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Four Things I'd like to see us acquire next year


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3 minutes ago, AndySG said:

Hankins is great against the run. Jarrett is agile and gets about the place. Even if he's not playing every snap, having a guy who can just take on blockers is never a bad idea. He's not Wilfork either. 

I like the idea of Hankins more than the actual player. He's made a couple great plays against us over the years but he's not consistent at all. Grady is leaps and bounds a better player than him. Honestly even Garland has been better than Hankins this year, and it's his first year playing the position.

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3 minutes ago, Kayoh said:

I like the idea of Hankins more than the actual player. He's made a couple great plays against us over the years but he's not consistent at all. Grady is leaps and bounds a better player than him. Honestly even Garland has been better than Hankins this year, and it's his first year playing the position.

Whoever we end up getting, I love the idea of getting a top FA DT. Alex Mack showed how much of a difference a dominant force right down the middle can make. 

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Just now, AndySG said:

Whoever we end up getting, I love the idea of getting a top FA DT. Alex Mack showed how much of a difference a dominant force right down the middle can make. 

Yeah, I mean those are very different situations but we need 2 good 3 tech DTs, 2 good base DEs, and 2 good LEOs. Can't necessarily get all that stuff in one offseason but we can still make a nice dent in it.

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Just now, D.B.N. said:

DL first and foremost - sign a big bodied DT such as Kawann Short or Bennie Logan, draft a guy like Barnett/Harris/Walker, then grab a FS in the 2nd. RG is upgradeable as well 

You can't just magically pull great players out of thin air. Saying something like "grab a FS in the 2nd" isn't helping anyone if there are no good FSs available in the 2nd. Oh, and Bennie Logan is garbage.

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4 hours ago, etherdome said:

I think we still need help along the OL.  We may have some talent behind Chester, but I have not seen it yet.  We need to be able to run the ball in short yardage situations.  We can not do it reliably yet. 

Tell you what the last 2 starts Chester has started his run blocking has been outstanding.Also noticed when we go short yardage inside the red zone we tend to go behind Mack and Chester in that A Gap.

Chester isnt as bad as everyone is making out to be hes had tough opposition the last 2 weeks in Poe and Donald and has handled his assignments well.Even Schraeder after he signed his extension has been on point also in running and pass pro.

Mind you Mack to me is the best C in the game he's been an absolute heaven send for this offense this year. 

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22 minutes ago, AndySG said:

Hankins is great against the run. Jarrett is agile and gets about the place. Even if he's not playing every snap, having a guy who can just take on blockers is never a bad idea. He's not Wilfork either. 

 

19 minutes ago, Kayoh said:

I like the idea of Hankins more than the actual player. He's made a couple great plays against us over the years but he's not consistent at all. Grady is leaps and bounds a better player than him. Honestly even Garland has been better than Hankins this year, and it's his first year playing the position.

For me I actually like the idea of shortening the rotation for our d-line players.I want 3 down guys and only bring them off when there actually tired.I'm not a big fan of players in and out.I want another 3 down guy a Jarrett clone would suffice.

I just feel going after a guy like Richardson or Short would probably hurt us down the road cap wise.With the impending Matthews and Trufant extensions coming is what I believe a guy like Hankins would probably be a better option for us.

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45 minutes ago, Kayoh said:

We're a 4-3 team and we already have 2 really solid NTs on our roster. Grady Jarrett is one of the best young 4-3 NTs in the NFL and Ben Garland has played shockingly well for us when we've decided to use him at NT as well. We don't need big fatties that can't move, that's what Soliai was and he was one of the biggest reasons we couldn't stop the run last year. Stopping the run isn't all about clogging the middle of the field with big strong bodies, because if you do that then teams will just run to the outside and not even bother blocking your big fat NT. The whole point of a NT in our scheme is to draw and challenge double teams in both phases of defense, run defense and pass rush. Grady Jarrett does that spectacularly. What we need is more players that can take advantage of the opportunities having a guy like Jarrett can create. We need a pass rushing DT, a 3-tech, a quick penetrator type.

