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4.5 underdogs

Mark Brunell's 1St And 2Nd Tier Quarterbacks

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How do you even rank QBs? Statistically, I believe Ryan is top 10 every season. But statistics don't win football games, so…..

Do we go by playoff wins? Super Bowls? If so, then idiots like Trent Dilfer get into the conversation over people like Dan Marino.

Do we go by what the pundits think? Then there is no top 10 because it changes week to week as their preferences blow with the wind (it probably includes Mariotta and Winston right now even though neither have played a down in the NFL).

Let's just be real -- ranking QBs is folly. Football is a team sport. And we have a REALLY good QB, so we ought not be worrying about things that aren't problems.

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These are the QBs that represented there teams in the AFC/NFC championship games since 2012. Rodgers, Wilson x2, Luck, Brady x3, Capernick x2, Flacco, Ryan.

Obviously a QB can't win a game by themselves. But it the modern NFL you need a good QB (top 12) to win a Championship.

FYI Ryan isn't elite. More in that top 7-10 range.

O yeah...."Get back to me". Smh...

LOL....Gazoo and most everyone here are way too emotionally invested in the subject matter when it pertains to this team's QB...how dare someone opinion some things ATL QB possibly needs to improve on?.....the weeping and gnashing of teeth defensiveness here is silly when it comes to our QB.

Although overhyped in media, the fact is QB IS the most important position on the team, and on the best teams is one of if not THE leader of the team. On a team that went 10-22, some of that has to go on the QB,or specifically to his overall. Although I believe Ryan's QB play was very good which is a form of leadership by example, I feel he needs to work on his leadership intangibles by taking a harder stance against losing, to the point of having a refuse to lose mentality. The best ones have that, I want our QB to be one of the best, and in my view this is the biggest area he needs to develop.

And yes, Ryan is in my view without question a Top 10 QB.

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Personal likes? Sure.

Luck, P. Manning, Rodgers, Rivers, Stafford, Flacco, R. Wilson, Kaep, Cam, Teddy, Mariota, Ben...meh...its just 12 guys. I overstated. This is just like as in like. Kinda like, "I like 7.62 better than 5.56." Even though really it doesn't matter at the end of the day.

Luck to me is just plain exciting. Fun to watch.

P. Manning is P. Manning. I root against him based on who he's playing against...but dude is just HoF. Scary guy.

Rodgers is like a thorn to me. He's probably the most instinctive on the list.

Rivers is just a nasty guy. Mean as a viper.

Stafford plays like he's on something. Dude is like a crash test dummy.

Flacco is interesting on and off the field. But that arm tho.

R. Wilson is a playmaker...period.

Kaep is explosive. Love watching him play the game.

Cam is what people wish Tebow was. Tebow didn't make my list, but I'm interested to see what he does.

Teddy has a strange play. I enjoyed watching him play.

Mariota is a cool guy. Hope he does well. As of right now, I like him from his college days.

Ben is just a monster. Fun to watch people try to bring him down. Its just not fair.

My list has nothing to do with performance. Just like. As far as performance? I still say Ryan is top 15. Maybe #11 or 12.

I find it interesting that a rabid falcon fan like yourself doesn't rank his fav team's QB among his Top 15 fav QBs although said QB is clearly among top QBs in performance.

Not calling you out here at all, more just picking your brain. and I do get you are a defense guy who thinks QBs are overrated.

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Personal likes? Sure.

Luck, P. Manning, Rodgers, Rivers, Stafford, Flacco, R. Wilson, Kaep, Cam, Teddy, Mariota, Ben...meh...its just 12 guys. I overstated. This is just like as in like. Kinda like, "I like 7.62 better than 5.56." Even though really it doesn't matter at the end of the day.

Luck to me is just plain exciting. Fun to watch.

P. Manning is P. Manning. I root against him based on who he's playing against...but dude is just HoF. Scary guy.

Rodgers is like a thorn to me. He's probably the most instinctive on the list.

Rivers is just a nasty guy. Mean as a viper.

Stafford plays like he's on something. Dude is like a crash test dummy.

Flacco is interesting on and off the field. But that arm tho.

R. Wilson is a playmaker...period.

Kaep is explosive. Love watching him play the game.

Cam is what people wish Tebow was. Tebow didn't make my list, but I'm interested to see what he does.

Teddy has a strange play. I enjoyed watching him play.

Mariota is a cool guy. Hope he does well. As of right now, I like him from his college days.

Ben is just a monster. Fun to watch people try to bring him down. Its just not fair.

My list has nothing to do with performance. Just like. As far as performance? I still say Ryan is top 15. Maybe #11 or 12.

I hope everyone quieted down now. I love Ice, I think he is 6-7. He has to win games this year or he will drop. I know it's a team game but the ball is in this dudes hands constantly. Mike Smith was terrible the last couple years so maybe Quinn has this defense middle of the road so we can see where Ryan really stands.

Knight of God likes this

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Well thought out post, Larry.

I think Romo, Rivers, Ryan are all very good QBs, but all also fall a notch below greatness because of what I explained on Matt. Randomness is unacceptable to the very best, they find a way to push through whatever adversity they face, which is when true leadership takes place. Matt has so many good character traits you want in a QB, and I want him to find that 'refuse to lose' that overcomes bad coaching and any other adversity out there that comes our team's way.

Thanks man. I like having this discussion because it's pretty fundamental to how I view the game in general.

But if randomness were unacceptable, wouldnt Rodgers have won in Seattle last year? I mean holy ****....how many chances did Wilson give him? 4 turnovers? Wouldnt Brady have won at least one of those Giants SBs?

A QB only controls so much. To the fullest extent of what that means, I won't say Ryan is equal to Rodgers or anything like that. I think Rodgers IS a better player. But I don't think it's because of his leadership (which i think is probably meh given his personality) or anything like that. I just think he's a better athlete and it gives him an edge. He also has a ******* brick wall for an OL.

Another thing perhaps underappreciated is the fact that aside from any given QB's surroundings, any QB's failure/success also comes as a result of his interaction with the other team.....another full set of circumstances that affect the outcome. I mean, Brady lead the Pats to a scoring drive with two minutes left in 07. And then David Tyree, some dude no one had ever heard of or has heard of since did his thing. Brady went home a loser.

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I find it interesting that a rabid falcon fan like yourself doesn't rank his fav team's QB among his Top 15 fav QBs although said QB is clearly among top QBs in performance.

Not calling you out here at all, more just picking your brain. and I do get you are a defense guy who thinks QBs are overrated.

Its not that hard. I love the Walking Dead...I have not liked every plot line.

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Thanks man. I like having this discussion because it's pretty fundamental to how I view the game in general.

But if randomness were unacceptable, wouldnt Rodgers have won in Seattle last year? I mean holy ****....how many chances did Wilson give him? 4 turnovers? Wouldnt Brady have won at least one of those Giants SBs?

A QB only controls so much. To the fullest extent of what that means, I won't say Ryan is equal to Rodgers or anything like that. I think Rodgers IS a better player. But I don't think it's because of his leadership (which i think is probably meh given his personality) or anything like that. I just think he's a better athlete and it gives him an edge. He also has a ******* brick wall for an OL.

Another thing perhaps underappreciated is the fact that aside from any given QB's surroundings, any QB's failure/success also comes as a result of his interaction with the other team.....another full set of circumstances that affect the outcome. I mean, Brady lead the Pats to a scoring drive with two minutes left in 07. And then David Tyree, some dude no one had ever heard of or has heard of since did his thing. Brady went home a loser.

Yeah, randomness does come into play into individual games, I did not intend to insinuate it didn't, but more of a stretch to put that to an entire season. All teams face adversity, NE faced plenty early last year as well in week prior to super bowl, as do all champions. But they found a way.

The only one game I think that point I'm trying to make with Matt on was the San Fran playoff game at home. He played a technically great game. We should not have lost that game, we should have found a way to win it, but we took our foot off the pedal. SF IMHO just wanted it more than we did, that was not due to randomness.

And yes, that all comes back to coaching, but a QB Leader has a say so in that as well. If he is indeed that leader. That's where I think there's room for Matt to grow.

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I think Ryan is good enough to get the Falcons a Lombardi (or two) if he is surrounded by a strong enough supporting cast of teammates. Football isn't like basketball or even to a lesser degree baseball where one hot player or superstar can carry you.

That's all that matters to me. The QB "rankings" are just bar stool and radio talk show fodder.

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I think Ryan is good enough to get the Falcons a Lombardi (or two) if he is surrounded by a strong enough supporting cast of teammates. Football isn't like basketball or even to a lesser degree baseball where one hot player or superstar can carry you.

That's all that matters to me. The QB "rankings" are just bar stool and radio talk show fodder.

Exactly the only point that matters. I was a Bulls fan before I turned the NBA off, I was a fan of Kukoc...yeah that long ago, but people didn't like him because he wasn't putting up MJ numbers. I never cared though...its not about like. Its about can he help us win?

