130 posts in this topic

9 minutes ago, BirdHeadKemo said:

What about when he gave Ray Edwards, Dunta Robinson, and Tyson Jackson way too much money. Our how about the abysmal 2012 draft. None of those players are on NFL Rosters now I believe. Peter Konz, Peria Jerry, and Sam Baker didn't work out. What happened to our 2nd and 5th round picks between 2008-2012? Its definitely a crap shoot but I remember those years with TD. I give him all the credit now but man was I mad at him throughout those years lol

Oh yeah....the 2012 NFL draft:

 

Trent Richardson

Justin Blackmon

David Wilson

RG3

Brandon Weeden

AJ Jenkins

 

 

Those are 1st rounders that are no longer in the NFL or are starters...just off the top of my head.  

 

 

 

Thats my point...yes, TD has some mistakes like you mentioned, but all GMs do.  

 

 

Sam Baker worked out ok...injuries just got the best of him. 

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, BirdHeadKemo said:

What about when he gave Ray Edwards, Dunta Robinson, and Tyson Jackson way too much money. Our how about the abysmal 2012 draft. None of those players are on NFL Rosters now I believe. Peter Konz, Peria Jerry, and Sam Baker didn't work out. What happened to our 2nd and 5th round picks between 2008-2012? Its definitely a crap shoot but I remember those years with TD. I give him all the credit now but man was I mad at him throughout those years lol

 

That leads to another point...TD did faiurly well with some of his undrafted picks...including one Ryan Schrader(2013) is considered to be one of the best RTs in the league now.   He also brought in D Foxworth as a free agent which helped us get into the playoffs that year.

 

Oh...and Turbo Gabriel...the Browns threw him to the trash and we picked him up...and yes, Shanny said it was TD's idea.   TG was a big part of us getting to the big game last year. 

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52 minutes ago, Peyton said:

I wonder if people realize that prior to TD being hired the Falcons only had 4 double digit win seasons in 42 seasons and since he was hired the Falcons have 6 double digit win seasons in 10 seasons.

Plus the first consecutive winning seasons in franchise history...only rather than 2, it was 5. 
Now the team has done it again. 
First time with playoff victories in consecutive seasons too. 

Any GM is going to have blemishes on his record, misses in the draft, FA busts, etc. Thats the name of the game. But anyone who has lived through this franchise's history in any appreciable way should be relishing the way this program has been built. 

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29 minutes ago, BirdHeadKemo said:

What about when he gave Ray Edwards, Dunta Robinson, and Tyson Jackson way too much money. Our how about the abysmal 2012 draft. None of those players are on NFL Rosters now I believe. Peter Konz, Peria Jerry, and Sam Baker didn't work out. What happened to our 2nd and 5th round picks between 2008-2012? Its definitely a crap shoot but I remember those years with TD. I give him all the credit now but man was I mad at him throughout those years lol

You can do this for every GM in the league except Ted Thompson....who just got fired because he wouldnt pony up big money for FAs. 

 

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TD after Matt Ryan is the least of our problems. Yet there will always be a faction of unappreciative Falcon Fans that will hate him, just like Matt. 

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3 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

You can do this for every GM in the league except Ted Thompson....who just got fired because he wouldnt pony up big money for FAs. 

 

 

But he wouldn't get his team an RB for the past couple years for some reason. 

 

passed on Dalvin Cook to get CB Kevin King.

passed on Alvan Kamara to get S Josh Jones

 

So they started out their 2017 season with a WR playing RB again. 

 

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Quinn has a great ability to visualize and be specific about who/what he wants. TD has a great ability to seek out those specific players and scout talent.

Smith lost his vision, that's when TD fell off the worst. As long as Quinn knows what he wants, we will be one of the most talented teams in the league, because they're a phenomenal team.

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17 minutes ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

Plus the first consecutive winning seasons in franchise history...only rather than 2, it was 5. 
Now the team has done it again. 
First time with playoff victories in consecutive seasons too. 

Any GM is going to have blemishes on his record, misses in the draft, FA busts, etc. Thats the name of the game. But anyone who has lived through this franchise's history in any appreciable way should be relishing the way this program has been built. 

