esmithidoc

In defense of Michael Turner

144 posts in this topic

Andrews came in as a 3rd Round pick from Auburn,a FB. And gouged the Saints in New Orleans for Falcons then rookie rb record 167 yards in the opening game. Ofcourse back then there was a little news and even in preseason dont remember William doing much Opening day Andrews came out of no where, Turner and I love the guy was the number one free agent and played behind LT for a few years to learn the NFL. Andrews did have a better OL and a veteran QB, where Turner had defenses stacking the box till Ryan started zinging passes over them, still the team leaned heavily on Turner. 

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8 hours ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Give me WA31. Run, block, catch like no other. The Burner could run. That's pretty much it.

LOL that's so dumb, he flatted Ray Lewis in pass block. Dude was also a better pure running back than WA31 by a lot. More 100, 200 yard games, and double the tds half the fumbles in 2 less seasons.

 

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12 hours ago, Knight of God said:

I’d take Turner all day.

Man that's why you get so much respect from me,

12 Tds is his average. Dude was at Freman or Andrews absolute best in an average year let that sink in. He would murder people had he had a better Oline or ran in an offense like the current falcons. The stats say he is better, and stats don't lie. I was stoked when I found out we stole him from SD, yes we stole him because at that time even SD fans knew he had surpassed LT as a runner and LT was on a downward slide. If not for LT Turner would easily be a 10K yard 107 TD guy, which are hall of fame numbers.

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On 10/18/2018 at 3:47 PM, Geneaut said:

Turner didn't average 5.4 yds a touch like Andrews did either. Andrews generated almost 2000 more yards from scrimmage than Turner in a Falcons uniform ( both in 5 seasons with Atlanta ). That's not knocking Turner at all, but Andrews was a HOSS.

That knee injury ruined something special ....

Andrews has almost the same stats playing 2 more seasons. He has almost the same YPA and half as many TDs and twice as many fumbles. No offense but the Andrews crowd doesn't know their stats. Turner was a lot better when we are talking about stats. Also people who dismiss Tds are ridiculous, RB who could score in the RZ are important. What else are we supposed to count, their bob sledding experience?

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On 10/18/2018 at 6:15 PM, The Legendary SB said:

This thread is about Turner so not going to get into the Turner vs Andrews pizzing contest.  Can we just appreciate both of their contributions?

That said, here's my favorite Turner gif:

15qdu7a.gif

He's actually picking up speed with a 220 lb LB wrapped around his legs and dragging behind him.  Looks like special effects cgi. lol

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22 hours ago, osiruz said:

Andrews has almost the same stats playing 2 more seasons. He has almost the same YPA and half as many TDs and twice as many fumbles. No offense but the Andrews crowd doesn't know their stats. Turner was a lot better when we are talking about stats. Also people who dismiss Tds are ridiculous, RB who could score in the RZ are important. What else are we supposed to count, their bob sledding experience?

You do realize Andrews was our fullback, not our primary halfback? 

No offense, but I can always tell who has and has never seen William Andrews play. 

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53 minutes ago, Vandy said:

 

You do realize Andrews was our fullback, not our primary halfback? 

No offense, but I can always tell who has and has never seen William Andrews play. 

Yeah buddy either never saw WA31 or has memory recall issues. Andrews was a FB who was also responsible for blocking for Cain and Riggs. Naturally his number of carries was lower than Turner's who was a bell cow RB protecting a young QB. He forgot WA31 also had a gaudy 4.6 yards per carry. And somehow he forgot about his 2,647 receiving yards and 11 TDs, compared to the Burner's 457 receiving yards and 1 TD.

He keeps saying Andrews played two more seasons with the Falcons than Turner. Not true. He only played one more season than Turner. They had almost an identical number of starts. I ain't taking nothing away from the Burner but WA31 was a complete back who could run, catch and block.  The Burner was a one dimensional RB who was nowhere near the receiving threat WA31 was.

