Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

TheRisen999

Overreaction

48 posts in this topic

I think the problem might have been Sark not coming in and taking charge of the offense like Kyle did. Our guys are not disciplined and I think that's probably because Sark was the outsider walking into a historic offense with stars all over. And he was learning OUR offense, that's a hard spot to be in charge from.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, UnrealfalcoN said:

I think the problem might have been Sark not coming in and taking charge of the offense like Kyle did. Our guys are not disciplined and I think that's probably because Sark was the outsider walking into a historic offense with stars all over. And he was learning OUR offense, that's a hard spot to be in charge from.

exactly. he was put in a terrible position from the start and that's on Quinn. if he wanted someone to run Kyle's offense then he should have promoted either LaFluer or McDaniels, guys that have been with Kyle for years and know his tendencies in play-calling. I think the offense might have performed better if Sark was just allowed to install his offense from the beginning and that way there wouldn't be any expectations. by telling us we're 'keeping the same offense' people are expecting 30 points a game and that's not fair to put Sark in that position, especially with his drinking problems.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, raysnill1 said:

exactly. he was put in a terrible position from the start and that's on Quinn. if he wanted someone to run Kyle's offense then he should have promoted either LaFluer or McDaniels, guys that have been with Kyle for years and know his tendencies in play-calling. I think the offense might have performed better if Sark was just allowed to install his offense from the beginning and that way there wouldn't be any expectations. by telling us we're 'keeping the same offense' people are expecting 30 points a game and that's not fair to put Sark in that position, especially with his drinking problems.

And his playcalling and his nature as the OC gave many of us fans drinking problems... :(

PokerSteve likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, JDaveG said:

Agree, though I think we need a Couple of pieces rather than a new line. 

 I will be curious and a bit anxious to see if Quinn can identify talent on the offensive side of the ball. Last year‘s draft and Hooper regressing have me a bit concerned. Last year‘s draft had upwards of 12 impactful running backs that all contributed… Ours didn’t make it out of preseason before being moved to PS.  I am hopeful that Dimitrov handles the offense evaluations this year

JDaveG likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, emc008 said:

I think Sark is an issue, just not as bad as this board has crucified him for entirely. Yes he has "questionable calls like all OC's do" but I feel he had many more of those than other OC's. Unfortunately his questionable calls were more like "WTF calls" in my book. This would make them much worse than questionable which overshadows some of the normal/good things he did as an OC. I struggle with Sark because of his predictability. Multiple teams suggested knowing the plays or formations that led to a certain play. This bothers me much more than some of his actual "toss right" plays. I loved Shannahan's lack of predictability. I would sit there watching and telling my wife "watch this is about to be the play" and the play would totally be opposite and surprise me. Sark just seems to lack that portion of playcalling.

Hopefully, they have learned from the predictability of the offense and will properly adjust it this off season. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Mid-Nite-Toker said:

I think the worst thing the Falcon organization can do is panic...stay the course.

Exactly my thoughts aswell.

Reacess and go again.

1 hour ago, falconticket said:

Sarks first year does not remotely resemble shanny's first year, except to the simplest of football minds. Shanny had a plan and a goal. Sark has no plan and will probably regress in second year. 

You know this how for that too happen Falcon Pass catchers would have to lead the league in drops again and our RBs would have to be in the top percentile in fumbles again.I laugh at people like you who refuse to see how that effects results.

 

1 hour ago, PokerSteve said:

My sentiments exactly. Predictability is the bane of any offensive football scheme. It can never be part of a successful scheme, but it can definitely be a part of a failed scheme, including being the most significant reason for the failure.

Yes and know if your talking being predictable is going to Julio 10-12 times a game I'll take that predictable all day.

Or making sure the Freeman/Coleman duo get 30 touches a game I can live with that.

End of the day the other teams still gotta stop it.The only thing that kills that predictability that you speak of is execution on our side.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is the play calling causing the bad execution? It's been a problem all season...what as a coach was Sark doing to fix it? Every game seemed like a preseason game...kust throwing plays out there to see if they'd work. 

They play an injured RB and pretty much shafted the RB who obviously was the better back that day. The problem is a coaching problem. The team was rarely prepared on the offensive side of the ball. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, raysnill1 said:

so you're saying an O-line that ran the ball as well as the previous historic season and produced the lowest sack total in Falcons history wasn't that bad when you look at they weren't helped much by play-calling. hmmmm. by all accounts then if we did scheme receivers open and use more play action and misdirection then the offense would look a lot better. it would probably help if receivers wouldn't tip easy catches, turning them into INTs too. you would think we got blown out 38-3 the way this place is overreacting.

Are we talking about where we are as a team?  If so, our defense improved by leaps and bounds over last season, and that kept us competitive this season.  Are we talking about our step back on offense?  If so, then let's not move the target talking about how much we lost by.  

We were unable to score 20 in 7 games this season.  In our last 7 games, we were held below 14 three separate times.  In almost half of our last 7 games we couldn't score more than 13 points.  You would think Sark and the offense would get better as he got more comfortable, but we didn't, which is scary going into next season with him.  

