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2018/2019 Braves Offseason Thread

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42 minutes ago, ATLBrave said:

That is dumb as ****. Why would we significantly weaken our team by trading two future cogs for one? I don’t think you understand how trades actually work. 

3 right? 

But here comes the “how do we know they’ll pan out” rhetoric.. 

 

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I would love Realmuto, but any trade involving Albies or Acuna is a no go. 

I want Kimbrel too, but seeing those numbers thrown out doesn't make me that excited about him. 

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The majority of baseball people say Machado is better than Harper:

http://www.espn.com/blog/buster-olney/insider/post/_/id/16322/bryce-harper-vs-manny-machado-who-would-you-rather-have

 

Evaluator 5: "Not really all that close for me. Machado has much better swing and approach. He hits good pitching; the other guy does not. Machado is a better defender at a position that is tougher to find. Harper has swing flaws that have been exposed in every year except 2015, and I am not buying he was injured last year."

 

Evaluator 7: "Both are uber-talented, but Manny's skills, where he could easily be one of the top three shortstops in our game, but instead, for now, is one of the top third basemen in the game. Absolutely nothing gets past him, and for my money he's a better hitter. Harper gets credit and gets a huge part of his reputation for how far he hits home runs, but they still only count for one run. Machado is an entire field hitter who hits to the situation. He can hammer majestic homers, but can also do other things to help a team win."

Edited by slickgadawg
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17 minutes ago, tl;dr said:

I would love Realmuto, but any trade involving Albies or Acuna is a no go. 

I want Kimbrel too, but seeing those numbers thrown out doesn't make me that excited about him. 

Absolutely not.. nor do I ever want to see those 2 separated.. too much fun

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31 minutes ago, slickgadawg said:

The majority of baseball people say Machado is better than Harper:

http://www.espn.com/blog/buster-olney/insider/post/_/id/16322/bryce-harper-vs-manny-machado-who-would-you-rather-have

 

Evaluator 5: "Not really all that close for me. Machado has much better swing and approach. He hits good pitching; the other guy does not. Machado is a better defender at a position that is tougher to find. Harper has swing flaws that have been exposed in every year except 2015, and I am not buying he was injured last year."

 

Evaluator 7: "Both are uber-talented, but Manny's skills, where he could easily be one of the top three shortstops in our game, but instead, for now, is one of the top third basemen in the game. Absolutely nothing gets past him, and for my money he's a better hitter. Harper gets credit and gets a huge part of his reputation for how far he hits home runs, but they still only count for one run. Machado is an entire field hitter who hits to the situation. He can hammer majestic homers, but can also do other things to help a team win."

I don't think anyone here would disagree with Manny being the better player. But neither fits into the Braves situation, and if we had to choose one or the other, Harper fits with the Braves better. But neither really does because both are liabilities defensively and will simply cost too much money. You want to be able to keep guys like Acuna and Albies around for the long-term (meaning 10-15 years instead of only 6-7 years)? The pitchers that we're developing? Well then you have to plan for it years in advance.

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43 minutes ago, TheTrue7 said:

Absolutely not.. nor do I ever want to see those 2 separated.. too much fun

Honestly, I'm not sure there is a player in the majors I would trade Acuna for right now. There are better players out there than him, but I don't know many players that are anywhere near him at age 20. "The ceiling is the roof" to quote MJ (which I still don't understand, but alright). 

Maybe I would trade Acuna for Trout straight up, but I have absolutely no idea why the Angels would do that. Trout is the better player right now, but in 5/6 years? Who knows. 

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27 minutes ago, Falconsfan567 said:

I don't think anyone here would disagree with Manny being the better player. But neither fits into the Braves situation, and if we had to choose one or the other, Harper fits with the Braves better. But neither really does because both are liabilities defensively and will simply cost too much money. You want to be able to keep guys like Acuna and Albies around for the long-term (meaning 10-15 years instead of only 6-7 years)? The pitchers that we're developing? Well then you have to plan for it years in advance.

I also don't think he understands that we have our 3B of the future and a very good SS. Harper just fits better with this team because he could immediately step into RF. Machado isn't taking Dansby's place at SS (the defensive drop off would be huge), and he isn't that better at 3B. I don't think people understand just how important infield defense is. 

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Fun fact about Harper: He's had a WAR of 1.5 or less two out of the last three seasons. His seasons are like Star Trek movies. Every other one is good.