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18 minutes ago, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Yeah buddy either never saw WA31 or has memory recall issues. Andrews was a FB who was also responsible for blocking for Cain and Riggs. Naturally his number of carries was lower than Turner's who was a bell cow RB protecting a young QB. He forgot WA31 also had a gaudy 4.6 yards per carry. And somehow he forgot about his 2,647 receiving yards and 11 TDs, compared to the Burner's 457 receiving yards and 1 TD.

He keeps saying Andrews played two more seasons with the Falcons than Turner. Not true. He only played one more season than Turner. They had almost an identical number of starts. I ain't taking nothing away from the Burner but WA31 was a complete back who could run, catch and block.  The Burner was a one dimensional RB who was nowhere near the receiving threat WA31 was.

You and I both loved Burner. But Andrews was a notch above, like HOF-worthy notch above.

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Obviously I never seen Andrews play, I am not 60 years old. However looking at the stats you have to admit that Turner is supremely better. He has 97 more touches, but WA fumbled a lot more, and scored a lot less. Meaning that Turner was a much better player.

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2 hours ago, Vandy said:

 

You do realize Andrews was our fullback, not our primary halfback? 

No offense, but I can always tell who has and has never seen William Andrews play. 

The disparity in touches is literally negligeable. You guys are insane trying to argue Andrews is better because he can catch. Freeman can also catch but he isn't on tuners level. In an average year Turner scores 5 more TDS than WA, and has the same YPA.

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7 minutes ago, osiruz said:

The disparity in touches is literally negligeable. You guys are insane trying to argue Andrews is better because he can catch. Freeman can also catch but he isn't on tuners level. In an average year Turner scores 5 more TDS than WA, and has the same YPA.

Insane to including receiving yards when comparing two RBs? Get out of here with that nonsense, Osiruz.

And stats only tell part of the story. 

Andrews was by far the more complete back, and every bit as good a runner as turner. If you saw Andrews play, you would know that. 

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2 minutes ago, Vandy said:

Insane to including receiving yards when comparing two RBs? Get out of here with that nonsense, Osirus.

Andrews was by far the more complete back, and every bit as good a runner as turner. Stats only tell part of that story, If you saw Andrews play, you would know that. 

But that doesn't make a difference when you extrapolate their stats over the same number of games. Turner still ends up with the same yardage, twice the tds, and 1/3 the amount of fumbles. Meaning that he has supremely better stats and it's not even close. Give me the guy who scores a lot more, is faster, more physical, and secures the ball better. Stats are what we use to measure RB Vandy, and let's be honest WA31 played in a more RB friendly league. I think you guys are just being sentimental, FFS1970 was even trying to say Turner wasn't a good pass blocker lol.

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42 minutes ago, osiruz said:

But that doesn't make a difference when you extrapolate their stats over the same number of games. Turner still ends up with the same yardage, twice the tds, and 1/3 the amount of fumbles. Meaning that he has supremely better stats and it's not even close. Give me the guy who scores a lot more, is faster, more physical, and secures the ball better. Stats are what we use to measure RB Vandy, and let's be honest WA31 played in a more RB friendly league. I think you guys are just being sentimental, FFS1970 was even trying to say Turner wasn't a good pass blocker lol.

Turner wasn’t more physical than Andrews man. What makes you even think that?

And Maybe I am sentimental, because I knew the guy a little.

Look, I loved turner too, but my eyes told me Andrews was better. If he hadn’t gotten hurt, he would have been a HOFer.

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Turner played at a time offense was still being more favored than previous eras. You could horse collar tackle still in Andrews' Era, for starters. When were clotheslines made illegal? I didn't see Andrews live either but respect the history of looking back.

I've never been a fan of comparing stats from guys that eras didn't even come close to crossing. Both are good players, but in a more physical Era William Andrews beasted guys. We don't know how well Turner would have done considering how quickly his body broke down.

Just my opinion...

