TRUju2111

5 baffling decisions that lead to Cowboys victory

85 posts in this topic

This is a spin article.

The TOs didn’t matter. Quinn did make a power move on the 3rd down TO earlier in the drive.

There is no way to know if DAL let’s clock run down and take a TO to kick a 46 yarder or not.

Thats just assuming. That’s also assuming the kicker hits it’s the exact same in a different scenario than played out in reality.

Bottom line is we let them get in FG range. Our PLAY on the field was the problem.

Article does a slot of assuming and framing.

Didn't you know DAL wasn’t gonna to get the first down and keep driving right down the field for a game winner with all 3 TOs remaining? Quinn’s TOs MADE them convert the 3rd and MAGICALLY turned a miss into a made FG.

But some people like politics and spinning agendas. Keep dancing if you want. Lol.

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15 hours ago, Ergo Proxy said:

This is a spin article.

The TOs didn’t matter. Quinn did make a power move on the 3rd down TO earlier in the drive.

There is no way to know if DAL let’s clock run down and take a TO to kick a 46 yarder or not.

Thats just assuming. That’s also assuming the kicker hits it’s the exact same in a different scenario that played out in reality.

Bottom line is we let them get in FG range.

Article does a slot of assuming and framing.

Didn't you know DAL wasn’t gonna to get the first down and keep driving right down the field for a game winner with all 3 TOs remaining? Quinn’s TOs MADE them convert the 3rd and MAGICALLY turned a miss into a made FG.

But some people like politics and spinning agendas. Keep dancing if you want. Lol.

How can you say that and be serious Ergo, it was just plain dumb end of game management for Quinn to call any of those T.O.’s.

All 3 falcon T.O.’s hurt us in allowing Dallas to run plays which got them closer to makeable FG range? 

 

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1 minute ago, Vandy said:

How can you say that Ergo, it was just plain dumb end of game management for Quinn to call any of those T.O.’s.

All 3 falcon T.O.’s hurt us in allowing Dallas to run plays which got them closer to makeable FG range? 

 

DAL could’ve done that if they wanted.

The article is picking apart the time outs.

Im saying the elephant in the room is they had their own and our play was the problem.

How can I say what? The article is full of assumptions and framing of opinion to make he writer look factual.

Do you know what Dallas does if Quinn doesn’t call a TO when it was at the 30?

Yeah, I agree the TO wasn’t needed. Dallas has its own and could do what it wanted. Did they not finish the game with 1 TO?

Missing the point. Our PLAY cost us.

If anything you assume we can’t stop the Cowboys. NEVER call the 3rd Downs TO and only if it became 4th down do you call it.

Because we weren’t stopping them that drive. Alford missed his potential game winning INT.

That is what I’m saying. Far more meaningful than the acceptance of fate vs meaningless TOs.

It’s odd but they didn’t really matter IMO.

The article is still framing matters and assuming Garrett’s moves.

The article re-frames events as “Quinn calls time out and Garrett decides to then get into FG range and Quinn turns a miss into a game winner”

All of that is what this writer just told you was true when it simply is a spin.

Even if you disagree with Quinn’s TO usage those are not true statements. It’s assumptions. Don’t like the TOs? Fine.

Quinn took a gamble in a lose/lose situation IMO. He postured on 3rd down and called a TO to show his D he believed they could make the stop. To me, just save it for 4th down but we got greedy thinking we could salvage more time for a potential Ryan drive/get them to run it instead but the bait for them to run it and our D to stop them didn’t work. If it works he is a genius but it’s being made as the difference when the play is what let them get into FG range. You can’t assume Garrett’s choices.

There are other times Quinn’s clock management and staying aggressive on offense side could have mattered but fact is this team hasn’t been good at closing either half most of the year and it’s why we lose. The play is.

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14 hours ago, Ergo Proxy said:

DAL could’ve done that if they wanted.

The article is picking apart the time outs.

Im saying the elephant in the room is they had their own and our play was the problem.

How can I say what? The article is full of assumptions and framing of opinion to make he writer look factual.

Do you know what Dallas does if Quinn doesn’t call a TO when it was at the 30?

Yeah, I agree the TO wasn’t needed. Dallas has its own and could do what it wanted. Did they not finish the game with 1 TO?

Missing the point. Our PLAY cost us.

If anything you assume we can’t stop the Cowboys. NEVER call the 3rd Downs TO and only if it became 4th down do you call it.