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On 10/10/2018 at 3:24 PM, Falconsfan567 said:

Yep. As much as I've beat the drum to bring Kid-K home I can't see the Braves sinking nearly $20 a year into a pitcher to pitch 60-70 innings per season.

Seems like a lot but having him would settle alot of nerves.

Lets spend the money now while guys like Acuna and Ozzie, Swanson etc are cheap.

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1 hour ago, falconsd56 said:

Seems like a lot but having him would settle alot of nerves.

Lets spend the money now while guys like Acuna and Ozzie, Swanson etc are cheap.

Herrera likely quite a bit less.

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55 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

Seems like a lot but having him would settle alot of nerves.

Lets spend the money now while guys like Acuna and Ozzie, Swanson etc are cheap.

One of the reasons the Braves were so good for so many years was because they spent their big time money on the rotation and lineup and pennies on the dollar on the bullpen. Now one can argue that always reared it's ugly head in postseason and I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that. But you can get just as good production for a lot less if you sign someone like Cody Allen or Kelvin Herrera. Personally, I'd rather have Cody Allen over Herrera because Allen gets more strikeouts without sacrificing any control.

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1 hour ago, Falconsfan567 said:

One of the reasons the Braves were so good for so many years was because they spent their big time money on the rotation and lineup and pennies on the dollar on the bullpen. Now one can argue that always reared it's ugly head in postseason and I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that. But you can get just as good production for a lot less if you sign someone like Cody Allen or Kelvin Herrera. Personally, I'd rather have Cody Allen over Herrera because Allen gets more strikeouts without sacrificing any control.

There is something to that but having a lock down closer is as much of a mental boost as it is the  actual innings...maybe freddie and any other brave who was here with him can talk him into a slight "hometown" discount

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24 minutes ago, falconsd56 said:

There is something to that but having a lock down closer is as much of a mental boost as it is the  actual innings...maybe freddie and any other brave who was here with him can talk him into a slight "hometown" discount

Look, I would love Kid K. I have been beating the drum for him all summer. But when you look at it rationally the Braves just don't have the ability to pay him the kind of money the Yankees are paying Aroldis Chapman. Kimbrel is said to absolutely love it in Boston and they can afford to pay him that kind of deal. I have a hard time believing he'd take less to come back to Atlanta even though it's his childhood team. But maybe he'd surprise us. As far as lock down closer, there's not this big difference between him and Cody Allen as you might think there is.

Check out the career numbers:

  • Craig Kimbrel = 333/367 (90.7%) Saves, 532 2/3 IP, .154 AVG, 1.91 ERA, 0.92 WHIP, 1.96 FIP
  • Cody Allen = 149/172 (86.6%) Saves, 440 2/3 IP, .217 AVG, 2.98 ERA, 1.19 WHIP, 3.17 FIP

I know we all get on Vizzy at times because he's got a tendency to walk the ballpark some nights, but when he isn't, well, he's lock down too.

  • Arodys Vizcaino = 49/61 (80.3%) Saves, 190 1/3 IP, .219 AVG, 3.03 ERA, 1.28 WHIP, 3.54 FIP

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I know today's game is so much into the bullpen locking it down but I think Smoltz is right. During the NLDS he said multiple times eventually the bullpen is going to break. You can only ride those arms for so long when you're pulling your starter early every night. KC was able to make two long runs and win 1 title. Cleveland got into the WS but failed to win it. Andrew Miller was phenomenal but all that work may have caught him now. He battled shoulder problems and posted a 4.24 when he was healthy. Just look at what Fredi did to his dominant bullpen of EOF, Venters and Kimbrel. Kimbrel escaped injury but his ERA was almost 5 in September of that collapse year when the bullpen was shot. We need a couple of good bullpen arms but we need to make sure we're strong everywhere else as well. 

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1 hour ago, Unkn0wn said:

I know today's game is so much into the bullpen locking it down but I think Smoltz is right. During the NLDS he said multiple times eventually the bullpen is going to break. You can only ride those arms for so long when you're pulling your starter early every night. KC was able to make two long runs and win 1 title. Cleveland got into the WS but failed to win it. Andrew Miller was phenomenal but all that work may have caught him now. He battled shoulder problems and posted a 4.24 when he was healthy. Just look at what Fredi did to his dominant bullpen of EOF, Venters and Kimbrel. Kimbrel escaped injury but his ERA was almost 5 in September of that collapse year when the bullpen was shot. We need a couple of good bullpen arms but we need to make sure we're strong everywhere else as well. 