I 100% agree. Falcons have an excellent program in place. It's just not TD though. It's Blank. TD and Quinn are building something very sustainable and they are clearly on the same page.

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How TD screwed Jerry Jones and the Cowboys to get Takk shows how good of a GM he is.

 

Is he perfect? No, no GM is. But you have to say that TD is one of the top GMs in today's NFL right now.

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1 hour ago, droopy1592 said:

He stated Smitty gave him no direction for the team or players to draft. Some of that poor drafting and FAs weren’t completely on him. 

Smith also said he let other people push him off course and he should have stayed with "the process". Smith also said him and TD quit communicating like they should. I think both are equally to blame for that mess. McClure and Abraham said they were forced out by TD, For totally different situations naturally., but never the less. McClure said he wanted to play a few more years and TD forced him to retire to move on to Konz. TD even admitted that in a interview as one of his big mistakes. 

Edited by THEHEADCOACH

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3 minutes ago, THEHEADCOACH said:

Smith also said he let other people push him of course and he should have stayed with "the process". Smith also said him and TD quit communicating like they should. I think both are equally to blame for that mess. McClure and Abraham said they were forced out my TD. For totally different situations naturally. McClure said he wanted to play a few more years and TD forced him to retire to move on to Konz. TD even admitted that in a interview as one of his big mistakes. 

The thing I can't seem to figure out about Mike Smith is that he was a defensive coordinator prior to coming here. His defenses ALWAYS felt like they had no identity whatsoever. It really seems like Smith was very lucky to have Ryan, Turner, Roddy, Tony G, and also Mularkey and Koetter to run his offenses because he failed 100% to build even a "formidable" defense.

Edited by JD dirtybird21

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1 minute ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

The thing I can't seem to figure out about Mike Smith is that he was a defensive coordinator prior to coming here. He defenses ALWAYS felt like they had no identity whatsoever. It really seems like Smith was very lucky to have Ryan, Turner, Roddy, Tony G, and also Mularkey and Koetter to run his offenses because he failed 100% to build a even a "formidable" defense.

I believe Mike Smith was trying to do the "let everyone do their jobs" thing and was picking bad DC's who had no clue. It's weird, because our defenses here, never even looked like a typical Mike Smith Defense anywhere else. 

I think Quinn made the same mistake with Richard Smith, but he corrected it faster. Smith was to loyal to coaches and players.

 

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2 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

The thing I can't seem to figure out about Mike Smith is that he was a defensive coordinator prior to coming here. His defenses ALWAYS felt like they had no identity whatsoever. It really seems like Smith was very lucky to have Ryan, Turner, Roddy, Tony G, and also Mularkey and Koetter to run his offenses because he failed 100% to build even a "formidable" defense.

 

 

He actually had two top 5 defenses(points allowed). 2010 and 2012  

 

2010: 5th, 18 points a game

2012: 5th, 18.7 points a game

 

 

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1 minute ago, thesouphead said:

 

 

He actually had two top 5 defenses(points allowed). 2010 and 2012  

 

2010: 5th, 18 points a game

2012: 5th, 18.7 points a game

 

 

Those defenses gave up a LOT of yards though and were definitely exposed in the playoffs.

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2 hours ago, kiwifalcon said:

Tarnished isn't a word I'd use he's been consistent man and that's the key.Not many GMs have lasted 10 years with a team and running it.Himself and others have had this team on the cusp 3-4 times this decade man not many GMs running around this league could have that there whole careers.

Yea. To me, his reputation and the job he has done has never been tarnished.

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I appreciate TD a lot tho I was mad in the earlier years from him being with a misguided Smitty. You guys are TD right, is one of a kind.

Edited by BirdHeadKemo

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27 minutes ago, JD dirtybird21 said:

The thing I can't seem to figure out about Mike Smith is that he was a defensive coordinator prior to coming here. His defenses ALWAYS felt like they had no identity whatsoever. It really seems like Smith was very lucky to have Ryan, Turner, Roddy, Tony G, and also Mularkey and Koetter to run his offenses because he failed 100% to build even a "formidable" defense.

