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Falconsfan567

Johnny Manziel

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5 hours ago, Wjcorner said:

Are you distinguishing scrambling QBs from dual threat guys here? Because if not, how can you hate players like Wentz, McNabb, Cam, Vick, Cunningham, etc.

Manziel and RG3 were not dual threats. Neither was Vick. Don’t @ me

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9 hours ago, Wjcorner said:

Are you distinguishing scrambling QBs from dual threat guys here? Because if not, how can you hate players like Wentz, McNabb, Cam, Vick, Cunningham, etc.

They’re not alll the same type. (Which I think you are implying)

some are running QBs- Vick, Cam, RG3, Cunningham, manziel, etc. none of these guys have consistently been able to be successful passers. Cunningham figured it out in his later years, and was the best passer of all these guys by far. These QBs never would have made it without running. Vick was not a dual threat IMO. Without running he was nothing special.

wentz is a passer who can run, and is more like Wilson, Rodgers, Luck, McNabb, etc.

there is nothing wrong with being able to run, it’s the QBs who prefer to run and base their games on it that are overrated and rarely have long term success. 

There are tons of running QBs littered in CFB, and it still hasn’t translated to the NFL because it doesn’t work. You can’t feast on lesser athletes like you can in college.

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8 minutes ago, 1989Fan said:

They’re not alll the same type. (Which I think you are implying)

some are running QBs- Vick, Cam, RG3, Cunningham, manziel, etc. none of these guys have consistently been able to be successful passers. Cunningham figured it out in his later years, and was the best passer of all these guys by far. These QBs never would have made it without running. Vick was not a dual threat IMO. Without running he was nothing special.

wentz is a passer who can run, and is more like Wilson, Rodgers, Luck, McNabb, etc.

there is nothing wrong with being able to run, it’s the QBs who prefer to run and base their games on it that are overrated and rarely have long term success. 

There are tons of running QBs littered in CFB, and it still hasn’t translated to the NFL because it doesn’t work. You can’t feast on lesser athletes like you can in college.

Seeing that Cam can actually pass accurately I’ll consider him dual threat. He just needs receivers

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4 minutes ago, ya_boi_j said:

Seeing that Cam can actually pass accurately I’ll consider him dual threat. He just needs receivers

He reminds me of Vick throwing some. Guns the ball, struggles with anything w loft or touch. I haven’t seen enough with him on throws that aren’t darts, but you may watch him more than I. They always also try to get him the biggest receiver targets they can (besides the OSU kid this past year). I could be wrong though, and I am okay w that.

Of the list he is the closest to being moved to dual threat though, well besides Cunningham. IMO he is definitely closer in game to guys like Vick than guys like Wilson or rodgers .

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7 hours ago, I give lengthy responses said:

How are all those dudes except Cam associated with the Eagles...

They’re dual threat U for QBs apparently :lol:

 

i kinda noticed it afterwards...pretty crazy how each team can have its own...’thing’ through multiple coaching staffs 

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Not a fan of the Manziel antics but the guy had about 4 practices in a new offensive system against his former team. The offensive and defensive set ups are so different in that game my head is spinning watching it sometimes. He was in a no win situation and surprised in wasn't 7 interceptions. They rushed him out there for name recognition. 

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3 minutes ago, Wjcorner said:

@ya_boi_j

 

thanks for the clarification :rolleyes:

Love the sarcasm but in order to be a dual threat you have to actually be great at both aspects, not just one. 

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Just now, ya_boi_j said:

Love the sarcasm but in order to be a dual threat you have to actually be great at both aspects, not just one. 

I was being serious about clarifying, that’s why I asked if you distinguished scramblers from dual threats...the ‘sarcasm’ was me @‘n’ you 

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3 minutes ago, Wjcorner said:

I was being serious about clarifying, that’s why I asked if you distinguished scramblers from dual threats...the ‘sarcasm’ was me @‘n’ you 

I know that’s why I love it. You actually did it within the post lol. Manziel, RG3 and Vick were all popular for their running. Manziel wouldn’t even be talked about as a passer if it wasn’t for Mike Evans. Let’s just be honest lol. RG3 and Vick were the typical athletes who ran a fast 40 and had a strong arm. Neither were great passers though. Cam is a better passer than both IMO. The other qbs you named are legit dual threats imo

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1 hour ago, 1989Fan said:

He reminds me of Vick throwing some. Guns the ball, struggles with anything w loft or touch. I haven’t seen enough with him on throws that aren’t darts, but you may watch him more than I. They always also try to get him the biggest receiver targets they can (besides the OSU kid this past year). I could be wrong though, and I am okay w that.