Because we weren’t stopping them that drive. Alford missed his potential game winning INT.

That is what I’m saying. Far more meaningful than the acceptance of fate vs meaningless TOs.

It’s odd but they didn’t really matter IMO.

The article is still framing matters and assuming Garrett’s moves.

The article re-frames events as “Quinn calls time out and Garrett decides to then get into FG range and Quinn turns a miss into a game winner”

All of that is what this writer just told you was true when it simply is a spin.

Even if you disagree with Quinn’s TO usage those are not true statements. It’s assumptions. Don’t like the TOs? Fine.

Quinn took a gamble in a lose/lose situation IMO. He postured on 3rd down and called a TO to show his D he believed they could make the stop. To me, just save it for 4th down but we got greedy thinking we could salvage more time for a potential Ryan drive/get them to run it instead but the bait for them to run it and our D to stop them didn’t work. If it works he is a genius but it’s being made as the difference when the play is what let them get into FG range. You can’t assume Garrett’s choices.

There are other times Quinn’s clock management and staying aggressive on offense side could have mattered but fact is this team hasn’t been good at closing either half most of the year and it’s why we lose. The play is.

You’re missing my point, I know writers spew nonsense all the time..... But Quinn had no business calling any of the time outs. A smart coach Calls Garrett's Hand, who’s as big a knucklehead as Quinn is in game management. For all we know Garrett freezes and let’s the clock run out. 

Each T.O. gave them more time and more additional yards. Just terrible clock management!

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3 minutes ago, Vandy said:

You’re missing my point, Quinn had no business calling any of the time outs. A smart coach Calls Garrett's Hand, who’s as big a knucklehead as Quinn is in game management. For all we know Garrett freezes and let’s the clock run out. 

Each T.O. gave them more time and more additional yards. Terrible clock management!

Right. Quinn started managing the clock like we were losing. The only time that we should have called a TO is if the Cowboys failed to convert a 3rd down. If he had let Dallas use their own, maybe we get a tackle inbounds and Dallas has to rush. If all else fails, we would have hard our timeouts to freeze the kicker. He barely made the game winner, and missed a PAT. 

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8 minutes ago, Vandy said:

You’re missing my point, I know writers spew nonsense all the time..... But Quinn had no business calling any of the time outs. A smart coach Calls Garrett's Hand, who’s as big a knucklehead as Quinn is in game management. For all we know Garrett freezes and let’s the clock run out. 

Each T.O. gave them more time and more additional yards. Just terrible clock management!

I get the point. I just feel like regardless of coming off a TO or not Quinn either knew his D needed a one chance to stop them play on that initial 3rd down and/or wanted the opportunity to regain control instead of letting Garrett dictate to him.

After meditating on that perspective and it not working it’s easy to say it was the wrong move. I think it was not optimal the timeouts. Yes.

I still think the story stretches it further than that. If you say he shouldn’t have called any TOs and Dal takes their timeouts instead how do we know it doesn’t go back in our favor?

So Quinn has happy feet and is a bit too motivational with his TOs than strategic? Ok if we are just analyzing the TOs only I get it. Not optimal. Still DAL had all 3 to start the drive and could control their own fate. They had the ball and the game in their hands.

Maybe never call the 1st TO unless they don’t make it on the 3rd down in question.

I still am just disgusted by our play to even be in that situation that it’s hard for me to see those calls as being more meaningful. Marginally impactful at best, but they weren’t why we lost. Despite being suboptimal in usage.

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18 minutes ago, Vandy said:

You’re missing my point, I know writers spew nonsense all the time..... But Quinn had no business calling any of the time outs. A smart coach Calls Garrett's Hand, who’s as big a knucklehead as Quinn is in game management. For all we know Garrett freezes and let’s the clock run out. 

Each T.O. gave them more time and more additional yards. Just terrible clock management!

 

8 minutes ago, Faithful Falcon said:

Right. Quinn started managing the clock like we were losing. The only time that we should have called a TO is if the Cowboys failed to convert a 3rd down. If he had let Dallas use their own, maybe we get a tackle inbounds and Dallas has to rush. If all else fails, we would have hard our timeouts to freeze the kicker. He barely made the game winner, and missed a PAT. 

Eh, where is Mike Smith when you need him. Hire him as a consultant for calling TOs exclusively!:tiphat:

Ok, I concede. Strategic use of the TOs weren’t thought through. I just wish our play was better.

