisman because he has a great case. I'm certainly pulling for him.

But I think it will and should be Kyler. 

[The Great American 3,639]

9 hours ago, Zone#7 said:

Exactly Tua has been carried by the Alabama team up until that point. Compared to Murray that defense is terrible he basically is carrying them all the way to the playoffs(possible beyond?)

Sorry but i kinda disagree that the Alabama team carried Tua.  If anything, he elevated Alabama's offense to a new level.  As for the Heisman winner ... I'm totally neutral.  

[SacFalcFan 4]

Kyle Murray deserves the Heisman IMO.  He is doing stuff that has never been done before with his running and passing as a qb.  Tua is a heck of a player, but he didn't have to overcome a horrible defense which puts a ton of pressure on the offense and QB.  Tua also in his biggest game of the season where he had a chance to have his heisman moment he was 10 of 25 for 1 td and 2 ints.  That isn't Heisman worthy at all.  You can't perform that badly and still win the Heisman in your team's biggest game.  That doesn't take away though from a terrific season by tua.  I think one guy who is being ignored by many is Haskins from OSU.  He just broke the big 10 records for passing.  He is definitely top 3 if not top 2 right behind Kyle Murray. 

[BamaBirdLady 506]

2 hours ago, SacFalcFan said:

Kyle Murray deserves the Heisman IMO.  He is doing stuff that has never been done before with his running and passing as a qb.  Tua is a heck of a player, but he didn't have to overcome a horrible defense which puts a ton of pressure on the offense and QB.  Tua also in his biggest game of the season where he had a chance to have his heisman moment he was 10 of 25 for 1 td and 2 ints.  That isn't Heisman worthy at all.  You can't perform that badly and still win the Heisman in your team's biggest game.  That doesn't take away though from a terrific season by tua.  I think one guy who is being ignored by many is Haskins from OSU.  He just broke the big 10 records for passing.  He is definitely top 3 if not top 2 right behind Kyle Murray. 

While I somewhat agree. Don't forget Bamas offensive did something that hasn't been done since the 1888 Yale team thanks to Tua. Beat every regular season opponent by more than 20 points. 

And remember,  he didn't play in the 4th quarter because he gave us such big leads. Just something to think about while talking about records

[g-dawg 37,631]

it's close.  Tua is probably the better pro prospect for sure but I see Kyler Murray getting it because his team needed every play he made to win almost every game they played.    Kyler was under constant pressure to make plays for survival - Tua was sitting out almost every 4th qtr because the lead had been built up so much that his play wasn't necessary.

Is that a fair way to separate the two?   Should Tua be penalized for being on a superior team that had a superior defense?  It's arguable, I grant you.

I vote for Kyler Murray.

[Falconsfan567 34,755]

I was all Tua until that championship game and I think he lost it on the field. Especially when you consider how much better Hurts played against the same defense. Kyler Murray has my vote.

[BamaBirdLady 506]

Looks like the consensus is that Tua lost it because of SECCG.

I guess I was wearing my crimson colored glasses when it came to Heisman talk.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, BamaBirdLady said:

While I somewhat agree. Don't forget Bamas offensive did something that hasn't been done since the 1888 Yale team thanks to Tua. Beat every regular season opponent by more than 20 points. 

And remember,  he didn't play in the 4th quarter because he gave us such big leads. Just something to think about while talking about records

That's not hard to do given how the Conference was this year. If LSU had an offense to go along with the defense we're talking a world of difference.

[Carter 16,725]

5 hours ago, BamaBirdLady said:

Looks like the consensus is that Tua lost it because of SECCG.

I guess I was wearing my crimson colored glasses when it came to Heisman talk.

It certainly didn’t help. Now if he had played well against UGA (and a few of his incompletions were big drops) then I think it’s a done deal, he’d be the winner. That game also probably doesn’t come down to a 4th quarter Disney movie ending if that happens. Really glad we were able to make him play as poorly as he did, it was our only chance. Sorry not sorry!  

Unfortunately the backup killed us again lol 

[SacFalcFan 4]

5 hours ago, BamaBirdLady said:

Looks like the consensus is that Tua lost it because of SECCG.

I guess I was wearing my crimson colored glasses when it came to Heisman talk.

yep he lost it on the field.  hurts went up against that same defense and had a terrific finish.  i know you are a bama fan, but 10 of 25 for 1 td and 2 int in bama's biggest game of the year (up to this point) hurts him as it should in the heisman battle.  it's not a knock on him at all though.. he has had a terrific year and deserves to be in new york. 

[BamaBirdLady 506]

Yea, I guess you guys are right.

I was just hoping that maybe one game would not define his season, but it was the biggest game of the season so far, so yea I get it.

I just hope he recovers from his surgery in time to play against Murray and can win that battle!

[Carter 16,725]

Murray wins it. Which means OU will lose in the playoffs lol

[BamaBirdLady 506]

24 minutes ago, Carter said:

Murray wins it. Which means OU will lose in the playoffs lol

I will take a Natty over a Heisman any day!

[Is This What You Want? 425]

Tua is an awesome player and QB, but think Of it this way...

if Kyler played for Alabama, their record would be the same.

if Tua played for Oklahoma, they may have had another 1-2 losses.

So which one is best player?

[BamaBirdLady 506]

7 minutes ago, Is This What You Want? said:

Tua is an awesome player and QB, but think Of it this way...

if Kyler played for Alabama, their record would be the same.

if Tua played for Oklahoma, they may have had another 1-2 losses.

So which one is best player?

Won't answer that because I don't agree with your premise. 

[mike teevee 1,421]

It’ll be interesting to see how th OU QB does next year. Is it a system that makes them good or were they both that good. 

 

I’m not sure what the average ranking of defense Bama played, but I bet it was better than 70th like OUs schedule. 

[mike teevee 1,421]

2 minutes ago, BamaBirdLady said:

Won't answer that because I don't agree with your premise. 

Agreed.. There is no way to know that