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This is like trying to say Matthew Stafford is better than Joe Montana because Stafford's gonna have more TD's and yards when his career is over. You just can't compare era's like that when the game has changed so dramatically.

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1 hour ago, osiruz said:

But that doesn't make a difference when you extrapolate their stats over the same number of games. Turner still ends up with the same yardage, twice the tds, and 1/3 the amount of fumbles. Meaning that he has supremely better stats and it's not even close. Give me the guy who scores a lot more, is faster, more physical, and secures the ball better. Stats are what we use to measure RB Vandy, and let's be honest WA31 played in a more RB friendly league. I think you guys are just being sentimental, FFS1970 was even trying to say Turner wasn't a good pass blocker lol.

Turner was not a beast pass blocker bro. You basing that on one GIF? He definitely wasn't a better blocker than WA31. Run or pass. You admitted you never saw WA31 play ball and are basing your rankings on stats only. I think you need to go pull them tapes of WA31 or just listen to the old heads that saw Turner and WA31, liked both and are giving an objective opinion.

WA31 trucked as many players and had a 4.6 ypc average compared to Turner's 4.3 ypc. He definitely was no slouch running the ball. Trust me. LMAO calling the NFL a RB friendly league in the WA31 era. Defenses were tougher and always selling out to stop the run. Again WA31 was as good a runner, a better blocker and on a different planet than Turner in the pass game.

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2 hours ago, osiruz said:

The disparity in touches is literally negligeable. You guys are insane trying to argue Andrews is better because he can catch. Freeman can also catch but he isn't on tuners level. In an average year Turner scores 5 more TDS than WA, and has the same YPA.

Don't get too caught up on the raw stats. They are misleading. WA31 only carried the ball on 45% of our rushes. Turner carried the ball on 60% of our rushes. Are you giving any credit to WA31 for blocking Cain, Andrews and Stanback to several yards and TDs? Have you factored in WA31's receiving stats? He had 2,190 more receiving yards and 10 more TDs than Turner. Dude was considered by many to be the second best, if not best RB in the league during his prime (only trailing Walter Payton). He went to four straight Pro Bowls.

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Just now, FalconFanSince1970 said:

Don't get too caught up on the raw stats. They are misleading. WA31 only carried the ball on 45% of our rushes. Turner carried the ball on 60% of our rushes. Are you giving any credit to WA31 for blocking Cain, Andrews and Stanback to several yards and TDs? Have you factored in WA31's receiving stats? He had 2,190 more receiving yards and 10 more TDs than Turner. Dude was considered by many to be the second best, if not best RB in the league during his prime (only trailing Walter Payton). He went to four straight Pro Bowls.

So your argument for Andrews being the better RB is because he was a better fullback, is that it? Lmao.

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1 hour ago, Ergo Proxy said:

Turner played at a time offense was still being more favored than previous eras. You could horse collar tackle still in Andrews' Era, for starters. When were clotheslines made illegal? I didn't see Andrews live either but respect the history of looking back.

I've never been a fan of comparing stats from guys that eras didn't even come close to crossing. Both are good players, but in a more physical Era William Andrews beasted guys. We don't know how well Turner would have done considering how quickly his body broke down.

Just my opinion...

Teams ran the ball a lot more, and a lot better in Andrews' era as well. Turner would kill behind the lines Andrews had. Turner has the misfortune of playing behind a sucky Oline and being a backup a few years. Still ended up with more rushing yards in 1 and half less seasons. Also have you seen Turner play? Trying to clothesline or horse Collar Turner is an idiotic idea, you tackle him by taking our his knees/feet. 

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1 hour ago, Falconsfan567 said:

This is like trying to say Matthew Stafford is better than Joe Montana because Stafford's gonna have more TD's and yards when his career is over. You just can't compare era's like that when the game has changed so dramatically.

Except we are talking rbs, not QBs. The NFL is more of a passing league now where as it was a running league in the past and more RB friendly. Meaning OL had a lot more time practicing running plays and running the ball. 

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