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Scott Pioli Named Most Influential Falcon, But Just How Influential Is He?


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I always get a kick out of suggestions that TD could get fired and replaced by Pioli. That's just silliness. It's both or neither.

Ive said this before... We are in a good situation even tho a preferred change at the end of the season Pioli is scouting guys and setting up the draft and FA rankings/boards.... Quinn and staff is te

This is not really a defense of Smitty, because I supported him being fired. But in just looking at things from what we know, having read "The War Room" and observed the team closely through that tim

The fact that you can remember the big FA successes sort of suggests they're outliers. Sort of like the "it doesnt matter if a CB is short, look at Brent Grimes!" way of thinking. I think the big big ticket FAs are typically disappointing. Most of the big FA successes are the guys that you get undervalued (think Michael Bennett/Cliff Avril). Which is why I liked what we did this offseason so much. A ton of potential excess value.

And yeah, Lynch was a trade acquisition for two mid-rounders. Because Buffalo gave up on him because he wasn't very good.

I would agree that the successes are much more rare than the failures. Of course if it were easy, any idiot could do the job.

Heck, with his Wayback Machine, Mr. Peabody and his boy Sherman RamsFanSince2015 would have a job as co-GM, and be "Exec Of The Year" every single year.

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Those 5 picks we have up for julio were worth while, those drafts were top heavy and Mike smith doesn't play rookies unless they are all world talent.

Kickers don't change games like wrs do, had we had something resembling a real defense in 12, we would've had a lombardi.

LMAO. Had our kicker not changed the SEA game we would have never played in the NFCCG. Julio didn't contribute much to that win by the way.
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LMAO. Had our kicker not changed the SEA game we would have never played in the NFCCG. Julio didn't contribute much to that win by the way.

Go home ForFlucksSake1970, your drunk. Julio only lead us in receptions that game while coverage was rolled his way. Kickers wouldn't kick if we don't get the yards needed to be FG position, so I know for a fact that no one GM except your bright old self would pick a field goal kicker in the first round.

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Go home ForFlucksSake1970, your drunk. Julio only lead us in receptions that game while coverage was rolled his way. Kickers wouldn't kick if we don't get the yards needed to be FG position, so I know for a fact that no one GM except your bright old self would pick a field goal kicker in the first round.

Actually, the Aint's took Russel Erxlaben (sp?) in the first, and the Raiders took Sebastian Janikowski and HoF Ray Guy in the first. A case could be made for both of the Raiders picks to be reasonably successful.

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Actually, the Aint's took Russel Erxlaben (sp?) in the first, and the Raiders took Sebastian Janikowski and HoF Ray Guy in the first. A case could be made for both of the Raiders picks to be reasonably successful.

It's the Raiders bro. And sorry a55 pre superbowl Nawlin's.

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It's the Raiders bro. And sorry a55 pre superbowl Nawlin's.

The Raiders that drafted Ray Guy were still one of the best, winningest franchises in ALL of sports, not just football.

As for Janikowski, he's been the only real offensive weapon they've had for about a decade. Seabass vs every offensive player the Raiders have taken in a decade: Seabass easily out-produced all of them COMBINED!!!

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The Raiders that drafted Ray Guy were still one of the best, winningest franchises in ALL of sports, not just football.

As for Janikowski, he's been the only real offensive weapon they've had for about a decade. Seabass vs every offensive player the Raiders have taken in a decade: Seabass easily out-produced all of them COMBINED!!!

The Janikowski pick was absolutely atrocious.

The Ray Guy thing was in a different world. I don't think there's much value to looking at how teams drafted 40 years ago....the process is way different now.

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The Raiders that drafted Ray Guy were still one of the best, winningest franchises in ALL of sports, not just football.

As for Janikowski, he's been the only real offensive weapon they've had for about a decade. Seabass vs every offensive player the Raiders have taken in a decade: Seabass easily out-produced all of them COMBINED!!!