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55 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

 

Eh, where is Mike Smith when you need him. Hire him as a consultant for calling TOs exclusively!:tiphat:

Ok, I concede. Strategic use of the TOs weren’t thought through. I just wish our play was better.

Well we are working with what we have. The overall play was not that bad Sunday. Looking at the guys playing, it looks like they really wanted that game. Paulson and Hooper refusing to go down on plays. Coleman running hard. Sanu and Julio both beasting after a catch. Julio getting on the defense on Matt's over throw. Matt moving around in a temporary pocket. Jordan Richards making plays. Trufant not f**King up.

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9 minutes ago, Faithful Falcon said:

Well we are working with what we have. The overall play was not that bad Sunday. Looking at the guys playing, it looks like they really wanted that game. Paulson and Hooper refusing to go down on plays. Coleman running hard. Sanu and Julio both beasting after a catch. Julio getting on the defense on Matt's over throw. Matt moving around in a temporary pocket. Jordan Richards making plays. Trufant not f**King up.

Then what do we do? Vic even emerged with a 2 sack game.

My gripe is we didn’t stop the run and make Dak beat us. In some of our hardest games the opposing RBs have gone off. Chubb, Elliott, Kamara, Conner(?). We really do miss Debo and Neal. 

On the flip side we aren’t running the ball consistently enough. Felt like we were pressing on offense but they shut down many rush attempts and it seemed we abandoned the run outside of a couple good Coleman runs. Maybe we are forcing Ito a bit too much and need Tevin out there until further notice? And besides, to help our pass blocking out some it’d be nice for them to get confidence running instead of being on skates all game.

BTW I hope Senat’s shoulder is ok. Wish we didn’t have to give McClain any snaps. I haven’t seen the snap count sheet from DAL tho.

Edited by Ergo Proxy

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4 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Then what do we do? Vic even emerged with a 2 sack game.

My gripe is we didn’t stop the run and make Dak beat us. In some of our hardest games the opposing RBs have gone off. Chubb, Elliott, Kamara. We really do much Debo and Neal.

On the flip side we aren’t running the ball consistently enough. Felt like we were pressing on offense but they shut down many rush attempts and it seemed we abandoned the run outside of a couple good Coleman runs. Maybe we are forcing Ito a bit too much and need Tevin out there until further notice?

I hope Senat’s shoulder is ok btw. Wish we didn’t have to give McClain any snaps. I haven’t seen the snap count sheet, though.

Running game is what killed us. Physical running games have been a problem for a long time.

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4 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Then what do we do? Vic even emerged with a 2 sack game.

My gripe is we didn’t stop the run and make Dak beat us. In some of our hardest games the opposing RBs have gone off. Chubb, Elliott, Kamara, Conner(?). We really do miss Debo and Neal. 

On the flip side we aren’t running the ball consistently enough. Felt like we were pressing on offense but they shut down many rush attempts and it seemed we abandoned the run outside of a couple good Coleman runs. Maybe we are forcing Ito a bit too much and need Tevin out there until further notice? And besides, to help our pass blocking out some it’d be nice for them to get confidence running instead of being on skates all game.

BTW I hope Senat’s shoulder is ok. Wish we didn’t have to give McClain any snaps. I haven’t seen the snap count sheet from DAL tho.

We miss those guys, but that's not what beat us. Pittsburgh and Cleveland, probably so. These close games were all bad coaching decisions. Example. McVay on 4th down last night called a bluffed play on a timeout. It was 4th and 1. Goff handed the ball off to Gurley as McVay called the timeout. That was strategic. KC bit on it, and the Rams ran playaction. It's not all about running over or out running everyone.

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11 minutes ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Then what do we do? Vic even emerged with a 2 sack game.

My gripe is we didn’t stop the run and make Dak beat us. In some of our hardest games the opposing RBs have gone off. Chubb, Elliott, Kamara, Conner(?). We really do miss Debo and Neal. 

On the flip side we aren’t running the ball consistently enough. Felt like we were pressing on offense but they shut down many rush attempts and it seemed we abandoned the run outside of a couple good Coleman runs. Maybe we are forcing Ito a bit too much and need Tevin out there until further notice? And besides, to help our pass blocking out some it’d be nice for them to get confidence running instead of being on skates all game.

BTW I hope Senat’s shoulder is ok. Wish we didn’t have to give McClain any snaps. I haven’t seen the snap count sheet from DAL tho.