We definitely were hoping for Derrick Shelby to step into that Bennett role but he didn't do jack squat this season before going on IR a couple months ago. We definitely need DLinemen more than anything on defense. We could go into 2017 with no DL from this year save for Jarrett, Clayborn, Freeney and Garland and I'd be okay with it. We really should use free agency to fill out our DL tbh. I'm done with Hageman. We drafted him as a project with the hopes that by his 3rd or 4th year he'd be a dominant player but he hasn't turned out to be what we wanted at ALL. Super disappointing. Oh, and Tony McDaniel is a better pass rusher than Shede. Not as good against the run but better at the rush for sure. And to be fair, Tony McDaniel himself is a FA after this year, so if you want him you don't have to rely on another guy to be like him, you can just sign him if you want. LOL

Paul Soliai was one of the biggest reasons we couldn't stop the run last year. It wasn't up the gut runs that were hurting us, it was stretch plays and outside zone runs. Soliai couldn't move at all and teams didn't even bother blocking him half the time because they knew he wasn't going to be able to get to the point and make the tackle quick enough, so they used that extra blocker to seal the edge for the RB and killed us with it. Go back and watch the Dallas game from last year, they didn't even bother trying to block Soliai half the time. It was really sad.

Poe is a great NT but our system isn't where he fits best. You're on the right track with wanting a guy like Short or Sheldon Richardson, either of those guys would instantly make our D significantly better than it's been. Especially Richardson - I like Short but he's very streaky, where as Richardson is just a friggin beast, AND he's been playing out of position as a 3-4 DE in the Jets D. You put him at 3 tech and you might have another Geno Atkins/Aaron Donald type of DT on your hands. That's what I saw in him coming out of Missouri at least. I might have been the only person on this board who had Richardson ranked above both Sharrif Floyd AND Star Lotulelei that year. He's a special talent.

I think this board as a whole underrates Ricardo Allen by quite a lot. He's not an all-pro by any means but he's a really good starting deep FS. Obviously if we'd sign Eric Berry it'd reduce Allen to a backup, but I'd still want to keep him around as Berry's backup, because then if Berry DOES get hurt I'd know that we'd be able to avoid the Seattle problem when they lose one of their starting safeties.

Soliai was the reason we could stop the run. After he got injured teams ran on us like crazy 

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Just now, Jahi Sun said:

Soliai was the reason we could stop the run. After he got injured teams ran on us like crazy 

Soliai played against Minnesota, who ran on us more than any other team last year. If you actually watch the tape you'd see he was good against runs up the gut but a complete liability against outside runs. We need a guy that can do both and big 330+ pounders are only useful against outside runs if they're freakish athletes, and those are the ones who are also too expensive for us..

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5 hours ago, MSalmon said:

I don't know if I agree. It's not all weight. If you use the Seattle model it's a combination of penetrating and stoutness and lengthy Interior DL. One key we miss is that Michael Bennett guy who can set the edge as a base DE as both a run defender and pass rusher. Clayborn is a good pass rusher but I don't think he's as stout a run defender. People give up on Hageman because of lack of gaudy stats, but he's a Tony McDaniel Clone--that's a good thing. What hurts us is an aging babs and an ineffective TJax. Richardson or Short fill that babs role and Grady will get better. A guy like Thomas would be an outstanding addition in that base DE role that's so key

an interesting FA would be Sylvester Williams. He's far from a fat guy but he's stout. 

 

Derek Barnett is our Michael Bennett!! Dude can play multiple positions, and still has the athleticism to edge rush at 6'5 280.

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5 hours ago, MAD597 said:

We need to draft a monster 330LB + DT and Sign a monster 330LB + DT as a vet FA. Let the old fat guy train the new fat guy. For to long have we had string beans on our DL. We need guys with some weight on them to wear out the OL during the game and crash the middle of the pocket making the QB scramble.

