PeytonMannings Forehead

Let's Talk About: Missed Opportunities (Game 1)

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I dont necessarily agree that Sanu is open there but I do think thats the better place to go with the football. 

I think Ryan's clock sped up quite a bit because of the pressure in the second half. 

 

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4 minutes ago, osiruz said:

Which is a stupid idea in a game deciding situation where he isn't the first read. 

Your first read gets determined by your pre-snap read.  Quarterbacks at the NFL level and especially so if we're talking about one the caliber of Matt, they don't just go from one, to two, to three.  They find a key in the coverage to tell them what routes will be eliminated so the ball can come out as fast as possible. 

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12 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

@schwarzenegger123 man come on.  Are you serious?  I showed three plays with (two of them with wide open receivers) and you're saying none of them had a chance to work?

They are only wide open if the QB has the time to see them and they were schemed to be open.  On  the goal line, Freeman should have been covered.  I agree that Ryan screwed up here an should have probably made the correct adjustment, but again with the defense called that was a low percent play from the start.  You have to admit there are about a dozen different calls out of the same formation against the same defense that had a higher probability of working.

With the INT, again I do blame Ryan.  The Eagles sent 7 against 6 defenders.  Ryan should have known that there was zero chance of making that play to JJ, but we needed two yards.  Why was this called in the first place.  The 5 yard drag should have been the first read, especially since there was an obviously blitz.  If they peeled off into coverage then the seven route and what ever the other deep route to the right are your 2 and 3, but you have time to make that read.  You can't with seven guys in your face.

Yes, bad decision by Ryan.  Agreed, but he was put is a very bad position.  On both plays.  We have got to do better all the way around, but it has to start with the coaching and getting the players in a good position to make plays.  That is all I am saying.

But I do like your breakdown and analysis, so thank you for the opportunity to see a different point of view and to debate with someone who knows football. 

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7 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

I dont necessarily agree that Sanu is open there but I do think thats the better place to go with the football. 

I think Ryan's clock sped up quite a bit because of the pressure in the second half. 

 

 

This is NFL open my man.  Sanu had his man worked in to perfect position to cross his face and to run into all that open space.  #24 the only one who could have made a play was so terrified of Julio, he never took his eyes off him and took himself right out of the play.  All that space was Sanu's who got open on a key conversion on a similar route a few plays before.

IMG_3957

 

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Just now, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

 

This is NFL open my man.  Sanu had his man worked in to perfect position to cross his face and to run into all that open space.  #24 the only one who could have made a play was so terrified of Julio, he never took his eyes off him and took himself right out of the play.  All that space was Sanu's who got open on a key conversion on a similar route a few plays before.

IMG_3957

 

Yes, thats where the ball should go. When I say that I dont agree that he's necessarily open, I mean "theres a defender right there who is in position to make a good play on the ball/receiver." 

Which is a roundabout way of saying I dont think going to Sanu there is a sure thing "count it!" TD. Its unquestionably a better situation than trying to hit the throw he made. 

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4 minutes ago, schwarzenegger321 said:

They are only wide open if the QB has the time to see them and they were schemed to be open.  On  the goal line, Freeman should have been covered.  I agree that Ryan screwed up here an should have probably made the correct adjustment, but again with the defense called that was a low percent play from the start.  You have to admit there are about a dozen different calls out of the same formation against the same defense that had a higher probability of working.

  • Well, sure.  I can go round and round about what I could have called there, but I can only critique what I'm seeing and that call was designed to work against man or zone.  And had every opportunity to work.  I mean I like that call a lot better than the one that ended the game (which I kind of hated) but I am totally open to anyone wanting to make the point that Julio one-on-one with anyone is the right way to do.