That was before pacman was even a game man. A kicker doesn't exactly produce yardage, and any raider fan will tell you he would not Crack their top 5 Raiders of the last decade. He's a huge part of the reason the Raiders are the worst offensive team in the nfl. Spending a 1st on a kicker is like buying a Ferrari, but living out of a cardboard box.
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That was before pacman was even a game man. A kicker doesn't exactly produce yardage, and any raider fan will tell you he would not Crack their top 5 Raiders of the last decade. He's a huge part of the reason the Raiders are the worst offensive team in the nfl. Spending a 1st on a kicker is like buying a Ferrari, but living out of a cardboard box.

That analogy reminds me of a story when a team drafted a WR for 5 picks when the Defense was for sure in need.

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That analogy reminds me of a story when a team drafted a WR for 5 picks when the Defense was for sure in need.

The defense wasn't for sure in need. We had signed two top of the market free agents and spent our previous two 1st round picks on the defense.

Our defense was middle of the pack the year before and there was no reason to think it was going to get markedly worse with an "upgrade" at coordinator.

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The defense wasn't for sure in need. We had signed two top of the market free agents and spent our previous two 1st round picks on the defense.

Our defense was middle of the pack the year before and there was no reason to think it was going to get markedly worse with an "upgrade" at coordinator.

Abe was what, 32-33 at the time? We definitely should have been looking for his eventual replacement by 2011.

Nobody likes to hear this, but our D has never really been the same since Lofton was allowed to leave the following season for NO.

But yes, some of the bigger aging issues were on offense, specifically OL, TE, and RB.

Edited by Vandy
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The defense wasn't for sure in need. We had signed two top of the market free agents and spent our previous two 1st round picks on the defense.

Our defense was middle of the pack the year before and there was no reason to think it was going to get markedly worse with an "upgrade" at coordinator.

The same defense failed to force a punt against Green Bay in the playoffs. I'm going to call that "for sure in need."

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The same defense failed to force a punt against Green Bay in the playoffs. I'm going to call that "for sure in need."

That Green Bay offense was fantastic.....sometimes, defenses get beat up. The Seahawks struggled on defense against the Pats in the SB....does that mean they're "in need"?

And again, we signed a top of the market defensive end to further supplement our defense. And we had invested significant resources into the defense in the 18 months prior to that.

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Abe was what, 32-33 at the time? We definitely should have been looking for his eventual replacement by 2011.

Nobody likes to hear this, but our D has never really been the same since Lofton was allowed to leave the following season for NO.

But yes, some of the bigger aging issues were on offense, specifically OL, TE, and RB.

But looking for an eventual replacement isn't the same as pouring all of your resources into the defense.

The defense was at an okay place. Not great. Not elite. Decent. At a level that many defenses have succeeded with. The FO made an "over the top" move to turn a relative strength into a notable strength. And it worked. We were a good team in 2011 and a very good team in 2012. It blows that it didn't pay off with a SB....but it's not like the team cratered immediately afterward. They lost a 50/50 game against a very good football team in the conference championship. So it goes.

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Wr was also a need, one can argue in 2011. Roddy white carried us to all those wins alongside turner, and he was almost done.

Anyway we've spent considerable resources on defense than we have on offense, we just didn't have the right coach to put it all together.

-Lofton (2nd)

-Chevy to the levy (3rd)

-de could not (3rd)

-Peria jellybelly (1st)

-moore (2nd)

-crisp Owens (3rd)

-Featherspoon (1st)

-Corey's Peter (3rd)

-Akeem dented (3rd)

F.A:

-Drobbery

-Ray J edwards

-grimes

That's 9 high picks including the entire 2009 draft, and 3 high profile free agents. I honestly don't think Mike smith was all that interested in acquiring high caliber personnel which is why we had a marsh mellow fluff defense. The real architect of the jags defense was probably jack del rio, who also put together a high quality denver defense.

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Wr was also a need, one can argue in 2011. Roddy white carried us to all those wins alongside turner, and he was almost done.

Anyway we've spent considerable resources on defense than we have on offense, we just didn't have the right coach to put it all together.

