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Zaphod

Why are some of y'all so mad at Kap?

1,632 posts in this topic

2 minutes ago, Serge said:

Mainstream society telling minorities in society that they can't say that they value their own lives unless they include equal reverence for everyone else seems like a foundational concept in a dystopian novel. = /

I think I am actually going to use that as the basis for my comic book. 

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15 minutes ago, Serge said:

And you're failing to grasp literally everything anyone's said that asks you to understand any other perspective. You're asking us to treat literally unbelievable myopia as a virtue. 

 

I'm a Christian Conservative, you are liberal.  Hopefully you will agree with me that all people should be treated equally. In reality, that will never happen.  Is Black Lives matter the answer?  Probably not.  Change the culture and then the community will change.

You don't know me from Adam's house cat but you are so quick to judge me. I think you would be surprised at my positive  contributions in trying to make a difference in my community.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, The Great American said:

I'm a Christian Conservative, you are liberal.  Hopefully you will agree with me that all people should be treated equally. In reality, that will never happen.  Is Black Lives matter the answer?  Probably not.  Change the culture and then the community will change.

You don't know me from Adam's house cat but you are so quick to judge me. I think you would be surprised at my positive  contributions in trying to make a difference in my community.  

Again, you're asking me to treat your myopia as a virtue. It isn't. 

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9 hours ago, The Great American said:

A policeman on vacation is a cop out.

 IMO, all lives matter is not a dodge .  Black lives matter is so divisive.

It's only divisive because you choose to take it that way.  Obviously, all lives matter.  And in general, we act as if they do.  "Black lives matter" doesn't mean "no other lives matter."  It means "black lives matter TOO -- please respect our right to live."

I'm not a fan of some of the organizational aspects of BLM, but I think this notion that they're a terrorist organization bent on lawbreaking and disturbance of the peace is nonsense.  I totally get where they're coming from.  It's no more divisive to say "black lives matter" than to say "unborn lives matter."  And I doubt you (or I) would have a problem with the latter statement.  Because the "too" is implied.

Also, I don't think a Christian worldview precludes the view I espouse above.  I think it demands it.

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8 hours ago, MACK4ttACK said:

I will say right now I think Trayvon Martin's shooting was because he attacked a dude that had a gun in his waist. You can tell me Zimmerman should not have had a gun on him, or that Zimmerman should have just gone home instead of prowling the apartment complex for "criminals", but the actual shooting, based on the evidence, appears justified. So no I did not call for "justice" for Trayvon, I call for Justice for other black men such as the kids that were "playing music too loud" or the man in SC shot running away from police. Just because a black man is shot does not mean it's unjustified, just the same for white men. The issue is not individual cases, it's an entire system rigged against minorities.

This might be the first thing you and I have agreed on, but this is entirely my view.  Zimmerman is an ***hole with an itchy trigger finger and a hero complex, and someone I don't like and don't want anywhere near my family, but based on the evidence at trial, he was not guilty and rightly so.  Martin picked the wrong dude to get into it with that night.  That sucks, and it sucks that people like the wrong dude exist, but that doesn't change the fact that he was (per the evidence at trial) the aggressor and Zimmerman was (per the evidence at trial) acting in self-defense.

But we can let that go if need be, because we have too many other examples to count.  Philandro Castile being to me the pre-eminent one.

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22 minutes ago, JDaveG said:

It's only divisive because you choose to take it that way.  Obviously, all lives matter.  And in general, we act as if they do.  "Black lives matter" doesn't mean "no other lives matter."  It means "black lives matter TOO -- please respect our right to live."

I'm not a fan of some of the organizational aspects of BLM, but I think this notion that they're a terrorist organization bent on lawbreaking and disturbance of the peace is nonsense.  I totally get where they're coming from.  It's no more divisive to say "black lives matter" than to say "unborn lives matter."  And I doubt you (or I) would have a problem with the latter statement.  Because the "too" is implied.

Also, I don't think a Christian worldview precludes the view I espouse above.  I think it demands it.

Thanks for your civil response and I totally get the "too" implication.  BLM is an awareness movement to say, "I don't think were being treated fairly."  I'm saying its divisive because people are rising up in opposition. Have you seen many rednecks driving around with Confederate flags lately?  What about Back the Blue Yard signs?  

I'm all for a unified America and equality for all. 

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how about this....when a group of people who are systematically being treated like crap by the American judicial system speak up, how about we fix the problem? Then nobody has to listen to their slogans and be offended by them

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36 minutes ago, The Great American said:

Thanks for your civil response and I totally get the "too" implication.  BLM is an awareness movement to say, "I don't think were being treated fairly."  I'm saying its divisive because people are rising up in opposition. Have you seen many rednecks driving around with Confederate flags lately?  What about Back the Blue Yard signs?  

I'm all for a unified America and equality for all. 

Why is BLM divisive because of the reaction to it?

In other words, why isn’t the reaction divisive?