Pick out some of the DT's listed here that will be FA's and sign at least one, we can also use the list to grab a new Guard to replace Chester.

https://www.sportingcharts.com/articles/nfl/top-5-heaviest-players-in-the-nfl.aspx

This didn't get any less ridiculous since the first time you posted it.

No team is going to have 2 330 pounders in the middle of the line.  We won't be the first.  It's silly.  Please stop, for the love of all that does not suck.

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1 hour ago, TheFatboi said:

I wanna get through this season 1st but I don't think we need to break the bank on anybody for one. That rarely works. The good teams win with their own talent and don't break the bank on one player. Usually the teams that break the bank suffer. Especially if they weren't one player away. Bennett and Avril we CHEAP pieces needed to give them what they needed to get over the hump.

 

What we need in the draft is ANOTHER  DT. Not a heavy DT. Especially in this defense. It's about speed and power not necessarily weight. 2nd round go get another DT. 3rd round go get a DE. If we bring in any FA I'd get a viable DE sorta like what Bennett or Avril or Clayborn were on the market not a bank breaking DT. DE in base hasn't been any issue for us this year but DT has. If we get 2 more DT's one that's good at both stopping the run and pass rush and another that's just a run stuffer the FS position won't even be a position of need like that. 

Exactly.  Only I think we still need LB help, personally.  That hole is dug too deep.

We don't need starters but we do need depth, in either FA or the draft.

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2 hours ago, Kayoh said:

We're a 4-3 team and we already have 2 really solid NTs on our roster. Grady Jarrett is one of the best young 4-3 NTs in the NFL and Ben Garland has played shockingly well for us when we've decided to use him at NT as well. We don't need big fatties that can't move, that's what Soliai was and he was one of the biggest reasons we couldn't stop the run last year. Stopping the run isn't all about clogging the middle of the field with big strong bodies, because if you do that then teams will just run to the outside and not even bother blocking your big fat NT. The whole point of a NT in our scheme is to draw and challenge double teams in both phases of defense, run defense and pass rush. Grady Jarrett does that spectacularly. What we need is more players that can take advantage of the opportunities having a guy like Jarrett can create. We need a pass rushing DT, a 3-tech, a quick penetrator type.

We definitely were hoping for Derrick Shelby to step into that Bennett role but he didn't do jack squat this season before going on IR a couple months ago. We definitely need DLinemen more than anything on defense. We could go into 2017 with no DL from this year save for Jarrett, Clayborn, Freeney and Garland and I'd be okay with it. We really should use free agency to fill out our DL tbh. I'm done with Hageman. We drafted him as a project with the hopes that by his 3rd or 4th year he'd be a dominant player but he hasn't turned out to be what we wanted at ALL. Super disappointing. Oh, and Tony McDaniel is a better pass rusher than Shede. Not as good against the run but better at the rush for sure. And to be fair, Tony McDaniel himself is a FA after this year, so if you want him you don't have to rely on another guy to be like him, you can just sign him if you want. LOL

Paul Soliai was one of the biggest reasons we couldn't stop the run last year. It wasn't up the gut runs that were hurting us, it was stretch plays and outside zone runs. Soliai couldn't move at all and teams didn't even bother blocking him half the time because they knew he wasn't going to be able to get to the point and make the tackle quick enough, so they used that extra blocker to seal the edge for the RB and killed us with it. Go back and watch the Dallas game from last year, they didn't even bother trying to block Soliai half the time. It was really sad.

Poe is a great NT but our system isn't where he fits best. You're on the right track with wanting a guy like Short or Sheldon Richardson, either of those guys would instantly make our D significantly better than it's been. Especially Richardson - I like Short but he's very streaky, where as Richardson is just a friggin beast, AND he's been playing out of position as a 3-4 DE in the Jets D. You put him at 3 tech and you might have another Geno Atkins/Aaron Donald type of DT on your hands. That's what I saw in him coming out of Missouri at least. I might have been the only person on this board who had Richardson ranked above both Sharrif Floyd AND Star Lotulelei that year. He's a special talent.