-Lofton (2nd)

-Chevy to the levy (3rd)

-de could not (3rd)

-Peria jellybelly (1st)

-moore (2nd)

-crisp Owens (3rd)

-Featherspoon (1st)

-Corey's Peter (3rd)

-Akeem dented (3rd)

F.A:

-Drobbery

-Ray J edwards

-grimes

That's 9 high picks including the entire 2009 draft, and 3 high profile free agents. I honestly don't think Mike smith was all that interested in acquiring high caliber personnel which is why we had a marsh mellow fluff defense. The real architect of the jags defense was probably jack del rio, who also put together a high quality denver defense.

I don't know if Mike Smith didn't value high caliber personnel. I think it was just the result of Smith overvaluing players that were 4 year starters and team captains in college over more athletic less "experienced" players

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We had more pressing needs than WR all over the roster in April of 2011.

RG - to replace Dahl. Took three years of a RG merrygoround to do so

OT - to prepare for Sackmaker's annual injury or to replace Clabo if we decided to Troff him

ER - to bookend Abe. Another three years and wasted FA dollars on RayRay and Osi

TE - a second TE that would eventually replace TonyG. Not a 6'8" NCAA power forward with stone hands

RB - a change of pace back that could take Turner's place after 2012

LB - inside and outside guys to bolster the unit in case we Troffed Lofton or Spoon ended up being on the Mash unit

CB - to replace Grimes if he didn't recover from injury or if we decided to let him walk after 2012

FB - to replace Ovie had we stayed with the smash mouth run game like we should have

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But looking for an eventual replacement isn't the same as pouring all of your resources into the defense.

The defense was at an okay place. Not great. Not elite. Decent. At a level that many defenses have succeeded with. The FO made an "over the top" move to turn a relative strength into a notable strength. And it worked. We were a good team in 2011 and a very good team in 2012. It blows that it didn't pay off with a SB....but it's not like the team cratered immediately afterward. They lost a 50/50 game against a very good football team in the conference championship. So it goes.

I agree, at least up to a point. Even though I understood the reasoning, I never agreed with the Julio trade, we were an aging team in too many key areas: Abe/Turner/TG/OL/CB. That trade also changed the culture of our defense and our team overall, we went from a balanced team offensively to trying to become a newer version of "greatest show on turf"....and our defense and depth suffered accordingly.Letting a young Lofton and Grimes walk significantly hurt as well, and that has to go on GM IMHO in not planning things out longer than beyond the immediate..

Mike Smith is and isn't alot of things, but one thing he's not is the kind of coach who can be successful with a "greatest show on turf" offense and no talent defensively. And all the injuries compounded those shortcomings even more, and we've wasted two years of our franchise QB in his prime.

I'm glad we have Julio, but I'm more excited that we're getting back to what made us successful prior to that trade....emphasis on shoring up and rebuilding our D and having more balance offensive attack,

Edited by Vandy
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Wr was also a need, one can argue in 2011. Roddy white carried us to all those wins alongside turner, and he was almost done.

Anyway we've spent considerable resources on defense than we have on offense, we just didn't have the right coach to put it all together.

-Lofton (2nd)

-Chevy to the levy (3rd)

-de could not (3rd)

-Peria jellybelly (1st)

-moore (2nd)

-crisp Owens (3rd)

-Featherspoon (1st)

-Corey's Peter (3rd)

-Akeem dented (3rd)

F.A:

-Drobbery

-Ray J edwards

-grimes

That's 9 high picks including the entire 2009 draft, and 3 high profile free agents. I honestly don't think Mike smith was all that interested in acquiring high caliber personnel which is why we had a marsh mellow fluff defense. The real architect of the jags defense was probably jack del rio, who also put together a high quality denver defense.

Most of those are bust draft and bust "high profile" free agent picks. Those poor decisions are more a GM issue than a coaching issue.

And we could have gotten a more than competent WR (Torrey Smith/ Randall Cobb/Alshon Jeffrey) with one of those picks we traded...if we were a competent in those two year's draft.

Edited by Vandy
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