With the INT, again I do blame Ryan.  The Eagles sent 7 against 6 defenders.  Ryan should have known that there was zero chance of making that play to JJ, but we needed two yards.  Why was this called in the first place.  The 5 yard drag should have been the first read, especially since there was an obviously blitz.  If they peeled off into coverage then the seven route and what ever the other deep route to the right are your 2 and 3, but you have time to make that read.  You can't with seven guys in your face.

  • Again, it was one of those plays designed to be successful against two different types of defenses.  It didn't even look like it was designed for Julio to be anything other than a check in the miraculous event he did get wide open.  His route looked like it was designed to clear out the coverage for the underneath receivers to work. The opportunity to convert against even a blitz was there, which is all you can ask for.  It's up to our quarterback to sort out where to go with the ball.  You got a pressure pre-snap look and Sanu's defender standing 7 yards off the ball; that's not hard to read.  Even at the snap, Sanu's guy didn't drive on him, he actually backpeddled and gave Sanu all kinds of space.

Yes, bad decision by Ryan.  Agreed, but he was put is a very bad position.  On both plays.  We have got to do better all the way around, but it has to start with the coaching and getting the players in a good position to make plays.  That is all I am saying.

But I do like your breakdown and analysis, so thank you for the opportunity to see a different point of view and to debate with someone who knows football. 

  • Hey no problem at all bro.  Respect.  I enjoy a spirited discussion.  This football team belongs to all of us.

 

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14 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

Yes, thats where the ball should go. When I say that I dont agree that he's necessarily open, I mean "theres a defender right there who is in position to make a good play on the ball/receiver." 

Which is a roundabout way of saying I dont think going to Sanu there is a sure thing "count it!" TD. Its unquestionably a better situation than trying to hit the throw he made. 

Gotcha.  

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Peyton, 

 

Matt has played better than this.  What do you think could be the reason he had tunnel vision to Julio last night.  We have seen him do this from time to time. 

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Exactly what I kept trying to tell people all night. Matt Ryan played like *** and was not seeing the field. There were guys open all night and Matt never saw them because he wasn't seeing the field the way the 2nd highest paid QB in NFL history should. But it's easy to just blame Sark for some folks instead of actually using a little bit of common sense and seeing that the play calls were fine and plays where there to be made and they weren't made.

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3 minutes ago, bighurt said:

Peyton, 

 

Matt has played better than this.  What do you think could be the reason he had tunnel vision to Julio last night.  We have seen him do this from time to time. 

I don't know, man.  I can only speculate.

It's obvious from the open that there was a concerted effort to get Julio the ball, and I don't know how much all the offseason chatter played into it, if everyone was feeling that pressure, but it did work.  I mean the Eagles didn't really have an answer for him and you feed the hot hand.  Matt always did joke that he believed Julio was always his best option, even if he was covered.  

This is just me totally guessing, I preface this by sayin I could be 100% wrong, but it didn't look like we really got into the whole offense last night, and I think part of that was we couldn't get any rhythm going off the running game, which we believe in working everything off of.  

Sometimes when you put together your call sheet you go in with a section of stuff you want to get to that's like dessert.  Dessert may be something you got featured for maybe Calvin, or a deep crossing route to Sanu that you hit off a play action after the defense has been forced to put a safety in the box because you've been running on them.  But you can't get to none of that (dessert) until you eat your vegetables.  The run game is our vegetables and last night we choked on 'em.

That's as broad a way as I can describe it, but I can just about guarantee there was more stuff, featuring more weapons that we were trying to get up, but couldn't because we were scrambling in the second half just to stay on the field.  We had penalties at the worst time (a few totally bogus), then we had a couple of ugly negative runs and now suddenly to you gotta worry about digging out of a 2nd and 25 hole, instead of opening things up.

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This is great stuff. No matter how well you play open receivers will always be missed. How much would you attribute to Matt not playing many snaps in preseason and facing a defense as good as Philly?

 

Last question, how would you have attacked the Philly defense on 1st and goal from 10 with no timeouts and where our line could not protect? On most of those plays, the wide receivers had not even reached the end zone before they got pressure.

