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Smilers 2017 Mock 1.0


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I know way too early, but I like to get my ideas out there early before getting influenced by others. I'm not going to get into free agency but there are a lot of blue chip defensive talent that will be hitting the market, like Jamie Collins, Chandler Jones, Fletcher Cox, Brandon Williams etc. A guy I like a lot is Kendall Reyes, who with Tyson Jackson and Babs likely leaving, would give us a versatile replacement.

 

1.       Tim Williams, LEO/SAM, Alabama

 Per PFF... "A pass-rush specialist, Williams has pressured the quarterback at an incredible rate over the last two years. He picked up 52 total pressures (11 sacks, 8 QB hits, 33 hurries) on only 147 rushes in 2015, good for a pass rush productivity of 28.4 that lead the nation. While he’s only played 256 total snaps the last two seasons, only 47 of which have been against the run. Williams’ explosiveness off the edge makes him a first-round candidate, although gaining experience on early downs this fall can only help his cause."

 

2.       Jalen Reeves-Maybin, LB, Tennessee

Another rangy linebacker to add to Jones and Campbell (the only linebackers currently signed for 2017). He was all over the field for the Vols in 2015, collecting 105 tackles, 14 TFL and 6 sacks. JRM is a heat-seeking missile on the outside—as solid against the run because of his exceptional tackling ability as he is against the pass, where his speed allows him to gallop into the backfield and wreak havoc on plays. He's the epitome of a sideline-to-sideline 'backer. I have him falling to the 2nd not because of talent but because the ILB position is exceptionally strong in 2017 (I currently have him ranked 4th behind Jarrad Davis, Raekwon McMillan & Rueben Foster).  

 

3.       Bucky Hodges, TE, Virginia Tech 

Jacob Tamme & Levine Toilolo are both free agents next year. Hodges is another big bodied athletic tight end that we can pair with Hooper, and give Ryan the mismatches he craves. Over the last 2 seasons Hodges has hauled in 85 receptions for 856 yards and 13 TD’s. If he had declared for the 2016 draft I think he would have been the 1st TE taken, but the 2017 draft is extremely deep and talented at the TE spot (OJ Howard, Jake Butt, Jordan Leggett, Evan Engram to name but a few).

 

4.       Cameron Tom, C/G, Southern Miss

Tom gives us another athletic, versatile O lineman to add to the group. He will be a four year starter this year for Southern Miss, after arriving on campus as a Tackle, he made the switch to center his sophomore year. At 6-4, 292 lbs he is a big guy who moves well in space and should be good fit in the outside ZBS.

 

5.       Marquez White, CB, FSU 

Whilst watching tape of Jalen Ramsey it became abundantly clear that teams respected White just as much, if not more that Ramsey. White ranked second in the ACC in terms of completions-per-target at 32.1 percent (STATS LLC) and was targeted only seven percent of the throws by opposing quarterbacks – making him one of the most respected cornerbacks in the country. A big, athletic, boundary cornerback that Quinn loves and will provide competition to Jalen Collins. Alford is also a FA in 2017.

 

6.       Bryan Cox Jr, DE/DT, Florida

That’s right we bring in Bryan Cox’s son. Cox jr is big bodied strong-side defensive end. At 6-3, 270 lbs, I think if adds 10-15 more lbs he would be a perfect swing 3 tech and 5 tech in our base defense.

 

7.       Evan Berry, S, Texas 

Eric Berry’s younger brother has been buried on the depth chart at Texas but has made a name for himself as a returner ranking first in NCAA and first in SEC in kickoff return average (38.3) in 2015. He has a similar build and athletic traits to his brother. He’ll only be a junior this coming year so I have no idea if he’ll declare but if he doesn’t get a start at Safety again this year it might be the best option.

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4 hours ago, GleasonForever! said:

goood overall. I just believe we need a natural DT in first 3 rounds. Babs and Tjax are gone imo. Hags is a question mark.

I agree it's definitely a need, but at first glance I don't think there is a huge amount of talent at DT in this draft. I'd look in FA at the likes of Fletcher Cox, Brandon Williams, Kendall Reyes etc

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6 hours ago, Smiler11 said:

I agree it's definitely a need, but at first glance I don't think there is a huge amount of talent at DT in this draft. I'd look in FA at the likes of Fletcher Cox, Brandon Williams, Kendall Reyes etc

Whats your take on our depth at DT? I mean if Grady pans out we dont need a NT in 17 draft or FA so that leaves us getting a 3-tech. Grady is 6-1 30something. are they gonna look for a bigger body to line up next to him? T Jax is bigger and is at 3 tech this yyear but offers little pass rush. 