It’s beyond missing players. The whole D folded up. 

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1 minute ago, falcons007 said:

It’s beyond missing players. The whole D folded up. 

Seems like we lack the kind of on field leaders Debo and Allen were then. Those guys wouldn’t have just rolled over and taken it. Our CBs tho....Oliver can’t get up to speed fast enough!

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4 hours ago, Vandy said:

How can you say that Ergo, it was just plain dumb end of game management for Quinn to call any of those T.O.’s.

All 3 falcon T.O.’s hurt us in allowing Dallas to run plays which got them closer to makeable FG range? 

 

This article is a bit of a reach. It was 3rd and 5 with a minute and a half in a tied ball game. You call a timeout and your D has to make one stop. You get the ball back and have plenty of time for MR to get into FG range. Or we go three and out as the clock expires.

90% of NFL kickers are going to make a 46 yard FG. DQ had to burn the timeouts and try to get the ball back into Ryan's hands with some time on the clock once Dallas got inside our 35. Unfortunately, the D wasn't able to make the required stop previously, so we were one TO short of what was needed to keep 30 seconds on the clock for MR to tie it up. I would assume that the FG is going to be good and try to do what I could and not let them run it down to the last second. I believe we're winless when we let teams burn up the clock on their final drives this year.

I'm not bothered by the attempt. Still, game management even outside the last minute and a half of the game seems mishandled.

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It was absolutely stupid to call the first timeout when it was 3rd and 5. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Then the defense that was ran after it was called was absolutely ridiculous. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. You know what though? It's ok. This season has been over for a long time for Atlanta. If they're going to make a dumb mistake I'd rather it be now as opposed to a pivotal point in a playoff game down the road. Lesson learned for Quinn and company. Learn from it and move on. I've tried to be optimistic that they could put it all together at some point and squeak into the playoffs. Well, that was a fools hope.

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Tell you what all involved in this thread this is what I call discussion and differing points of view without idiocy entering into the thread.

From what I've seen lately this is a good one well done all involved.

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6 hours ago, falcons007 said:

It’s beyond missing players. The whole D folded up. 

Did anybody have any doubt that the cowboys were going to win after we gave up the 3rd and 5 conversion? I sure as **** didn't after what has transpired all season in these type of games. The TO decisions were odd I agree but our defensive play was terrible that last series and for me personally is more to blame than the clock management.

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9 hours ago, Ergo Proxy said:

This is a spin article.

The TOs didn’t matter. Quinn did make a power move on the 3rd down TO earlier in the drive.

There is no way to know if DAL let’s clock run down and take a TO to kick a 46 yarder or not.

Thats just assuming. That’s also assuming the kicker hits it’s the exact same in a different scenario than played out in reality.

Bottom line is we let them get in FG range. Our PLAY on the field was the problem.

Article does a slot of assuming and framing.

Didn't you know DAL wasn’t gonna to get the first down and keep driving right down the field for a game winner with all 3 TOs remaining? Quinn’s TOs MADE them convert the 3rd and MAGICALLY turned a miss into a made FG.

But some people like politics and spinning agendas. Keep dancing if you want. Lol.

What is a coach for? Strategy, tactics perhaps? He dictates what the players will attempt to do.  As for framing and spinning agendas... you are assuming based upon your statements that the field goal, as magical as you say it was, would have been assuredly missed if it were four yards longer! Tsk, tsk, tsk. A soothsayer and revisionist in our midst.

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1 hour ago, TNFalcon1 said:

Did anybody have any doubt that the cowboys were going to win after we gave up the 3rd and 5 conversion? I sure as **** didn't after what has transpired all season in these type of games. The TO decisions were odd I agree but our defensive play was terrible that last series and for me personally is more to blame than the clock management.

The play of the defense all year is what makes the time outs/clock management of the head coach all the more baffling. 

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1 hour ago, TNFalcon1 said:

Did anybody have any doubt that the cowboys were going to win after we gave up the 3rd and 5 conversion? I sure as **** didn't after what has transpired all season in these type of games. The TO decisions were odd I agree but our defensive play was terrible that last series and for me personally is more to blame than the clock management.

This has been a problem last few years. I can only remember the GB game in 2016, where D stopped to win the game. People say crap about Smitty defenses, but they were good enough to win 3-4 games a year and get the stop end of the game.

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