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1 hour ago, mdrake34 said:

wat

Are you saying you haven't seen Confederate flags mounted to pick up trucks?  And I'm the one that's nearsighted?  Watch for empty seats this weekend at NFL games.  People are reacting.  

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3 minutes ago, The Great American said:

Are you saying you haven't seen Confederate flags mounted to pick up trucks?  And I'm the one that's nearsighted?  Watch for empty seats this weekend at NFL games.  People are reacting.  

That about sums up the opposition to this. They have no arguments against what they're raising issues to and are instead raising banners of rebellion (really respecting the flag and troops there, lol) and white supremacy.

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14 minutes ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

That about sums up the opposition to this. They have no arguments against what they're raising issues to and are instead raising banners of rebellion (really respecting the flag and troops there, lol) and white supremacy.

We can agree on this.  Culture changes are needed.

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2 minutes ago, The Great American said:

We can agree on this.  Culture changes are needed.

That is what the protesters are fighting for. Similarly, that seems to be why Trump supporters are so frustrated by these protests... He was elected to win the culture war for them but it is becoming increasingly clear to everyone that they're still losing it and, if anything, Trump is making it worse for them, and they don't even have consolation victories like repealing Obamacare to make themselves feel better.

Though they let CHIP expire, so I guess they can pat themselves on the back for getting libs mad about... *checks notes*... poor children not having healthcare.

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 What I'm getting from Great American is "I'm not comfortable with your form of protest. Please change it to something less unsettling so I can go back to ignoring your grievances".

Again, if you can't even acknowledge that minorities have a legitimate grievance with the current culture of law enforcement, then there's no discussion to be had. Just avert your eyes from the protest because you have no wish of understanding why it's happening. 

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11 minutes ago, Gritzblitz 2.0 said:

 What I'm getting from Great American is "I'm not comfortable with your form of protest. Please change it to something less unsettling so I can go back to ignoring your grievances".

Again, if you can't even acknowledge that minorities have a legitimate grievance with the current culture of law enforcement, then there's no discussion to be had. Just avert your eyes from the protest because you have no wish of understanding why it's happening. 

It's the same mindset as "these thugs shouldn't violently protest! ::black person peacefully protests by kneeling:: "stand up boy, you can't do that either."

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27 minutes ago, Gritzblitz 2.0 said:

 What I'm getting from Great American is "I'm not comfortable with your form of protest. Please change it to something less unsettling so I can go back to ignoring your grievances".

Again, if you can't even acknowledge that minorities have a legitimate grievance with the current culture of law enforcement, then there's no discussion to be had. Just avert your eyes from the protest because you have no wish of understanding why it's happening. 

Uhh, no.  I don't mind peaceful protests.  I've done it myself for a cause I believe in.  Let's go to the root problem of why policemen are shooting people.  

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4 minutes ago, The Great American said:

Uhh, no.  I don't mind peaceful protests.  I've done it myself for a cause I believe in.  Let's go to the root problem of why policemen are shooting people.  

Intentionally low recruitment standards, bad training, cops typically do not live in the communities anymore, getting military grade equipment for no real reason, almost no judicial accountability since prosecutors don't want to piss off the cops they have to work with, etc.

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“There’s a lot of racism disguised as patriotism in this country and people don’t like to address that and they don’t like to address what the root of this protest is. You have players across this country, not only in the NFL but soccer and NBA and high school players, they don’t like to address this issue that people of color are oppressed and treated unjustly. I don’t know why that is or what they’re scared of, but it needs to be addressed."

- Colin Kaepernick, 9/20/16

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50 minutes ago, The Great American said:

Uhh, no.  I don't mind peaceful protests.  I've done it myself for a cause I believe in.  Let's go to the root problem of why policemen are shooting people.  

Two pages ago you brought up the suffering of Native Americans to challenge the legitimacy of protests that don't begin and end with "all lives matter."

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2 hours ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

Intentionally low recruitment standards, bad training, cops typically do not live in the communities anymore, getting military grade equipment for no real reason, almost no judicial accountability since prosecutors don't want to piss off the cops they have to work with, etc.

That's half the equation.  Are you giving citizens a free pass?

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8 hours ago, The Great American said:

That's half the equation.  Are you giving citizens a free pass?

I typically don't blame children for getting murdered since they committed the crime of playing outside when cops rolled up.

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10 minutes ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

I typically don't blame children for getting murdered since they committed the crime of playing outside when cops rolled up.

So you're saying a kid was playing outside when a policeman drives by and shoots him for no apparent reason?

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9 minutes ago, The Great American said:

So you're saying a kid was playing outside when a policeman drives by and shoots him for no apparent reason?

We talked about the Tamir Rice murder a few pages ago.

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6 minutes ago, Psychic Gibbon said:

We talked about the Tamir Rice murder a few pages ago.

I didn't go back and read but was that the case where the kid had a gun with the orange cap removed?

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