Would love to see them pick up a DT for nickel packages( replace babs) in the draft and go FA for base 3 tech (T jax) next year. 

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1 hour ago, GleasonForever! said:

Whats your take on our depth at DT? I mean if Grady pans out we dont need a NT in 17 draft or FA so that leaves us getting a 3-tech. Grady is 6-1 30something. are they gonna look for a bigger body to line up next to him? T Jax is bigger and is at 3 tech this yyear but offers little pass rush. 

Would love to see them pick up a DT for nickel packages( replace babs) in the draft and go FA for base 3 tech (T jax) next year. 

I think a lot depends on how Hageman, Jarrett and Shelby pan out this year. If TJax and Babs leave, as I suspect they will, I think we need to pick up a couple of bodies. If Jarrett excels at the 1 tech then I think we need we would need more depth at the 5 tech and 3 tech. If Jarrett struggles you could sign or draft a 1 tech, and move Jarrett back to 3 tech. I'd love to get a stud 3 tech like Fletcher Cox and draft a depth guy who could potentially cover both in the draft. In my ideal scenario we would look something like this:

 

5 tech - Hageman, Shelby, Bryan Cox Jr (draft)

1 tech - Jarrett, Mbu

3 tech - Fletcher Cox/Kendall Reyes (FA), Shelby, Bryan Cox Jr (draft)

LEO/SAM - Beasley, Tim Williams (draft), Clayborn

Edited by Smiler11
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44 minutes ago, Smiler11 said:

I think a lot depends on how Hageman, Jarrett and Shelby pan out this year. If TJax and Babs leave, as I suspect they will, I think we need to pick up a couple of bodies. If Jarrett excels at the 1 tech then I think we need we would need more depth at the 5 tech and 3 tech. If Jarrett struggles you could sign or draft a 1 tech, and move Jarrett back to 3 tech. I'd love to get a stud 3 tech like Fletcher Cox and draft a depth guy who could potentially cover both in the draft. In my ideal scenario we would look something like this:

 

5 tech - Hageman, Shelby, Bryan Cox Jr (draft)

1 tech - Jarrett, Mbu

3 tech - Fletcher Cox/Kendall Reyes (FA), Shelby, Bryan Cox Jr (draft)

LEO/SAM - Beasley, Clayborn, Reed

I could deal with that. Looks much improved.

we could go... Charles Harris in the first or Johnathan Allen and have

Leo - Charles Harris/Johnathan Allen

3- tech - Fletcher Cox

1- tech - Grady

5- tech - Hageman

Sam - Beasely

 

That would be awesome. 

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10 minutes ago, GleasonForever! said:

I could deal with that. Looks much improved.

we could go... Charles Harris in the first or Johnathan Allen and have

Leo - Charles Harris/Johnathan Allen

3- tech - Fletcher Cox

1- tech - Grady

5- tech - Hageman

Sam - Beasely

 

That would be awesome. 

I forgot to add Tim Williams from my draft at the LEO spot but Harris would be another option. I don't think Allen is a prototypical LEO, he might be better suited as a 5 tech or 3 tech in our defense.

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Where in the first are we picking?

 

 

Also, you never know how things shake out but to me the optimum scenario is double up on pass rushers early, depending on how they use Beasley...  They might forgo adding another linebacker if they believe Jones, Campbell, and Beasley are starters. 

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1 hour ago, datchrisb1 said:

Where in the first are we picking?

 

 

Also, you never know how things shake out but to me the optimum scenario is double up on pass rushers early, depending on how they use Beasley...  They might forgo adding another linebacker if they believe Jones, Campbell, and Beasley are starters. 

Jeez, I want to say late but I think we'll be picking somewhere around 17th again. 

I've got no problem with adding multiple pass rushers. I've been playing with an idea of signing Jamie Collins or Chandler Jones and drafting Tim Williams. 

Campbell and Jones are the only 2 inside linebackers on the roster next year so I'd like to see us add another. Inside linebacker is stacked in next year's draft. 

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8 minutes ago, datchrisb1 said:

Early pass rusher rankings for me

1. Johnathan Allen

2. Myles Garrett

3. Devonte Fields

4. DJ Smoot

5. Demarcus Walker

6. Malik McDowell

7. Deatrich Wise Jr

8. Tim Williams

9. Carl Lawson

10. Derek Barnett

As pure pass rushers, I have Garrett and Williams 1 and 2. 