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1 hour ago, osiruz said:

Mr2 had to let that go before Sanu got open. The protection wasn't there all evening. Same with the Julio play, he was not open. Julio ran right at a lber or db instead of into space. 

You're missing the point. Matt Ryan didn't read the play correctly presnap. Even someone as dumb as Cris Collinsworth read it presnap that Julio was doubled and that he shouldn't have even been an option on the play. Why didn't Ryan see it and eliminate Julio as an option before the snap even happened?

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9 minutes ago, Falconsfan567 said:

Exactly what I kept trying to tell people all night. Matt Ryan played like *** and was not seeing the field. There were guys open all night and Matt never saw them because he wasn't seeing the field the way the 2nd highest paid QB in NFL history should. But it's easy to just blame Sark for some folks instead of actually using a little bit of common sense and seeing that the play calls were fine and plays where there to be made and they weren't made.

I agree but defensive pressure will do that to any quarterback. Look at Tom Brady in the first half of the super bowl. He missed throws and open receivers. Matt didn’t play well last night but he was not alone. I’ve always said QB’s get too much credit when you win and too much blame when you lose. When a QB wins the mvp, it is a combination of everyone on offense playing well.

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1 hour ago, Stryka said:

One thing I noticed about Matt last night was that on this play and another play to Julio, he is throwing the ball in the direction of the WR who is being interfered with to bring attention to the call.  Instead of him trying to make a play, he is trying to get the call.  I understand it somewhat but I would rather him look for the open WR instead of the WR that gets hit.  Rodgers would look to get in the endzone and then let the call be a fallback to if he doesnt make the play.  I need Ryan to be more heady around the goalline.  This hurt me but not as much as Tony Gonzalez wide Open for the game winning TD in 2012 vs SF.  He doesnt even look his way. Instead forces it through traffic. Sigh

Thing is we bitched about Ryan not trying to draw flags for years because he was too afraid of turnovers and rather play it safe instead of risky like guys like Brady and Brees do. That's one of the reasons he has less TD passes than those guys. Then last night he tries to get the flag and doesn't get it and now folks are *****ing about that.

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2 minutes ago, Jpg428gggg said:

I agree but defensive pressure will do that to any quarterback. Look at Tom Brady in the first half of the super bowl. He missed throws and open receivers. Matt didn’t play well last night but he was not alone. I’ve always said QB’s get too much credit when you win and too much blame when you lose. When a QB wins the mvp, it is a combination of everyone on offense playing well.

The OL was bad last night. No doubt about it. But they did well enough on some of these plays and Ryan just didn't get the job done. He missed an easy TD throw to Freeman on the opening drive and then the Julio play should have been a lay up TD. Seriously. Julio had his man beat badly and all Ryan has to do is lob it to him for the easy TD and instead he makes this huge arching rainbow throw where Julio is having to look directly over his shoulder to find the ball which led to the juggling act and the play being called incomplete. There's no excuses for a guy who has won an MVP to not make those throws. There were others too. 3rd down play to Julio where he throws it way behind him and allows the defender to knock it away.

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1 hour ago, nomak said:

Maybe not having Free and Julio in preseason games hurt them.

Nah

First real game of the season is soon enough to find out what your team looks like./purp

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21 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

I don't know, man.  I can only speculate.

It's obvious from the open that there was a concerted effort to get Julio the ball, and I don't know how much all the offseason chatter played into it, if everyone was feeling that pressure, but it did work.  I mean the Eagles didn't really have an answer for him and you feed the hot hand.  Matt always did joke that he believed Julio was always his best option, even if he was covered.  

This is just me totally guessing, I preface this by sayin I could be 100% wrong, but it didn't look like we really got into the whole offense last night, and I think part of that was we couldn't get any rhythm going off the running game, which we believe in working everything off of.  

