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Misdirection against our defense?


The O.D.B
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Is it just me, or does it seem like we are seeing a huge amount of misdirection plays from opposing offenses this year? Last year we didn't see as many cutesy play calls because we would make our opposition pay for it. This year we are getting eaten alive. It seems like every week I'm seeing one of our guys windmilling his arms to change direction and get back to where he's supposed to be, because he bit on a misdirection and lost the play. Is it just me or does anyone else notice this? 

With the exception of the Dolphins 98 minute run it down our throat drive, I think we've played decent on straight up plays against opponents. It's when they start throwing a few misdirection plays at us that seemingly everyone starts second guessing and taking themselves out of plays. 

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6 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

That's what you do against a defense built on speed.  

I noticed the same thing, too.  They actually did a pretty good job against Carolina's base runs yesterday.  There were some unscouted looked they threw out there that just embarrassed the D yesterday... that and the contain rushes were horrible.

What is this "contain " that you speak of??

I guess for me that is the most disappointing thing about the game is the fact that we continually lost contain against a guy that we know is going to try to run.

The fact that we did not have a spy on Newton every play should make the seat of every member of the the defensive staff very warm.

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Yeah, with a fast defense like this we were exposed. We're less read/ react defense and more of an attacking scheme (ie aggressive, go hunt down the ball). It's great when it works, but misdirection can capitalize on being overaggressive in pursuit as we saw yesterday when we lost contain at least 5 times (that I can remember off the top of my head). 

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12 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

That's what you do against a defense built on speed.  

I noticed the same thing, too.  They actually did a pretty good job against Carolina's base runs yesterday.  There were some unscouted looked they threw out there that just embarrassed the D yesterday... that and the contain rushes were horrible.

That McCaffery kid is fast. I’ve never seen Debo unable to chase a back down

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Just now, falconsd56 said:

What is this "contain " that you speak of??

I guess for me that is the most disappointing thing about the game is the fact that we continually lost contain against a guy that we know is going to try to run.

The fact that we did not have a spy on Newton every play should make the seat of every member of the the defensive staff very warm.

It's basically a rush designed to keep a mobile quarterback in the pocket.  It's basically a more disciplined rush where everyone has a lane they have to stay in. 

Most pass rush situations, if there's not a stunt called, you get your ends to fly up the field and use their moves -- inside, outside, spin, club and rip, whatever.  They can wind up at a depth of 7 yards or better.  In a contain rush, you're not having your ends go nearly that far up the field.  You want them to rush more shallow then look to constrict the pocket.  It's more about them controlling space rather than trying to get around the OT, while the defensive tackles also look to get push while maintaing their lane so that there's no hole for the QB to step up and squirt through.

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5 minutes ago, MSalmon said:

That McCaffery kid is fast. I’ve never seen Debo unable to chase a back down

He's nice in the open field. 

Defense was battling out there, but the tackling was really pi$$ing me off yesterday.  Guys were losing leverage, they were running at the wrong hip, over-pursuing and a couple of times they just flat had their eyes in the wrong place.

Looked like they installed that old Gus Malzahn Auburn offense.   

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6 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

He's nice in the open field. 

Defense was battling out there, but the tackling was really pi$$ing me off yesterday.  Guys were losing leverage, they were running at the wrong hip, over-pursuing and a couple of times they just flat had their eyes in the wrong place.

Looked like they installed that old Gus Malzahn Auburn offense.   

The defense is horribly undisciplined. I was annoyed as well. Yeah, it reminded me of that old tiger offense. 

This team is so out of synch

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27 minutes ago, MSalmon said:

The defense is horribly undisciplined. I was annoyed as well. Yeah, it reminded me of that old tiger offense. 

This team is so out of synch

We are only giving up 21 pts an under. They barely have 60-65 yards to cover.

Blame special teams for it.

We are fortunate teams are not dropping 28-30 on us every game.

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35 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

It's basically a rush designed to keep a mobile quarterback in the pocket.  It's basically a more disciplined rush where everyone has a lane they have to stay in. 

Most pass rush situations, if there's not a stunt called, you get your ends to fly up the field and use their moves -- inside, outside, spin, club and rip, whatever.  They can wind up at a depth of 7 yards or better.  In a contain rush, you're not having your ends go nearly that far up the field.  You want them to rush more shallow then look to constrict the pocket.  It's more about them controlling space rather than trying to get around the OT, while the defensive tackles also look to get push while maintaing their lane so that there's no hole for the QB to step up and squirt through.

I know what contain is my friend.....I should have used purple on that part ;)

 

We did not have it at all sunday

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1 hour ago, DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry said:

Yep, its been a foundation piece of most of the offenses we've faced. Get the Falcons to push to one side and reverse the field. 

 

True. Teams have done a good job scouting and adjusting to what made falcons successful last year. 

Falcons have NOT done a good job countering to those adjustments. 

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58 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

He's nice in the open field. 