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On 6/8/2016 at 5:34 PM, Smiler11 said:

As pure pass rushers, I have Garrett and Williams 1 and 2. 

Yeah, Williams is a beast too, just think he will be more coveted by traditional 3-4 teams. Honestly, I'm just not a fan of drafting another LEO early especially in the first. At Leo its' more of a depth issue than a legit starter. Its early, but to me we need dominate D-lineman. Guys that dominate at the line of scrimmage, that your not even concerned about dropping.  I could see Williams as the second best pass rusher, but I was kind of thinking about overall need. We need dominance at the line of scrimmage defensively. DJ Smoot is my sleeper a lot of people sleeping on him, Jonathan Allen to me is a better pass rusher than Williams plus he can play anywhere along the line of scrimmage, Devonte Fields is the most gifted but he's a knuckle head, aside from Allen Demarcus Walker is the most ready to play, Garrett has the highest ceiling and Deatrich Wise with his length is a close second as far as highest ceiling. To me anybody under 260 270 playing weight, I'm a little sketchy as to where they would fit as starters if I'm picking them early.

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9 hours ago, datchrisb1 said:

Yeah, Williams is a beast too, just think he will be more coveted by traditional 3-4 teams. Honestly, I'm just not a fan of drafting another LEO early especially in the first. At Leo its' more of a depth issue than a legit starter. Its early, but to me we need dominate D-lineman. Guys that dominate at the line of scrimmage, that your not even concerned about dropping.  I could see Williams as the second best pass rusher, but I was kind of thinking about overall need. We need dominance at the line of scrimmage defensively. DJ Smoot is my sleeper a lot of people sleeping on him, Jonathan Allen to me is a better pass rusher than Williams plus he can play anywhere along the line of scrimmage, Devonte Fields is the most gifted but he's a knuckle head, aside from Allen Demarcus Walker is the most ready to play, Garrett has the highest ceiling and Deatrich Wise with his length is a close second as far as highest ceiling. To me anybody under 260 270 playing weight, I'm a little sketchy as to where they would fit as starters if I'm picking them early.

See I think with Beasley moving to SAM, we have a relatively big hole at LEO. I like Jonathan Allen a lot, he'll probably go higher than Tim Williams as he's more scheme diverse but if you ask most Bama fans they would say Tim Williams is the best pass rusher on that team.

Smoot is definitely someone to keep an eye on - it'll be interesting to see how he plays in Lovie Smith's defense this year. 

Devonte Fields would be a great fit at the LEO spot, but just not sure we take that risk.

There are a bunch of good pass rushers in next years draft, and I think we had this in mind when we neglected pass rush this year, that and it was a terrible year for pass rushers. 

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On 08/06/2016 at 2:21 PM, datchrisb1 said:

Early pass rusher rankings for me

1. Johnathan Allen

2. Myles Garrett

3. Devonte Fields

4. DJ Smoot

5. Demarcus Walker

6. Malik McDowell

7. Deatrich Wise Jr

8. Tim Williams

9. Carl Lawson

10. Derek Barnett

Allen over Garrett? Why do you feel that way? IMO Garrett is the best player in the class and is the best pass rusher to come out in a long time.

Also not a Charles Harris fan?

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1 hour ago, Smiler11 said:

See I think with Beasley moving to SAM, we have a relatively big hole at LEO. I like Jonathan Allen a lot, he'll probably go higher than Tim Williams as he's more scheme diverse but if you ask most Bama fans they would say Tim Williams is the best pass rusher on that team.

Smoot is definitely someone to keep an eye on - it'll be interesting to see how he plays in Lovie Smith's defense this year. 

Devonte Fields would be a great fit at the LEO spot, but just not sure we take that risk.

There are a bunch of good pass rushers in next years draft, and I think we had this in mind when we neglected pass rush this year, that and it was a terrible year for pass rushers. 

I see Allen as a base end on running downs and 3 tech on passing downs. I don't see him winning on the edge in the NFL like a Williams, Fields and Garrett will. 

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2 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

I see Allen as a base end on running downs and 3 tech on passing downs. I don't see him winning on the edge in the NFL like a Williams, Fields and Garrett will. 

I think he'd excel in that role. I think he could also be great as an end in a traditional 4-3.

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5 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

Allen over Garrett? Why do you feel that way? IMO Garrett is the best player in the class and is the best pass rusher to come out in a long time.

Also not a Charles Harris fan?