Sometimes when you put together your call sheet you go in with a section of stuff you want to get to that's like dessert.  Dessert may be something you got featured for maybe Calvin, or a deep crossing route to Sanu that you hit off a play action after the defense has been forced to put a safety in the box because you've been running on them.  But you can't get to none of that (dessert) until you eat your vegetables.  The run game is our vegetables and last night we choked on 'em.

That's as broad a way as I can describe it, but I can just about guarantee there was more stuff, featuring more weapons that we were trying to get up, but couldn't because we were scrambling in the second half just to stay on the field.  We had penalties at the worst time (a few totally bogus), then we had a couple of ugly negative runs and now suddenly to you gotta worry about digging out of a 2nd and 25 hole, instead of opening things up.

Exactly. We didn't see a single bootleg play to the TE dragging across the backside which is a staple play of the WCO. I think we only had 2 or 3 PA passes all night. Hard to run those plays when the run-action isn't forcing the defense's hand.

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5 minutes ago, Falconsfan567 said:

The OL was bad last night. No doubt about it. But they did well enough on some of these plays and Ryan just didn't get the job done. He missed an easy TD throw to Freeman on the opening drive and then the Julio play should have been a lay up TD. Seriously. Julio had his man beat badly and all Ryan has to do is lob it to him for the easy TD and instead he makes this huge arching rainbow throw where Julio is having to look directly over his shoulder to find the ball which led to the juggling act and the play being called incomplete. There's no excuses for a guy who has won an MVP to not make those throws. There were others too. 3rd down play to Julio where he throws it way behind him and allows the defender to knock it away.

LOL! Julio never makes mistakes.  Whatever.  The offense sucked last night.  Even Julio gave up on some plays.  The int was on Julio not running the right route to which he owned up to. But it falls in Ryan's lap.

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1 minute ago, Falconsfan567 said:

Exactly. We didn't see a single bootleg play to the TE dragging across the backside which is a staple play of the WCO. I think we only had 2 or 3 PA passes all night. Hard to run those plays when the run-action isn't forcing the defense's hand.

They gave up on the run game too soon by Sark continuing calling runs to the edge that never worked.  But by god he kept trying.

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NO OFFENSE will have a wide open receiver schemed open in the red zone against the Eagles Defense.  We obviously didn't see Shanahan do it in 2016 vs. the Eagles.  So Those one of one matchups where the receiver has a decent chance of making the contented catch is as good as it gets against this Defense.  

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I forget when the play was, but Matt's pocket presence was much worse than in the past. One play he could have slid right with no rush left and instead he bumbled straight ahead and was sacked soon thereafter, ending a drive.

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4 minutes ago, nomak said:

LOL! Julio never makes mistakes.  Whatever.  The offense sucked last night.  Even Julio gave up on some plays.  The int was on Julio not running the right route to which he owned up to. But it falls in Ryan's lap.

Where did I say that Julio never makes mistakes? I never even mentioned anything about the interception. WTF are you talking about?

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31 minutes ago, Falconsfan567 said:

Exactly what I kept trying to tell people all night. Matt Ryan played like *** and was not seeing the field. There were guys open all night and Matt never saw them because he wasn't seeing the field the way the 2nd highest paid QB in NFL history should. But it's easy to just blame Sark for some folks instead of actually using a little bit of common sense and seeing that the play calls were fine and plays where there to be made and they weren't made.

Sark was not fine. He was just as bad as Ryan..

Read the thread. 

We have Freeman and Coleman yet Sark refuses to incorporate our backs into the passing game. 

Runs extremely low percentage packages in the redzone. 

Takes Julio off the field for all the 4 downs on our first drive when it was & goal. 

The guys sucks. He's never been more than an average coordinator in college. I have no idea why DQ thought he could all the sudden be legit in the NFL. 

We handed the keys to our Ferrari to a grandma and now we're wondering why she isn't getting the most out of it? 

Pathetic.

Edited by Bobby.Digital
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