The tipped pass INT's were frustrating, but let's put that in perspective.  Our scoring went down by 187 points this season.  Even if every single one of those 7 tipped INT's would have been TD drives, which they would not have been based on our effectiveness scoring on all of our other drives, our scoring still would've went down by 138 points this season. 

Our TD percentage in the Red Zone went down by over 15% from 2016 to 2017.  We also averaged almost one less trip to the Red Zone every single game.  Those are MAJOR factors that are largely influenced by the OC scheming against opposing defenses.  

We had 10 less 40 yard plays.  We had 18 less 20+ yard plays.  Our offense took a major step back across the board.  

TheRisen999 and caponine like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, pzummo said:

Are we talking about where we are as a team?  If so, our defense improved by leaps and bounds over last season, and that kept us competitive this season.  Are we talking about our step back on offense?  If so, then let's not move the target talking about how much we lost by.  

We were unable to score 20 in 7 games this season.  In our last 7 games, we were held below 14 three separate times.  In almost half of our last 7 games we couldn't score more than 13 points.  You would think Sark and the offense would get better as he got more comfortable, but we didn't, which is scary going into next season with him.  

The tipped pass INT's were frustrating, but let's put that in perspective.  Our scoring went down by 187 points this season.  Even if every single one of those 7 tipped INT's would have been TD drives, which they would not have been based on our effectiveness scoring on all of our other drives, our scoring still would've went down by 138 points this season. 

Our TD percentage in the Red Zone went down by over 15% from 2016 to 2017.  We also averaged almost one less trip to the Red Zone every single game.  Those are MAJOR factors that are largely influenced by the OC scheming against opposing defenses.  

We had 10 less 40 yard plays.  We had 18 less 20+ yard plays.  Our offense took a major step back across the board.  

Matt threw TDs to what 11 last year and 5 this year? Play calling and depth across the board.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My overall take on the season:

After Pats game I adjusted my expectations for this season.

There were a lot of things wrong on both sides of the ball in the first half of the season.

For the most part the defense got things figured out second half of season and are still trending up as long as this off-season is handled correctly. Line is what still needs some attention.

Offense never really looked right on a consistent bases but also had some flashes. At times it was on Sark, others it was on the line, MR2 or the incomprehensible amount of drops.

This is a 10 win team that was either a higher throw on third down or a lower throw on 4th down from getting to b2b nfccgs. As much as we want to be pissed about losing. This team battled, wasn't great, but was still that close to a 2nd consecutive nfccg. All this doom and gloom is unwarranted.

You tweak teams that barely missed the nffcg you don't blow them up.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, RobSalvador said:

Matt threw TDs to what 11 last year and 5 this year? Play calling and depth across the board.

I think it was actually 13, NFL record. Great point.

TheRisen999 likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, kschreck said:

My overall take on the season:

After Pats game I adjusted my expectations for this season.

There were a lot of things wrong on both sides of the ball in the first half of the season.

For the most part the defense got things figured out second half of season and are still trending up as long as this off-season is handled correctly. Line is what still needs some attention.

Offense never really looked right on a consistent bases but also had some flashes. At times it was on Sark, others it was on the line, MR2 or the incomprehensible amount of drops.

This is a 10 win team that was either a higher throw on third down or a lower throw on 4th down from getting to b2b nfccgs. As much as we want to be pissed about losing. This team battled, wasn't great, but was still that close to a 2nd consecutive nfccg. All this doom and gloom is unwarranted.

You tweak teams that barely missed the nffcg you don't blow them up.

 

 

 

My emotions don't match your logic. Quinn is the guy and we should've hired Gruden to coach the offense > Sark /troffurpled

PokerSteve likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2018 at 10:45 AM, slamee101 said:

I say we bookmark this thread and see if it was an overreaction at this time next year.

I think thats fair..

PokerSteve likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2018 at 11:07 AM, PokerSteve said:

My sentiments exactly. Predictability is the bane of any offensive football scheme. It can never be part of a successful scheme, but it can definitely be a part of a failed scheme, including being the most significant reason for the failure.

I am not a Sark fan, but willing to give him a chance to improve, since he is not going anywhere this year. However he was having to learn a completely alien offense, pretty much on the fly.  No way he was going to be as familiar with Shanny's system as Shanny , in one year. The nuances in Shanny's system of which you speak, like formations and PA, SHOULD come this year, after Sark and whoever , go over tape of last year, and get more familiar with the system.  We shall see.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2018 at 2:02 PM, crimsonhawk said:

This is TAFT.....your question is rhetorical....

Not to mention your rhetoric is questionable....    :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, HMFIC said:

I am not a Sark fan, but willing to give him a chance to improve, since he is not going anywhere this year. However he was having to learn a completely alien offense, pretty much on the fly.  No way he was going to be as familiar with Shanny's system as Shanny , in one year. The nuances in Shanny's system of which you speak, like formations and PA, SHOULD come this year, after Sark and whoever , go over tape of last year, and get more familiar with the system.  We shall see.