Of the list he is the closest to being moved to dual threat though, well besides Cunningham. IMO he is definitely closer in game to guys like Vick than guys like Wilson or rodgers .

They have never got him a legit receiving target since Smith left. Olsen is the only reliable set of hands he’s had to work with. Ted Ginn, Benjamin, Funchess all below average. He has never had the privilege to work with the type of receivers guys like Matt Ryan, Aaron Rodgers, Matthew Stafford , etc have had. 

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I think Johnny can play.  This is his first game in years.  Honestly that second pick was an amazing play by him.  The receiver should've caught it.  After that he was just trying to force throws and it wasn't working.

I think we should buy low on Manziel and let him ride the pine behind Matt.  That's assuming Manziel stays clean through the season and turns it around with his play.

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9 hours ago, Falconsfan567 said:

BTW, speaking of Brees, I keep wondering what might have been had the Falcons done what I wanted them to do in 2001. I wanted the Chargers draft. I wanted LT and Brees.

Let's not open that can of worms again...

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2 minutes ago, BoomGoesTheDynamite said:

Well. Now Cam has CMC and DJ Moore so we'll see if he really is a great pocket passer as soon as this season.

Torrey Smith is their most experienced wr and he is no where near the talent of any of the qbs I named has had or have. Moore isn’t even officially a starter as of right now so it’s not gonna be that easy to see how good he is this season

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4 minutes ago, DogIsYourName said:

I think Johnny can play.  This is his first game in years.  Honestly that second pick was an amazing play by him.  The receiver should've caught it.  After that he was just trying to force throws and it wasn't working.

I think we should buy low on Manziel and let him ride the pine behind Matt.  That's assuming Manziel stays clean through the season and turns it around with his play.

Manziel has always sucked. Much more talented back ups around than him

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12 hours ago, ya_boi_j said:

Manziel was overhyped like RG3 and was never bound for success in the big leagues. Hope he has his life together but football isn’t for him

He had some outstanding receivers at Texas.  More than once he threw up a desperation pass and it was hauled in.  Then JM gets the credit for a great arm.   Oh well, no sense in bashing him.  He's showing that he is what he is.............

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Just now, ya_boi_j said:

Torrey Smith is their most experienced wr and he is no where near the talent of any of the qbs I named has had or have. Moore isn’t even officially a starter as of right now so it’s not gonna be that easy to see how good he is this season

From what little I've heard from Pants camp. their pretty high on Moore and he had a lot of 'experts' singing his praises. I remember seeing some on YT saying he was supposed to be the best WR in the draft.

Granted most of the NFL draft books had him anywhere from the 4th to 12th best WR (Athlon Sports has him as the 4th best) , but he's been getting talked about a lot. Honestly IDK, but with Norv apparently teaching Cam to checkdown more we might see something really dangerous from the Pants this year.  

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3 minutes ago, BoomGoesTheDynamite said:

From what little I've heard from Pants camp. their pretty high on Moore and he had a lot of 'experts' singing his praises. I remember seeing some on YT saying he was supposed to be the best WR in the draft.

Granted most of the NFL draft books had him anywhere from the 4th to 12th best WR (Athlon Sports has him as the 4th best) , but he's been getting talked about a lot. Honestly IDK, but with Norv apparently teaching Cam to checkdown more we might see something really dangerous from the Pants this year.  

Yeah but let’s be honest, it’s camp lol. Who doesn’t get high praise during non contact drills and no real competition. See duke Riley last year. Now I’m not saying Moore isn’t good or anything but camp is camp

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1 minute ago, ya_boi_j said:

Yeah but let’s be honest, it’s camp lol. Who doesn’t get high praise during non contact drills and no real competition. See duke Riley last year. Now I’m not saying Moore isn’t good or anything but camp is camp

That's a good point

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2 minutes ago, BoomGoesTheDynamite said:

That's a good point

Personally I hope Moore is the real deal. I love competition. Get tired of seeing cam have success against the birds with below average wide receivers 

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8 hours ago, JerseyNo12 said:

No, RG3 let success get to his head. He thought he could run Kyle's system as more of a pocket passer in just his second year when he has little prior experience being under center, much less going through more than one or two progressions. He still has problems reading defenses and throwing passes on time.

Part of his attempting to be a pocket passer was to avoid another injury though. Once defenses figured out the read option he and Kap fell apart, but I think without that torn ACL we'd be watching a totally different player.

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Just now, ya_boi_j said:

Personally I hope Moore is the real deal. I love competition. Get tired of seeing cam have success against the birds with below average wide receivers 

Hoping that D will finally get right and we can do to Cam what the Broncos did in the SB but we'll do it every year to everybody.

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