I think the Braves are well equipped to do something like that if they add arms simply because of the SP depth in the minors. Barring trades they'll be able to rotate them like last season but I still think they need a dependable innings eater on the staff.

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On 10/10/2018 at 11:07 PM, Falconsfan567 said:

I don't think anyone here would disagree with Manny being the better player. But neither fits into the Braves situation, and if we had to choose one or the other, Harper fits with the Braves better. But neither really does because both are liabilities defensively and will simply cost too much money. You want to be able to keep guys like Acuna and Albies around for the long-term (meaning 10-15 years instead of only 6-7 years)? The pitchers that we're developing? Well then you have to plan for it years in advance.

Manny at 3B (where he's a superlative defensive player)
Riley in RF
Camargo UT

Seems like a fit to me.

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On 10/10/2018 at 11:36 PM, tl;dr said:

I also don't think he understands that we have our 3B of the future and a very good SS. Harper just fits better with this team because he could immediately step into RF. Machado isn't taking Dansby's place at SS (the defensive drop off would be huge), and he isn't that better at 3B. I don't think people understand just how important infield defense is. 

lmao, stop. Swanson has nowhere near the range or arm of Machado.  The Braves can play Machado or Camargo at EITHER 3rd base or shorstop. 

FROM HIS KNEE BRAH:

 

Related image

 

Image result for machado gif

 

Related image

 

Image result for machado gif

Edited by slickgadawg

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2 hours ago, Malachore said:

I think the Braves are well equipped to do something like that if they add arms simply because of the SP depth in the minors. Barring trades they'll be able to rotate them like last season but I still think they need a dependable innings eater on the staff.

They can definitely do it. We probably just can't add Kimbrel and his potential $18-20M a year and have it make sense.

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51 minutes ago, Unkn0wn said:

They can definitely do it. We probably just can't add Kimbrel and his potential $18-20M a year and have it make sense.

Totally agree, I said before that I didn't want to do it because of his increasing control problems, innings logged and he's at that number where closers regress. I'd much rather check in on Herrera and Allen.

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1 hour ago, K26dp said:

Manny at 3B (where he's a superlative defensive player)
Riley in RF
Camargo UT

Seems like a fit to me.

My man! Been saying this since the deadline.

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9 minutes ago, Malachore said:

Totally agree, I said before that I didn't want to do it because of his increasing control problems, innings logged and he's at that number where closers regress. I'd much rather check in on Herrera and Allen.

Cody Allen has logged more work than Kimbrel. Since coming into the league Allen has pitched 5 more innings than Kimbrel.  Allen also had a pretty bad year. His ERA was 4.76 and his whip was almost 1.4. Houston drilled him the LDS too. Hes got great stuff but there's a little hesitation in there from me.

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1 hour ago, slickgadawg said:

lmao, stop. Swanson has nowhere near the range or arm of Machado.  The Braves can play Machado or Camargo at EITHER 3rd base or shorstop. 

FROM HIS KNEE BRAH:

 

Related image

 

Image result for machado gif

 

Related image

 

Image result for machado gif

If we can sign him in FA, I'm all for it. But he isn't playing SS for us. Dansby is a better defensive SS than Machado. He could play over Camargo at 3B and I would be fine with that. But that would require Riley moving to the OF.

If that happens, then I'm all for signing Machado. But idk about Riley in the OF. It could work, it could not. I don't know enough about it to make that call 

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41 minutes ago, Unkn0wn said:

Cody Allen has logged more work than Kimbrel. Since coming into the league Allen has pitched 5 more innings than Kimbrel.  Allen also had a pretty bad year. His ERA was 4.76 and his whip was almost 1.4. Houston drilled him the LDS too. Hes got great stuff but there's a little hesitation in there from me.

Yes but Allen is likely much less, I'd prefer Herrera. 

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Bad news on Machado. Yankees lost Didi for the entire 2019 season. They may now go all in on Manny and offer him the chance to be a SS. Yankees are reportedly one of us top targets. He likes their young core.

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4 hours ago, K26dp said:

Manny at 3B (where he's a superlative defensive player)
Riley in RF
Camargo UT

Seems like a fit to me.

Everyone suggests Riley to the OF without a shred of evidence that he's even capable of handling it?

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