It is going to be interesting to say the least. Many in here like you are saying with another year under his belt Sark will be much more in tune with the finer points of Shanny's offense. Others are saying we are starting to filter incoming offensive players by how well they can play in Sark's run-first, ball-control scheme.

I honestly don't know what to hope for ~ he tries to figure out Shanny's system or starts implementing his scheme from scratch. Either way, I doubt we hit 30 points on offense in the first five or six games of next season. That's just the optimist coming out in me. lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, PokerSteve said:

It is going to be interesting to say the least. Many in here like you are saying with another year under his belt Sark will be much more in tune with the finer points of Shanny's offense. Others are saying we are starting to filter incoming offensive players by how well they can play in Sark's run-first, ball-control scheme.

I honestly don't know what to hope for ~ he tries to figure out Shanny's system or starts implementing his scheme from scratch. Either way, I doubt we hit 30 points on offense in the first five or six games of next season. That's just the optimist coming out in me. lol

Shanny always said that his scheme was a run first scheme,The difference is how MUCH of a run first scheme it was, as opposed to Sarks. I think the most important word in my first post was "SHOULD". I just don't think that there is any way Sark will be allowed to install his own, college type scheme.  He is going to keep, or lose, his job running Shanny's scheme .  The whole organization from the top down , are so enamored with the results of Shanny's second year to allow any significant changes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2018 at 9:39 AM, octoslash said:

The awful offensive line is a MUCH bigger problem than the inexperienced OC. 

If they don't fix the line it won't matter if Bill Walsh himself pops out of his box and heads over to Flowery Branch.

The line really wasn’t that much of a problem as fans would believe either. The running game was on par with last season. Matt was hit/sacked similar to last season. The issue with the offense last year was 

1. Player execution 

2. Sark didn’t get a look at the offense with Julio and Gabriel until pre season. That throws an offense off BIG TIME. Especially for a new OC and as a result doesn’t know how to use his full arsenal

3.  The loss of Aldrick Robinson was bigger than ppl think. With both he and Gabriels speed on the field it out a TON of pressure on safeties to make a decision quicker. We simply weren’t as fast on offense last year in the seams. 

4. There was a full season of film to study of the offense so we were played different the the previous year. We were met with MUCH more man to man last year than the previous and safeties played us deeper than the SB year as well which makes the loss of Robinson even more hurtful. 

5. We just couldn’t punch it in once we got in the red zone like Quinn/Shanny’s 1st year. The line wasn’t the issue. We made it to the second round of the playoffs and should’ve made it to the 3rd if only we could punch it in the end zone. Line Play had nothing to do with it. Had a key injury to Levitre but Wes got better as the year went on. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2018 at 10:27 AM, NYCFalc said:

A lot of fans don’t really understand what they are really seeing when they watch a game. Those folks tend to be the loudest.

Tell me what you saw on the shuttle pass to the 3rd string RB, when T Coleman was torching Philly on that final drive and all game long.  Tell us idiots what was really going on there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, TheFatboi said:

The line really wasn’t that much of a problem as fans would believe either. The running game was on par with last season. Matt was hit/sacked similar to last season. The issue with the offense last year was 

1. Player execution 

2. Sark didn’t get a look at the offense with Julio and Gabriel until pre season. That throws an offense off BIG TIME. Especially for a new OC and as a result doesn’t know how to use his full arsenal

3.  The loss of Aldrick Robinson was bigger than ppl think. With both he and Gabriels speed on the field it out a TON of pressure on safeties to make a decision quicker. We simply weren’t as fast on offense last year in the seams. 

4. There was a full season of film to study of the offense so we were played different the the previous year. We were met with MUCH more man to man last year than the previous and safeties played us deeper than the SB year as well which makes the loss of Robinson even more hurtful. 

5. We just couldn’t punch it in once we got in the red zone like Quinn/Shanny’s 1st year. The line wasn’t the issue. We made it to the second round of the playoffs and should’ve made it to the 3rd if only we could punch it in the end zone. Line Play had nothing to do with it. Had a key injury to Levitre but Wes got better as the year went on. 

You make a heII of a lot of good points.  My main problem with the line though, is in pass protection.  Matt didn't get sacked much, and Matt didn't throw many INTs (so many of which were freak tips, etc, as we all know).

But just being a fan and watching the passing game, Matt didn't have squat for time back there to find a receiver.   He dropped back and had to unload in way too much of a hurry. 

That's my main problem with the line.  I want to see 'Troy-Aikman' -think-I'll-make-a-ham-sandwich-and-cup-of-coffee-back-there time,    not     'Matt Ryan' -1.4 seconds-oh-sh*t-I'm-gonna-die time.....because when Ryan has time, the passing game, nay, the entire offense, dominates.  And this past season that wasn't the case. 

PokerSteve and Vandy like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites