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DirtyBird8711

Scott Pioli Named Most Influential Falcon, But Just How Influential Is He?

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Which is better than 0-3 getting blown out in 2 of the 3 while scoring a total of 14 points on offense in those 2 games!

Are you serious? You'd rather go 10-22 than risk the chance getting blown out in playoffs?

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And that think Gronk can't block. He's actually one of the best blocking TE's in the league, in addition to being THE BEST receiving TE.

Actually, it was someone from the 'Pro-Julio Trade' gang who made that uninformed comment.

This thread's gone way past the point of silly.

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Are you serious? You'd rather go 10-22 than risk the chance getting blown out in playoffs?

Where is this 10-22 coming from and why is this linked to Julio Jones????

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How does a topic about Scott Pioli turn into a 20 page Julio thread?

Actually, I can think of about, oh, 70 reasons how that could happen.

Think it's safe to say we've entered Swift territory at this point.

ukfalc likes this

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I was initially skeptical of the trade. In retrospect, looking at the likely cast of suspects we would have gotten instead, we lucked out. Unless, of course, RamsFanSince2015 would loan us the Wayback Machine he clipped from Mr. Peabody.

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You ain't lyin Larry:

-Let Grimes, Dahl, Lofton, Svitek, Vance and Weems walk

-Cut Abe and Clabo

-Underestimated the readiness of our young Oline busts

-Replacing Turner with a 30 year old RB instead of a young stud like Lacy, Murray, Bell or Bernard

-Replaced Abe with Osi

-Signed RayRay Edwards as a bookend for Abe

-Didn't bring Mud Duck back when he said he wanted to come back

-Not being able to find a low round gem in seven years

-Overpaying players like Sackmaker, RobbinUs, RayRay, Blalock and Jenkins

-Reaching for several marginal players like Southward, Quizz and Puddin who were all projected to go one or two rounds later

-Drafting a slew of injury prone players like Julio, Sackmaker, Spoon, Ewing, MyJohnson, Peters, Jelly, WillyMo and more

-Trading three picks for an injury prone T-Rex then resigning him to a cap crippling deal

-Passing on Clay Matthews, Geno Atkins, Duane Brown, Cliff Avril, Carl Nicks and Dez Bryant for Jelly, Brawley, Sackmaker, Dougle, Beer and Featherspoon

-Traded five picks for Julio that we could have used on Justin Houston, DeMarco Murray, Kevin Zeitler, Julius Thomas and Brandon Boykin

That will get you to 10-22 in a hurry.

LOL @ pretty much all of this.

What a ******* joke.

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Tbh, I'd really like to see that fabled team that managed to have Grimes, Abe (lol at your other mentions), Turner (or Lacy/Bell/etc), Clay Matthews, Geno Atkins, Duane Brown, Cliff Avril, Carl Nicks, Dez Bryant, Justin Houston, Demarco Murray, Kevin Zeitler, Julius Thomas, and Brandon Boykin. It's a heck of a team, and as you say, he was an idiot for passing it up. Just imagine what a person with actual intelligence could've done in the draft, right? And eh. You know. A time machine.

Would also like to see us keep all those middling 35 y/o veterans that were mentioned instead of drafting "young studs," which were also mentioned.

Embrace the suck likes this

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GTFOH son. Gronk blocked 304 times last year. Nate Solder their stud tackle only blocked 422 times. The most of any Patriot.

Solder was probably hurt then, dude julio blocks aswell, so no sht he has to block in the run game, and chip block some in the pass game to get open. Gronk gets targeted as much as a top 10 wr (8.7 targets per game, more than dez bryant for your reference), and lafel had a breakout season for them. In fact they had 3 guys on the cusp of having 1k yards. The notion that wrs arent important is a figment of your senile imagination.

http://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/reports/targets/te.php

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Solder was probably hurt then, dude julio blocks aswell, so no sht he has to block in the run game, and chip block some in the pass game to get open. Gronk gets targeted as much as a top 10 wr (8.7 targets per game, more than dez bryant for your reference), and lafel had a breakout season for them. In fact they had 3 guys on the cusp of having 1k yards. The notion that wrs arent important is a figment of your senile imagination.

http://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/reports/targets/te.php

Kickers are important too but you don't see us giving up 5 picks to get one do you?

FalconFanSince1970 and Vandy like this

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GTFOH son. Gronk blocked 304 times last year. Nate Solder their stud tackle only blocked 422 times. The most of any Patriot.

You really think their stud tackle only blocked 422 times while starting 16 games for a team that 1073 plays?

Maybe watch some actual football rather than think your $25 subscriptions can substitute for actual knowledge?

Embrace the suck likes this

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Solder was probably hurt then, dude julio blocks aswell, so no sht he has to block in the run game, and chip block some in the pass game to get open. Gronk gets targeted as much as a top 10 wr (8.7 targets per game, more than dez bryant for your reference), and lafel had a breakout season for them. In fact they had 3 guys on the cusp of having 1k yards. The notion that wrs arent important is a figment of your senile imagination.

http://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/reports/targets/te.php

Solder played over 1000 snaps last year.....as an OL. I guarantee he blocked more than 422 times.

And just FTR, Gronk is the best blocking TE in the league AND the best receiving TE in the league. He's an all time great. An all time great that has injury issues that would lead to him being labeled "injury prone" on this board. But while he's on the Pats, he's a great player. Julio though? Major injury prone player.

Embrace the suck likes this

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Solder played over 1000 snaps last year.....as an OL. I guarantee he blocked more than 422 times.

And just FTR, Gronk is the best blocking TE in the league AND the best receiving TE in the league. He's an all time great. An all time great that has injury issues that would lead to him being labeled "injury prone" on this board. But while he's on the Pats, he's a great player. Julio though? Major injury prone player.

or a hood Ornament

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We had one of our best drafts with Pioli as the lead. However, Tyson Jackson was a dud, and Paul Soulia is no more than serviceable. So I'd say so far it's a wash. I'm just happy TD was put in check, we would have probably traded up for Fowler is TD was in full control.

I think GM's should strictly be judged off of drafting and not free agent signings. Not only do 75% of free agents get more money than they actually deserve, they usually don't end up as good as they used to be on their new team. I actually applaud TD and Pioli for never breaking the bank and getting hooked on the big names. Remember when everybody on this board wanted Nnamdi Asomugha? They wanted TD to break the bank on that guy. Instead, he traded a 7th round pick for Asante Samuel. WAY better decision. Last year, everyone wanted Byrd, look how that worked out. This year, it was Suh. But history has shown that big name free agents are just cap killers that don't live up to expectations

peoriabird likes this

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I think GM's should strictly be judged off of drafting and not free agent signings. Not only do 75% of free agents get more mone than they actually deserve, they usually don't end up as good as they used to be on their new team. I actually applaud TD and Pioli for never breaking the bank and getting hooked on the big names. Remember when everybody on this board wanted Nnamdi Asomugha? They wanted TD to break the bank on that guy. Instead, he traded a 7th round pick for Asante Samuel. WAY better decision. Last year, everyone wanted Byrd, look how that worked out. This year, it was Suh. But history has shown that big name free agents are just cap killers that don't live up to expectations

Don't you know that In order to be a message board GM you have to have selective memory.? You can only bring up the misses and not the good decisions!

JD dirtybird21 likes this

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Don't you know that In order to be a message board GM you have to have selective memory.? You can only bring up the misses and not the good decisions!

Lol exactly. I'm not saying TD and Pioli have been A+ guys. Signing Jackson and Soliai at this point DOES look like a bad decision. But lets wait and see how they are utilized in a completely different defense before concluding that they just suck as players. Also, TD has had some below average drafts. But, he isn't a terrible GM like many on this board would suggest. Lots of people just have extremely unrealistic expectations. They expect every player in every draft to essentially be an eventual starter and for every guy that's a 1st, 2nd, and sometimes even 3rd round pick to be a "star." My favorite is when people say "Looking back at the 2012 draft, this is who we COULD have drafted, man is TD such an idiot!"

Lornoth likes this

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Those 5 picks we have up for julio were worth while, those drafts were top heavy and Mike smith doesn't play rookies unless they are all world talent.

Kickers are important too but you don't see us giving up 5 picks to get one do you?

Those 5 picks we have up for julio were worth while, those drafts were top heavy and Mike smith doesn't play rookies unless they are all world talent.

Kickers don't change games like wrs do, had we had something resembling a real defense in 12, we would've had a lombardi.

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Lol exactly. I'm not saying TD and Pioli have been A+ guys. Signing Jackson and Soliai at this point DOES look like a bad decision. But lets wait and see how they are utilized in a completely different defense before concluding that they just suck as players. Also, TD has had some below average drafts. But, he isn't a terrible GM like many on this board would suggest. Lots of people just have extremely unrealistic expectations. They expect every player in every draft to essentially be an eventual starter and for every guy that's a 1st, 2nd, and sometimes even 3rd round pick to be a "star." My favorite is when people say "Looking back at the 2012 draft, this is who we COULD have drafted, man is TD such an idiot!"

Exactly. I've been critical of TD for a number of things. I think he's wasted opportunities to trade backwards. I think he ignored the LB position too long. I think he overpaid Tyson, should have gone younger at RB instead of SJax and signed Baker to an inappropriate contract STRUCTURE. He's been far from perfect.