Wait a minute now. 

Smith brought stability here. He also instilled focus and discipline in the organization, something that is rare these days. I'm not one to really rate players over coaches. I don't feel that players make the coach. The coach is the general that establishes organizational culture, and Smith did a great job at that. He was a mistake away from making the SB in 2013.

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Well, I don't know about that. Yea, the defenses were stellar, but I think so many fans make the defense seem worse than what it was under Smith. The offense, even then, had some of the same problems that they had earlier this season. I remember they would blow it wide open in the first half and score 3 points in the second half, leaving the defense winded and tired. 

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1 minute ago, Halcon-1 said:

Wait a minute now. 

Smith brought stability here. He also instilled focus and discipline in the organization, something that is rare these days. I'm not one to really rate players over coaches. I don't feel that players make the coach. The coach is the general that establishes organizational culture, and Smith did a great job at that. He was a mistake away from making the SB in 2013.

Yea, I think Smith had a lot of good qualities as a leader. But, I think he overachieved quite a bit during his tenure thanks to TD. I mean, TD had a home run off-season in his first season. He signed Turner, drafted Ryan, and got a starting quality LT. In year 2, he pretty much stole Tony Gonzalez from the Chiefs. When I look at the actual body of work rather than just the result, Smith won a LOT of lucky games he should have lost, and never really built himself a great defense in spite of the fact that he was a defensive minded coach. I think the offensive weapons that TD got him along with Mularkey and Koetter resulted in overachievement for Smitty. Why is he not a head coach now?

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38 minutes ago, thesouphead said:

He actually had two top 5 defenses(points allowed). 2010 and 2012  

2010: 5th, 18 points a game

2012: 5th, 18.7 points a game

Yeah, that 2010 defense sure was a worldbeater. LMAO

And 2012 was arguably top 10, but even then I didn't like it half as much as this one. 

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4 minutes ago, Falcan Moore said:

Yeah, that 2010 defense sure was a worldbeater. LMAO

And 2012 was arguably top 10, but even then I didn't like it half as much as this one. 

 

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2 hours ago, Peyton said:

I wonder if people realize that prior to TD being hired the Falcons only had 4 double digit win seasons in 42 seasons and since he was hired the Falcons have 6 double digit win seasons in 10 seasons.

Do you remember the angst we had on this forum after going nearly 45 years without back-to-back winning seasons? A lot of us earned our stripes by sticking around for most of those 40+ seasons and it's amazing how nit-picky we've become over what to complain about. As I told someone, illogical as it sometimes was after our off-season moves, we used to think that we could make noise every year. Nowadays, we expect to be loud.

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4 hours ago, Sun Tzu 7 said:

The more I think about that the more I think it was on Smitty and his staff.

Let's take the Senior Bowl for example.  Smith and his coaching staff COACHED AARON DONALD.  They saw him every day in practice.  How many of them recognized he was the best DT prospect they'd seen in years?  The Senior Bowl was SUCH a wasted opportunity.

Now I understand the glaring need for an LT and why they took Matthews but they had an up close and personal look at Donald.  If you take that into context into how bad the lines got under Smitty I wonder how much of it was him and his staffs input on players.

And TD's track record since Quinn has been here and the year before is pretty darn good.

After a year of matt getting killed with Baker/Holmes/trueblood et al at left tackle, Jake Matthews was the only logical pick. 

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8 minutes ago, Vandy said:

After a year of matt getting killed with Baker/Holmes/trueblood et al at left tackle, Jake Matthews was the only logical pick. 

Again,  I totally understand why there was a clear need for Matthews. 

But I think your kind of missing the point.  You would think that Smith and staff would have seen Donald in practice and realized what they were working with and been like ‘I know we need an LT but this kid is unbelievable.’

And technically Baker was an issue every season except for maybe 2.  I loved the Matthews pick at the time and still do.  But the point was about Smith & staff’s ability to evaluate line talent.  They had Lamar Holmes starting over Ryan Schrader for example...

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