 

I like upside and potential but I'm more of a bird in the hand type of a guy. Right now Allen is the better fit scheme wise, he's the more complete and ready player. I know what I'm getting in Allen, Garrett is more of a high ceiling guy to me. I like Allen's game better than Garrett. Garrett is purely relying on his athleticism, specifically speed, if you notice on tape when lineman get there hands on him it's game over. He has to get the jump on the tackle to effect the passer. To me I have to see you being just as much of a power guy as a speed guy when rushing the passer. Allen has both, put it this way I like Reggie White, John Randle, or Bruce Smith more than Leroy Selmen, Deacon Jones, or Derrick Thomas fan. 

 

I like Charles Harris, he's a good prospect. Mizzou produces a lot of defensive ends.

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5 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

I see Allen as a base end on running downs and 3 tech on passing downs. I don't see him winning on the edge in the NFL like a Williams, Fields and Garrett will. 

I try too look at how his game "would" translate in the NFL. To me Williams if you want him, your putting him on a 3-4 team where the 5 is lined up directly over that tackle, he's standing up (Williams) in a 2 point stands and the only thing he needs to worry about is using his best aspects, his first step to get the jump on the tackle. Where he doesn't have to really rely on the power aspect of the game.  All he needs to do is flatting that edge which is easier if he's in a 3-4, he has the 5 there plus he has his momentum already. Anybody technically can do this if they have the tools, he just needs to get his shoulders past the tackles, one arm is longer than 2, easier to power through for him and flatten the arch in this scheme. 

In a 4-3, to me Williams game doesn't translate as a base 4-3 end, **** to me Beasley would be the better LEO to begin with.  Already stated why I like him over Garrett and Fields is just a question mark all together. Fields is probably the most gifted guy coming out next year.

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5 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

Allen over Garrett? Why do you feel that way? IMO Garrett is the best player in the class and is the best pass rusher to come out in a long time.

Also not a Charles Harris fan?

 

2 hours ago, Smiler11 said:

I think he'd excel in that role. I think he could also be great as an end in a traditional 4-3.

 

5 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

I see Allen as a base end on running downs and 3 tech on passing downs. I don't see him winning on the edge in the NFL like a Williams, Fields and Garrett will. 

Basically to me playing on the line of scrimmage period is about dominating the guy across from you. Period and point blank, that's what it is about. You can run around guys all day long in college, when you get to the NFL messing with grown men, it's a different story. I want winners, basically, guys that pretty much "man handle" the guy in front of them. Take's the man pride, soul, make they momma upset in the stands type of dudes. I'm not looking at the stat line, how many sacks you got because like I said in college, you can "run around that edge" all day long. I'm looking at your game itself. Garrett is a beast, probably the most athletic guy coming out on the edge, but does he "man handle" guys in front of him. Not to the degree Johnathan Allen does.

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 I think we have to get a pass rusher off the edge first, and then a DT. In FA I like Jabaal Sheard. I don't think Chandler Jones gets away from AZ and I think NE re-signs Collins and Hightower, but let Sheard walk. 

In the draft I love Williams but if he balls out this year he could go early. Depends on where we are picking. So right now my choices are Sheard or Williams.

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On 10/06/2016 at 8:14 AM, datchrisb1 said:

 

 

Basically to me playing on the line of scrimmage period is about dominating the guy across from you. Period and point blank, that's what it is about. You can run around guys all day long in college, when you get to the NFL messing with grown men, it's a different story. I want winners, basically, guys that pretty much "man handle" the guy in front of them. Take's the man pride, soul, make they momma upset in the stands type of dudes. I'm not looking at the stat line, how many sacks you got because like I said in college, you can "run around that edge" all day long. I'm looking at your game itself. Garrett is a beast, probably the most athletic guy coming out on the edge, but does he "man handle" guys in front of him. Not to the degree Johnathan Allen does.

It's alot easier to man handle guys in college than the pros. Unless you have elite power/strength it's hard to predict how much your game will translate especially if it's your primary means of "winning". When it comes to Allen I don't see a great first step or a consistent ability to bend the edge which is the 2 most important traits in edge rusher imo. Don't get me wrong he's a good prospect but I'd be surprised to see him going top 10. 

Garrett is head and shoulders above any edge player in this class and is my #1 player in this draft. It will be even more evident as the draft approaches. 

Edited by Bobby.Digital
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2 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

It's alot easier to man handle guys in college than the pros. Unless you have elite power/strength it's hard to predict how much your game will translate especially if it's your primary means of "winning". When it comes to Allen I don't see a great first step or a consistent ability to bend the edge which is the 2 most important traits in edge rusher imo. Don't get me wrong he's a good prospect but I'd be surprised to see him going top 10. 