But no GM is. And all of the analysis places us as one of the better teams at personnel management over the last 10 years. Our problem has been that we haven't hit any home runs in the mid-late rounds.....we tend to hit singles. Maybe that's on TD or maybe it's on the entire organization. We don't know.

It's always easier to attack one person when you can appeal to the successes of 31 other teams. But the fact that so few teams consistently turn mid-late rounders into great players is very telling. Aside from Baltimore's ability to turn day 3 picks into pass rushers who yield solid comp picks and a brief two-year run by the Seahawks, you don't see it happen consistently. Everyone misses all the time. ****, you have trouble finding a 1st round with a high hit rate.

Vandy likes this

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You really think their stud tackle only blocked 422 times while starting 16 games for a team that 1073 plays?

Maybe watch some actual football rather than think your $25 subscriptions can substitute for actual knowledge?

You two should be married.

😳

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I think GM's should strictly be judged off of drafting and not free agent signings. Not only do 75% of free agents get more money than they actually deserve, they usually don't end up as good as they used to be on their new team. I actually applaud TD and Pioli for never breaking the bank and getting hooked on the big names. Remember when everybody on this board wanted Nnamdi Asomugha? They wanted TD to break the bank on that guy. Instead, he traded a 7th round pick for Asante Samuel. WAY better decision. Last year, everyone wanted Byrd, look how that worked out. This year, it was Suh. But history has shown that big name free agents are just cap killers that don't live up to expectations

free agency comes with the territory in being a good GM. As does drafting players, managing salary cap, selection of HC, et al.

At the end of the day, a GM is judged by W-L, just as a HC is, over time.

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I think GM's should strictly be judged off of drafting and not free agent signings. Not only do 75% of free agents get more money than they actually deserve, they usually don't end up as good as they used to be on their new team. I actually applaud TD and Pioli for never breaking the bank and getting hooked on the big names. Remember when everybody on this board wanted Nnamdi Asomugha? They wanted TD to break the bank on that guy. Instead, he traded a 7th round pick for Asante Samuel. WAY better decision. Last year, everyone wanted Byrd, look how that worked out. This year, it was Suh. But history has shown that big name free agents are just cap killers that don't live up to expectations

While that is often true, there are also examples such as Marshawn Lynch, Jerome Bettis, Reggie White, Priest Holmes, Drew Brees, Jonathan Vilma, and Peyton Manning that can be held up as examples of smart gambles on big-name free agents.

Actually, one or two of those names may be trades. But even if they are, my point still stands.

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Exactly. I've been critical of TD for a number of things. I think he's wasted opportunities to trade backwards. I think he ignored the LB position too long. I think he overpaid Tyson, should have gone younger at RB instead of SJax and signed Baker to an inappropriate contract STRUCTURE. He's been far from perfect.

But no GM is. And all of the analysis places us as one of the better teams at personnel management over the last 10 years. Our problem has been that we haven't hit any home runs in the mid-late rounds.....we tend to hit singles. Maybe that's on TD or maybe it's on the entire organization. We don't know.

It's always easier to attack one person when you can appeal to the successes of 31 other teams. But the fact that so few teams consistently turn mid-late rounders into great players is very telling. Aside from Baltimore's ability to turn day 3 picks into pass rushers who yield solid comp picks and a brief two-year run by the Seahawks, you don't see it happen consistently. Everyone misses all the time. ****, you have trouble finding a 1st round with a high hit rate.

Well that is one side of the coin for sure. **** I can even agree with some of that. The thing is depending on the pick determines who takes ownership of it to some around here. If the pick was bad then Smitty influenced it. If the pick was good well **** TD is the man. People around here have agendas and we can talk until we are blue in the face but no one is going to sway in that opinion. Hence this thread now being 21 pages.

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While that is often true, there are also examples such as Marshawn Lynch, Jerome Bettis, Reggie White, Priest Holmes, Drew Brees, Jonathan Vilma, and Peyton Manning that can be held up as examples of smart gambles on big-name free agents.

Actually, one or two of those names may be trades. But even if they are, my point still stands.

The fact that you can remember the big FA successes sort of suggests they're outliers. Sort of like the "it doesnt matter if a CB is short, look at Brent Grimes!" way of thinking. I think the big big ticket FAs are typically disappointing. Most of the big FA successes are the guys that you get undervalued (think Michael Bennett/Cliff Avril). Which is why I liked what we did this offseason so much. A ton of potential excess value.

And yeah, Lynch was a trade acquisition for two mid-rounders. Because Buffalo gave up on him because he wasn't very good.

JD dirtybird21 and Vandy like this

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