I think this board as a whole underrates Ricardo Allen by quite a lot. He's not an all-pro by any means but he's a really good starting deep FS. Obviously if we'd sign Eric Berry it'd reduce Allen to a backup, but I'd still want to keep him around as Berry's backup, because then if Berry DOES get hurt I'd know that we'd be able to avoid the Seattle problem when they lose one of their starting safeties.

I agree with all you said, except the Allen hing. I like him, he's a nice Nickle back, backup safety..but yes that..we need better

im not for the fat boy NT

thats a good point on tony McDaniel!

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Just now, MSalmon said:

I agree with all you said, except the Allen hing. I like him, he's a nice Nickle back, backup safety..but yes that..we need better

im not for the fat boy NT

thats a good point on tony McDaniel!

I want an upgrade at FS as much as the next guy, but only if it's a SIGNIFICANT upgrade. Not trying to get a 2nd-3rd round FS and hoping he turns out well, to me it's Berry or just keep Allen. He's not a bad player, he's a good player, he's just not a GREAT player, and if we're looking to replace him we shouldn't consider anybody BUT a GREAT player for the job.

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2 minutes ago, Kayoh said:

I want an upgrade at FS as much as the next guy, but only if it's a SIGNIFICANT upgrade. Not trying to get a 2nd-3rd round FS and hoping he turns out well, to me it's Berry or just keep Allen. He's not a bad player, he's a good player, he's just not a GREAT player, and if we're looking to replace him we shouldn't consider anybody BUT a GREAT player for the job.

Ok,I can agree with that. Let me clarify: if a better player is available, I'd draft him to replace Allen. Not sure it'll be as hard as you think. Allen is meh as a FS. Is valuable? Absolutely! I think Rico is really well when he's area of responsibility is limited. 

Have you watched Desmknd King?

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1 minute ago, MSalmon said:

Ok,I can agree with that. Let me clarify: if a better player is available, I'd draft him to replace Allen. Not sure it'll be as hard as you think. Allen is meh as a FS. Is valuable? Absolutely! I think Rico is really well when he's area of responsibility is limited. 

Have you watched Desmknd King?

no, I don't scout college players until after the combine is in the books. Waste of time imo.

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Just now, Kayoh said:

no, I don't scout college players until after the combine is in the books. Waste of time imo.

Nah, it's fun to see them in field in action. I, too, get more specific post-combine. 

Regardless, keep your eye on him. He's an interesting prospect at either CB (right system) or FS (ditto)

btw I rated Richardson better than Floyd as well:)

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Just now, MSalmon said:

Nah, it's fun to see them in field in action. I, too, get more specific post-combine. 

Regardless, keep your eye on him. He's an interesting prospect at either CB (right system) or FS (ditto)

btw I rated Richardson better than Floyd as well:)

This is only the second year I'm avoiding scouting players until the combine and it's much easier & more fun to do it this way. When you watch players before the combine you don't know if you're watching a great athlete or not. WR blows past a CB? Could be fast, or the CB could just be really slow. Breakaway RB run? Could be fast, or could be playing against a slow college defense. DE gets a nice jump on the snap? Could be explosion, or could be anticipating the snap in a really aggressive scheme that he won't necessarily have the luxury of in the NFL. I wait for the combine and then use that to determine who's worth watching, then I use all that info (numbers + game film) to determine who i do or don't want. :)

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2 minutes ago, Kayoh said:

This is only the second year I'm avoiding scouting players until the combine and it's much easier & more fun to do it this way. When you watch players before the combine you don't know if you're watching a great athlete or not. WR blows past a CB? Could be fast, or the CB could just be really slow. Breakaway RB run? Could be fast, or could be playing against a slow college defense. DE gets a nice jump on the snap? Could be explosion, or could be anticipating the snap in a really aggressive scheme that he won't necessarily have the luxury of in the NFL. I wait for the combine and then use that to determine who's worth watching, then I use all that info (numbers + game film) to determine who i do or don't want. :)

Cool! Look forward to our "who we draft with the 32nd pick discussions!" :)

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