Garrett is head and shoulders above any edge player in this class and is my #1 player in this draft. It will be even more evident as the draft approaches. 

Agreed. It's all about projection with edge rushers to the NFL, because the tackles in the NFL are bigger, stronger and faster than anything they are likely to face in college. In my experience speed kills off the edge, both in college and the NFL. If you look at the majority of the top pass rushers in the NFL, they were elite athletes. 

Agreed Myles Garrett is head and shoulders above any other pass rusher in this class at this point.

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5 hours ago, Bobby.Digital said:

It's alot easier to man handle guys in college than the pros. Unless you have elite power/strength it's hard to predict how much your game will translate especially if it's your primary means of "winning". When it comes to Allen I don't see a great first step or a consistent ability to bend the edge which is the 2 most important traits in edge rusher imo. Don't get me wrong he's a good prospect but I'd be surprised to see him going top 10. 

Garrett is head and shoulders above any edge player in this class and is my #1 player in this draft. It will be even more evident as the draft approaches. 

 

3 hours ago, Smiler11 said:

Agreed. It's all about projection with edge rushers to the NFL, because the tackles in the NFL are bigger, stronger and faster than anything they are likely to face in college. In my experience speed kills off the edge, both in college and the NFL. If you look at the majority of the top pass rushers in the NFL, they were elite athletes. 

Agreed Myles Garrett is head and shoulders above any other pass rusher in this class at this point.

That is true, it is a whole lot more easier, just like everything else. The game all together is easier. Its' more easier to bend the edge in college, than dominate the guy in front of you. THE EASY PART IN COLLEGE IS RUNNING AROUND THE GUY NOT GOING THROUGH THE GUY. You also have to consider the competition he is facing. You can't say you can't predict one thing but can predict the next. His power and heavy hands can be projected to the next level as well as his first step. Don't know where your getting it can't be...  If the guy posts double digit sacks and TFLs and basically on tap every time he pressures the QB he is taking the O lineman right back there with him on the way there dude that translates. He lives on the other side of the line of scrimmage. The guy sacks the QB and the guard and tackle on a consistent basis, that translates!

Honestly this reminds me of the year when Clowney was coming out and I said the same thing I said now. Running around the edge well (bend) and your first step is only good if the rest of your game is solid. I said Khalil Mack would be the beast because the other parts of his game was solid. I also said Clowney would probably bust if he doesn't develop those other parts. All of you tried to run me off the board. Clowneys' first step and bend is better than all of those guys, what is he doing right now. Don't care what position along the front you are projecting fellas, power and actually dominating the guy in front of you always translates. That's the easy projection. People see some guy just running around a corner real low to the ground and think that's all they need when the reality is if you have that great, but that's nothing without the rest. The other things are what is important. Same thing with Garrett, with Garrett if you put a good tackle on him that is consistently over setting him, put your hands on him and like Clowney did when he was in college all of a sudden thats' Garrett's day off from work. Clowney had the same hype and played the same way, you have to actually watch the games and not listen to the hype. I don't listen to the hype, I go and see for myself. Saying the same thing now, y'all got the game wrong, Allen is the better projected player RIGHT NOW, Garrett has the higher ceiling, that's not saying he will be the better player or is the better player. 

 

The "edge" in college is there all day even for guys who aren't that quick. Allen has a very consistent first step. I will agree with you about bending the edge, but I guarantee you you want find a report questioning his first step. He has an elite first step. But, I would disagree that the ability to bend the edge and first step quickness is the most important. The only reason these "first step" quick guys are able to do what they are able to do in the league is because the tackle respect all the other parts of there game. People get this twisted a lot, like rushing the passer is about running around a "edge" and that's it. Your get off is very important, it's not getting you anywhere without everything else in your game.  Allen has an elite get off, not elite bend will agree with you there.

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Like I said in the other thread, I'm more of a bird in hand type of guy.  They pick up these agile, quick guys because they think they can be developed, they can be worked on.  I don't know any of these players or there temperament, usually find that out through reports. There aren't many reports on Garretts character. All I know is the games I've seen so far.  Right now on tape, Allen is about a notch, notch and a half better than Garrett as an overall prospect and a pass rusher as far as how he translates to the NFL. To me because Garrett is a freak of nature, so was Clowney, other than sheer upside it's not even close.  Its' early things could change. 

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