Ryan was the best guy on our offense last year with Jones a near second. With more help on the O and D this year, we have a realistic chance to turn it around. My OPINION on rankings and other QB's I like mean absolutely nothing. I like other RB's, WR's, TE's, OL, DE's, DT's, LB's, and secondaries too. Do people care? No. Because they would rather have their QB listed in a top 10 than to have their TEAM top ten.

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Exactly the only point that matters. I was a Bulls fan before I turned the NBA off, I was a fan of Kukoc...yeah that long ago, but people didn't like him because he wasn't putting up MJ numbers. I never cared though...its not about like. Its about can he help us win?

Ryan was the best guy on our offense last year with Jones a near second. With more help on the O and D this year, we have a realistic chance to turn it around. My OPINION on rankings and other QB's I like mean absolutely nothing. I like other RB's, WR's, TE's, OL, DE's, DT's, LB's, and secondaries too. Do people care? No. Because they would rather have their QB listed in a top 10 than to have their TEAM top ten.

I think most fans want both. And frankly it's hard (not impossible, but hard especially in today's NFL) to have either without both.

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Thanks man. I like having this discussion because it's pretty fundamental to how I view the game in general.

But if randomness were unacceptable, wouldnt Rodgers have won in Seattle last year? I mean holy ****....how many chances did Wilson give him? 4 turnovers? Wouldnt Brady have won at least one of those Giants SBs?

A QB only controls so much. To the fullest extent of what that means, I won't say Ryan is equal to Rodgers or anything like that. I think Rodgers IS a better player. But I don't think it's because of his leadership (which i think is probably meh given his personality) or anything like that. I just think he's a better athlete and it gives him an edge. He also has a ******* brick wall for an OL.

Another thing perhaps underappreciated is the fact that aside from any given QB's surroundings, any QB's failure/success also comes as a result of his interaction with the other team.....another full set of circumstances that affect the outcome. I mean, Brady lead the Pats to a scoring drive with two minutes left in 07. And then David Tyree, some dude no one had ever heard of or has heard of since did his thing. Brady went home a loser.

nice... very valid points indeed.

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I think most fans want both. And frankly it's hard (not impossible, but hard especially in today's NFL) to have either without both.

Never cared for QB rankings. How do you rank them exactly?

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I wonder if anyone asked Brunnell what about Ryan. From that list I have a feeling that Brunnell just forgot about him.

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I wonder if anyone asked Brunnell what about Ryan. From that list I have a feeling that Brunnell just forgot about him.

From what I understand he got thrashed on Twitter after this. I don't go there much in the off season so I don't know if he ever responded.

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Never cared for QB rankings. How do you rank them exactly?

I'm not emotionally invested in the rankings like most are, but I do disagree the position is overrated. So much more put on QB both physically and mentally these days than other positions on the field, he's now the coach in the field as well as a player, and it's a beautiful thing to watch when it's done well.

I was a TE/receiver in college, QB was just one of 11/22 then, but much more expected of position now even in college game. A fascinating evolution to me. Much harder to win now without a top tier QB. I feel strongly we have one.

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I wonder if anyone asked Brunnell what about Ryan. From that list I have a feeling that Brunnell just forgot about him.

Me too.

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I'm not emotionally invested in the rankings like most are, but I do disagree the position is overrated. So much more put on QB both physically and mentally these days than other positions on the field, he's now the coach in the field as well as a player, and it's a beautiful thing to watch when it's done well.

I was a TE/receiver in college, QB was just one of 11/22 then, but much more expected of position now even in college game. A fascinating evolution to me. Much harder to win now without a top tier QB. I feel strongly we have one.

I am a defensive guy...I innately dislike QB's so they are overrated to me. Hence the part about "opinion".

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I am a defensive guy...I innately dislike QB's so they are overrated to me. Hence the part about "opinion".

I respect that. Likewise here on defense priority is a must. Starting with Julio trade, it was losing that focus that was the biggest reason team regressed past two seasons

Still doesn't answer my earlier question as to why you "like" 15 QBs more than ours though....

No worries....

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I wonder if anyone asked Brunnell what about Ryan. From that list I have a feeling that Brunnell just forgot about him.

I think that's probably what happened. Matt Ryan is consistent, business like in his approach which are qualities that don't stand out. He is a very good QB but 7 years into his career it feels like he has reached his ceiling. This does not mean he can't win with better pieces around him but I think lots of people felt he would turn into the next Peyton Manning and our overly critical because he may not get to that level.

The same thing happened to Phillip Rivers and Carson Palmer who were once was considered to be the next great thing and when things didn't play out like that he was heavily criticized and dropped on many QB ranking list.

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