Defense was battling out there, but the tackling was really pi$$ing me off yesterday.  Guys were losing leverage, they were running at the wrong hip, over-pursuing and a couple of times they just flat had their eyes in the wrong place.

Looked like they installed that old Gus Malzahn Auburn offense.   

And at the end of the day, that comes down to being a coaching issue, my friend. Yes?

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1 minute ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

I don't disagree in this case. You gotta have you fundamentals to lean on when they throw something unexpected at you. Then you if that aint the answer you gotta get on that whiteboard and start making those adjustment.

That’s why I don’t understand, PMF.

this is what was supposed to be quinn’s Bread and butter. Teaching the fundamentals.

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No it's just you. When the defense plays SOFT ZONE giving the other team 10 yards right off the BAT, they will take that advantage every time.

Falcons defense is a ZONE DEFENSE, and that is the whole problem. Quinn raves about his defensive players, but he doesn't have enough gumption to play man to man when those plays need to be called MAN TO MAN so they can hold those players accountable if they fail. 

Someone said a while back, that the way you beat ZONE DEFENSE is simple, you look for the open spots in it and that's where you start, after you find those then you simply pick them apart as though they were a bird picking apart a piece of meat, or perhaps A FALCON!

Just saying............ 

Winning football is not won by ZONE OFFENSE OR DEFENSE which equates to "Pllayers playing and sticking to a scheme. It's won by LETTING THE PLAYERS PLAY and cover the person they are meant to cover, not expecting them to be in a situation where "That player is going to run this way type of sitting", it's been shown that it doesn't work. ZONE DEFENSE is BS!

JMO

 

Edited by WinningIsTheOnlyOption
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15 minutes ago, Vandy said:

That’s why I don’t understand, PMF.

this is what was supposed to be quinn’s Bread and butter. Teaching the fundamentals.

It is one of those things that makes you scratch your head.  I still think a few pieces are missing, but run defense isn't really about talent.

I don't know.  Might just be one of those things.  He wouldn't be the first defensive coach that took longer than expected to get his stuff up and running, though.  Marvin Lewis is an elite defensive mind; built and coordinated one of the best defenses ever.  He got hired in Cincy in 2003.  They didn't field a top 10 defense until 2009.  Jim Schwartz is a defensive genius.  He never did field a top 10 defense in Detroit -- even though he's churned them out as a coordinator.  Mike Smith... smh... Mike Smith never got his defense put together.

Now I don't think Quinn will fall into any of those extreme examples, but we have to remember he is still mid-way through his 3rd season as a head coach and I haven't yet seen an alpha out there to really take control of the unit to galvanize the troops to way you see with some of these other top defenses.  I think that's what's really missing more than anything.    

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2 hours ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

It is one of those things that makes you scratch your head.  I still think a few pieces are missing, but run defense isn't really about talent.

I don't know.  Might just be one of those things.  He wouldn't be the first defensive coach that took longer than expected to get his stuff up and running, though.  Marvin Lewis is an elite defensive mind; built and coordinated one of the best defenses ever.  He got hired in Cincy in 2003.  They didn't field a top 10 defense until 2009.  Jim Schwartz is a defensive genius.  He never did field a top 10 defense in Detroit -- even though he's churned them out as a coordinator.  Mike Smith... smh... Mike Smith never got his defense put together.

Now I don't think Quinn will fall into any of those extreme examples, but we have to remember he is still mid-way through his 3rd season as a head coach and I haven't yet seen an alpha out there to really take control of the unit to galvanize the troops to way you see with some of these other top defenses.  I think that's what's really missing more than anything.    

Great points. But I can’t give Quinn a pass on this team’s regression from last year in basic fundamentals. 

I know he hasn’t shown it yet, but rueben Foster was that alpha I wanted badly in this last draft. 

 

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Just now, Vandy said:

Great points.

I know he hasn’t shown it yet, but rueben Foster was that alpha I wanted badly in this last draft. 

Exactly.  I guy with some attitude that can be the true north.  Things start going wrong, car starts going off the road a bit, this is the guy everybody looks to a Ray Lewis, a Terrell Suggs, a Luke Kuechly, James Harrison...

I love Foster... but then again I tend to love Alabama linebackers.  But yeah, Foster is a guy in that mold.  

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8 minutes ago, PeytonMannings Forehead said:

Exactly.  I guy with some attitude that can be the true north.  Things start going wrong, car starts going off the road a bit, this is the guy everybody looks to a Ray Lewis, a Terrell Suggs, a Luke Kuechly, James Harrison...

I love Foster... but then again I tend to love Alabama linebackers.  But yeah, Foster is a guy in that mold.  

Very surprised Quinn let him get by. 

Foster and Neal together, man that’s what We needed here...those two have that alpha you speak to. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Vandy said:

Very surprised Quinn let him get by. 

Foster and Neal together, man that’s what We needed here...those two have that alpha you speak to. 

 

Might have been the shoulder that scared him off.  Considering the consolation prize we wound up getting in the 3rd round, though, I don't know.  I'd have been tempted to pull that trigger.

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